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Thread: New Workshop Design and DE Plan
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20th May 2018, 02:27 PM #1Novice
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New Workshop Design and DE Plan
Hi All,
First of all, just wanted to say a big thanks to all the contributors. Have been reading solidly for a year or so and think I am understanding things a lot more. I have made renovation changes to ensure I can get the DE outside … which seemed to be the biggest single factor.
Attached .xls file shows new draft plan. Sorry, I don't know how to use CAD programs sorry. Be very keen for feedback on the DE system.
DE Design Factors
- Cost is an issue right now.
- This is for home DIY workshop use but reducing dust generation and spread is important (happy wife and health).
- I live in temperate Auckland, so replacing inside air with colder or warmer outside air is not really a problem. A little discomfort will save me lots of money anyway.
- I can raise garage door slightly (north side) or open door to airflow from under the house (south side). This gives me the option of replacement air from 2 directions. The key idea here is that I have the advantage of being able to create large fresh airflow without materially affecting comfort in the workshop (heat or cold). Climate and airflow has impacted my DE system design.
- Not enough room (or money) for a 4HP cyclone system. Plus, the noise would be a major issue.
- Cheap 3HP machines have double bags, so too big for my outside space. Fall back option is a 3-4HP machine at the far north end outside. Old require 14m of ducting plus bends. That is, a lot more expense.
- In summary, I know I will leave some dust behind at machine (due to slightly underpowered DE and only 5” at machines) but hopefully capture the really fine (and dangerous) dust by running powerful wall fan. This will likely leave some larger dust particles behind, but these are less dangerous to health and less likely to disperse into house.
Other Factors
- Low ceiling height (1.95 – 2.0m) so not feasible to run overhead lines with drop downs, other than around the wall ceiling corners.
- Roughly 7m x 5m (35sqm) and 70 CBM
- Prefer the dust generating activities down south end to minimise dust into garage to the north.
- Will utilise a Draft Workshop.xlsxDraft Workshop.xlsxbell mouth hood for sanding area as well as fan
DE PLAN
Hammer AF 14 (possibly an AF16)
Specs
- 1.1KW (1.5HP)
- Max. air flow rate 2350 m³/h (although this is likely grossly overstated).
- 140mm pipe (nearly 6')
- TS and P/T only have 140mm dust ports anyway.
- Will get wired to TS/Shaper and P/T machines. Auto start with delayed on/off,
Placement and Ducting
- Outside W/S in sound protected shed (thanks BobL).
- About a 3m fixed pipe run into shed on the floor. Gradual curves.
- At termination end, there will be a ~1-1.5m flexi than can connect to TS/Shaper, P/T, bandsaw and Drop saw.
- Will have to move the flexi as I change machine use. Not a major as machines grouped and won’t be too different from pulling a blast gate.
Squirrel Cage Fan
DE INDUSTRIAL CENTRIFUGAL FAN
Specs
- Squirrel cage fan. Have gone for squirrel vs. wall fan as it is supposedly quieter.
- 1,400 RPM
- 0.75KW
- Stated 2,800 CMH. Reality probably 1,500 CMH (1,000 CFM)
Placement and other
- Auto start and stop with TS/Shaper and P/T and maybe Bandsaw.
- Main dust generating machines/activities with in 3m (excl drop saw). Right above sanding bench.
- Every now an again would get a blower going in workshop and put fan on for 30mins.
All feedback would be most welcome. i am very open minded to changes and want to get it as right as I can.
Cheers
Elliot
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20th May 2018 02:27 PM # ADSGoogle Adsense Advertisement
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20th May 2018, 03:17 PM #2.
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Too many things to comment on given I have to rush off - just a couple to get you started.
I haven't tested a new squirrel cage fan for some time (the two in my shed are over 20 years old) but most squirrel cage fans actually come close to their flow specification.
- About a 3m fixed pipe run into shed on the floor. Gradual curves.
- At termination end, there will be a ~1-1.5m flexi than can connect to TS/Shaper, P/T, bandsaw and Drop saw.
- Auto start and stop with TS/Shaper and P/T and maybe Bandsaw.
- Main dust generating machines/activities with in 3m (excl drop saw). Right above sanding bench.
- Every now an again would get a blower going in workshop and put fan on for 30mins.
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21st May 2018, 07:31 AM #3Novice
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Thanks Bob.
I think I can reduce the flexi by adding a 200mm 'flexi joint' further back by wall. also having a separate attachment for planer mode. The TS/Shaper and Thicknesser would all require very little flexi then.
Yeah need to think through the fan a bit more. Want it to crank up when DE is on and then reduce afterwards until turned off. Thereby the noise issue should be limited to small bursts.
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21st May 2018, 07:42 AM #4.
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With a 70 Cubic metre shed, and a 2800 cubic metres per hour ventilation = 40 room changes per hour which is
The 140 mm ports are a PITA to deal with as there is no readily available 140 mm ducting material unless you make your own.
I would suggest installing 6" ducting anyway but with using a smaller DC there is a risk of air speeds inside teh duct being too low and sedimentation of sawdust inside teh ducting.
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21st May 2018, 09:07 AM #5Novice
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Good to know I have got one thing nailed down!
The DE is a pain alright. You convinced me ages ago that I needed to get my DE outside, so have don a lot of reno changes (and wife sweet talking) to achieve this. The downside is the outdoor spot is quite small. certainly wont fit a 2 bagger DE. The Felder RF 14 and 16 have the most grunt for their size, good shape and outlet configuration for my small space. The RF16 wold be perfect but it it NZ$2000 vs $1,100 for the RF14. The RF16 would also be oversized really if not running blast gate set up.
As you have figured out though the RF14 could struggle to pull through a 6" pipe. my biggest risk. I am hoping that the flat layout, large radius curves and minimised flexi can overcome this. I think 140mm galvanised pipe can be bought, although this would be a pain to tiptoe around. Maybe I just buy some extra sacrificial lengths than can be replaced. Will try the 6" ducting first though i think.
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