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  1. #16
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    Default

    Hi Aney

    as a means of displaying your skill as a dovetailer and drawer builder, that's a pretty good cabinet

    but you asked for feedback

    • at 400mm I think it's maybe 100 too deep -- stuff will get lost at the back of the upper portion or there will be a lot of unused volume within the finished cabinet. In respect to your portfolio, think about how easy it will be to reach into the cabinet if it is hanging on the wall behind a standard depth bench
    • The complexity of the internal layout leads me to suspect that you will struggle to finish the piece within the time available
    • you need to decide if the cabinet is utilitarian tool storage or a piece of "furniture" which displays to potential customers your skills
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

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  3. #17
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    Jun 2012
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    nowra
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    Default

    Thanks Ian for replying was under the impression no might seeing it's been a while

    With regards with it being 400 deep the doors(100mm)+sides(300mm) and the bottom are only that deep the sides and top are 300 deep so I've talked over with dad before i posted this and I'll talk to my teachers at school about it today but at this point I'm under the impression that it should work (also a good point)

    you made a good point about the standard bench depth but at the height that i think it works best at is about 800-850mm (so i can get to the planes in the bottom and don't have to get up on my tip toes to reach to stuff up the top) from ground to the bottom of the cabinet so i don't think that it would work hanging on a wall behind a bench(seeing that around bench height) and if i was to hang it behind a bench it would need to be small in height i think.

    that's one that I've been worrying about but my teacher and dad reckon i should be able to get it done if a use a dovetail jig (hopefully i get the Leigh one so i can do the variable spacing also the set up time be less of a percentage because i've got multiples of everything except 3 things (that was from an older comment) ) and also my time effectively

    well i think I'm going to use Australian red cedar(Caracas, door(excluding the panel) and draw fonts) sliver ash (shelves) and a veneer for the door panel covering ply so hopefully it should be part tool storage and part furniture after all the course that I'm doing is industrial technology timber and furniture (although you probably didn't know that)

    I'm sorry Ian if it seemed like i shut you down on your feedback their are some very insightful comments there and it has only been through long winded conversation with teachers, my dad and my pop that i was able to able to come up with response without really doing any research so thank you (i really did like the comment about the bench hadn't though of that)

    do you think i should make a stand for it to go on not sure because of time and also money and what veneer would you possibly use for the doors (thinking that i don't really want to change the colour when picking the finish(clear coat))

    also before i glue the Caracas what do you think i should do for prep work for finishing and is there such thing as a pre-finish becasue i think it's going to be hard to get it smooth and ready for finishing if i don't

    (anyone can answer the question's)

  4. #18
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    No worries Aney

    In part I'm trying to avoid providing a direct answer as you will learn more and possibly score better with your portfolio if you work out the answer for yoursef. Remember my earlier comment about drawing your own plans rather than following bought plans?

    in terms of the dimensions you have designed, you might say --
    "I intend building a cabinet that can hang on the wall behind a work bench
    "Here is my first design.
    "I used a piece of chalk to sketck it's basic shape on teh wall behind my bench
    "Having done this I found I couldn't reach the top row of tools without standing on tip toes and really stretching
    "I then reconsidered where the cabinet could be positioned
    a) beside my bench at a lower height, or
    b) on a separate stand
    I decided on ... because ... "


    take a really good hard look at how long the cabinet might take to build

    timber choice?
    I'd be thinking Hoop Pine before Aust Red Cedar
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  5. #19
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    Jun 2012
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    nowra
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    Unhappy

    hi i got my wood from my pop. who had some nice wide boards of kalantis (basically Australian red cedar) but i had to cut them in really rough sizes to get them to school and now one half of one board is really pretty deformed and was wondering if anybody had any ways of un-warping it my teacher recons the rollers on the thicknesser may flatten it as i put it through but no grantees and it a nice board to waste. another thing that i thought of with a bit of help form my dad was to change the through mortise and tenon into a sliding dovetail to pull the board squarer in constuction but i still need to get it thicknessed to size. any ideas

  6. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by aney View Post
    hi i got my wood from my pop. who had some nice wide boards of kalantis (basically Australian red cedar) but i had to cut them in really rough sizes to get them to school and now one half of one board is really pretty deformed and was wondering if anybody had any ways of un-warping it
    my teacher recons the rollers on the thicknesser may flatten it as i put it through but no grantees and it a nice board to waste.
    another thing that i thought of with a bit of help form my dad was to change the through mortise and tenon into a sliding dovetail to pull the board squarer in constuction but i still need to get it thicknessed to size. any ideas
    Hi again aney

    firstly have you marked out which board will be used for which part of your cabinet?

    I don't think the thicknesser will do much for your warped board other than turn it into lots of chips and a thin warped board. You might be able to recut the warped board and use it for the drawer fronts

    Have your boards been across the jointer to get one face flat and one edge square? This should be your first step.

    in terms of pulling the board flat -- a through mortice and tenon will be as effective as a sliding dovetail and a whole lot easier to make

    do you have photos of your boards with markings showing which one goes where?
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  7. #21
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    Default

    i did have them marked but most of them are gone after i thicknessed some of the smaller ones at home and other then that the bigger boards i know where they are going it just the smaller ones that lost there marks but they are pretty easy to work out seeing i cut them to a rough width. . yeah as i said i got all the boards form my pops and i kind of feel bad graping another wide one after all it probably would have cost close to 2 grand if i got it from a store and dressed all round so that is why i don't really want to turn it into draw fronts if i can avoid but I'll see how it goes and the sliding dovetail shouldn't be to hard if i get the liegh dovetail jig but as yo siad with the through mortise and tenon should be pretty easy and no i don't have any photo's as of yet of the marking out but as i said shouldn't be to hard to work out

  8. #22
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    Jun 2012
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    nowra
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    Default update

    hi I've staring working on the tool cabinet now and was just going to do an update
    so I've done a couple of practice dovetails with he jig, i thicknessed the other carcase boards and just ended up plane downing the warped board as the jig un-warps the board when you put it in the clamping system. At the moment I've had no real problems with anything, although i have to watch how much time I'm spending on some things as i might end up rushing towards the end to get things done but other then that everything is going well. I'll also attach a practice of what the carcase dovetail joints will look like comment on them as i still have time to change them. I'd also like to ask a question i'm doing a through mortise and tenon joint for one of the shelves and was just wondering what peoples preferences on whether they would make it flush or would having it protruding like in the pictures on the previous page i still haven't made up my mind and once I've done the dovetails that is the next thing to do.

    thanks aney
    Attached Images Attached Images

  9. #23
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    Default

    just another quick update

    so i have cut the dovetails although i did have a bit of a problem with the warped board but that got fixed up when i clamped and glued it altogether. i have also cut the through mortises and tenons they came out a bit ugly so i have though of a couple of ways of hiding them. like putting down a thin rubber mat to hide the worst of the mistakes on the inside and saying it's there for protection of the tools and also to hide the mistakes and maybe capping the outside of the tenon and saying i didn't like the contrast on the outside.(because i decided to have it protrude not flush).

    i did have a couple of problems with the glue up as i decided to use a polyurethane glue because of the warped as it has a stronger bond and i though it might help but it wanted the job to be clamped within ten minutes of the application of glue so i was rushing around trying to get it glued up within that time and clamped not really realising that i got some on my hands (ps wear gloves when using a polyurethane glue make it a lot easier to clean hands afterward learned that the hard way) then put my hands on the job so now i've got little finger prints all over it and some in pretty hard places to clean up anyone got any ideas on how to clean it up easily (it's also chemical resistant according to the bottle). then because the woodwork room got flooded the day before and the clamps had been sitting on the floor they had surface rust on them so i was running round trying to find paper to but under them to stop it going on to the wood and leaving\ marks. so i guess the moral is be really organised before glue up
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  10. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by aney View Post
    hi I've staring working on the tool cabinet now and was just going to do an update
    so I've done a couple of practice dovetails with he jig,
    aney

    I'm curious where your practice DT piece would go in the finished cabinet
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  11. #25
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    Default

    sorry Ian ( and thanks for the reply) I'm not quiet sure what you are asking are you asking if I'm going to display it for the marking or if it is a part of the actual job. I'm thinking it is if I'm going to display it and i probably won't depends if i need those bits some where else (incase of mistakes) but i will definitely make mention of it in the portfolio. or are you asking where those dovetails go in the job if that's it then they are the carcase joints of the cabinet. you can just make them out in one of the previous photos in my last post.

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by aney View Post
    sorry Ian ( and thanks for the reply) I'm not quiet sure what you are asking are you asking if I'm going to display it for the marking or if it is a part of the actual job. I'm thinking it is if I'm going to display it and i probably won't depends if i need those bits some where else (incase of mistakes) but i will definitely make mention of it in the portfolio. or are you asking where those dovetails go in the job if that's it then they are the carcase joints of the cabinet. you can just make them out in one of the previous photos in my last post.
    Hi Aney

    what caught my eye was the apparent length to width ratio of your trial dovetail joint
    https://www.woodworkforums.com/attach...2-05-14.58.jpg
    although I can see that the grain runs in the right direction, for constructions like your tool cabinet, I'm used to seeing the dovetails on the shorter side of a piece with an aspect ratio like you've displayed.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    regards from Alberta, Canada

    ian

  13. #27
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    Default

    as i said it was just a trial. I used the scrap from the actual boards that i used in the carcase as it allowed me to set up the jig. then route all the carcase dovetails because the boards were then the same thickness. The kalantis costs a fair bit and everying thing worked out in the end so no real worries. thanks for the reply ian much appreciated

  14. #28
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    Default update

    so on the weekend i got my back pieces for the cabinet cut to size and also put in the rebate to join both together and on Friday i routered the rebate in the back of the carcase for the back ( the slots in the back are the tool hanging slots as seen issue 71 of Australian woodsmith). as i have changed the design slightly compared to the cad drawings i put up so next I'm going to put the draws and plane till in a kind of box so later on if i don't like the lay out i can take out the 'inset' and change it then put a new one in if i need or want to.
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  15. #29
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    Default another update

    hi
    so i've started making the insert i have cut the rebates and all the dado's for it and now I've got to start making the shelves for the draws. for the dado's i have attached a picture of how i did it. so i got a straight edge clamp that i think my dad picked up from carbatec (i think it is meant for cutting plywood). i also had a scrap bit of plywood from the back i then put the straight edge clamp on the plywood and put the router bit i was going to use to cut the dado in the router set the depth so that i would cut all the way through the plywood. this gave me the off set of the bit and also mad it easier as i could run the edge up to the mark out line and then just cut instead of having to measure the offset, a longer run area for the router base so it didn't tip as i came off the edge (i have a bad habit of doing that), the clamp gave me a straight edge to run the router along.
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  16. #30
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    Default update

    So i haven't posted on here as much as i would have liked but heres an update since last time.

    i've finished making the shelves for the insert, glued the insert and the shelves into the carcass i wasn't going to originally going to do this but was wasting to much time trying to make it slide in and out and there were some pretty big gaps forming. i put in the draw dividers in using glue and nails. i cut and then dovetailed (using the Leigh dr4 pro jig) the draws i haven't fitted the backs (just going to be a housing joint) yet or cut the plywood bottoms. i put a banding or trim around the front of the insert to cover those gaps i was talking about earlier. i've cut and shaped the plane dividers, i cut off the through tenon bit that was sticking through the sides it was just to much of a hassle i kept bumping it and it was annoying to have to sand around. i've cut and then dovetailed the doors (again using the jig) i rebated the fronts so i could put the plywood in for the tool hanging and glued them in

    what i've got left to do in 14 days (with other school assessments and the portfolio to finish)

    cut the backs and bottom for the draws then glue them together
    glue in the plywood backs
    hang the doors
    make a frame for the doors to hide the join between the door frame and the plywood
    sand (almost everything)

    luckily i don't have to apply a finish by then it's the school assessment but they don't want us making dust after the 14 days

    i'll attach a picture of what it kind of looks like now
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