Thread: Getting a better Energy deal - WHAT A JOKE!

Originally Posted by poundy

I don't think that's actually correct these days. Several of the posts in this thread talk about salt storage and there are many farms with salt storage around the world.

From my understanding, molten salt storage is only used on solar thermal power plants, not PV. The loses to convert electricity from PV into heat to melt the salts, then to produce steam to drive a turbine to power a generator are too great to make it viable. If any large scale energy storage system was fiancially viable you could bet that the companies investing in wind & PV solar plants would be installing them so that they could store power produced in low demand times so they could sell it at a higher price in peak times.

Originally Posted by Beardy

The BASIX requirements you are required to meet for a new home are pretty good at making an energy efficient home and then some people take that a step further but Even at the minimum basic build they are miles ahead of older homes. Even the old full brick homes that people think are good are behind your modern basic project home for energy efficiency

Australian houses are brick veneer tents with damn all thought put into thermal efficiency for heating or cooling.

Originally Posted by Chris Parks

Australian houses are brick veneer tents with damn all thought put into thermal efficiency for heating or cooling.

The older ones I agree but ones built in the last 10 or so years don’t go too bad but would be better if the didn’t brick them and used a cladding instead.
Reverse brick veneer would be better again but affordability starts to creep in. Cost starts to become the juggling point chasing a diminishing return

Originally Posted by 62woollybugger

From my understanding, molten salt storage is only used on solar thermal power plants, not PV. The loses to convert electricity from PV into heat to melt the salts, then to produce steam to drive a turbine to power a generator are too great to make it viable. If any large scale energy storage system was fiancially viable you could bet that the companies investing in wind & PV solar plants would be installing them so that they could store power produced in low demand times so they could sell it at a higher price in peak times.

which just means more production of the solar thermal during the day goes into storage rather than consumed with base load that gets mopped up by home PV.

Article just out

https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wor...-ng-b88986358z

In the news today (too much solar power for Victoria's system )
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-...arket/10405210

We really do need our Fed, State and Local Govts to start talking to each other about power. WOULDN'T THAT BE GOOD!! We might actually get somewhere fast, and start leading the world like we should be (with our sunlight resources to make use of)

Heh heh, I can see it now:

The Department of Power

Idiot politicians will be falling over themselves to get that portfolio.

Remember that? That's where we were a year or so ago - not that I object at all to the direction that the discussion has gone - very enlightening.

Well guess what? It's a year later and Origin are saying that some of my discounts are going to expire. They reckon that the Gas discount of 20% has to come down to 17%, and electrickery has to come down from 28% to 21%.

JOHN ELLIOT RESPONSE TO THAT!

Now Origin are a bit smarter about these things than AGL. The avid reader of this thread will recall that it took me something like 53 phone calls to get it all sorted out last year, and only after tremendous cockups by AGL. In the end I said to Origin "why don't you just put me through to your retention team, and we can save each other's time?".

So they did.

That's how I got what appear to be excellent discounts.

Today I had to talk to Origin about another matter, and "Steph" happened to say that one of the discounts was about to drop off, blah blah as described in the 2nd para above. I suggested that she tell her manager that this was going to be another giant waste of time for both parties dancing around to the same old tune. Her manager said she could put me through to retention. They called me back 5 minutes later, plans extended for another 12 months. I congratulated her on reducing last year's mammoth 53 phone calls to just 2 this time, and that next year, because I am going to make a diary note to call her directly in the first week of October, the phone calls will reduce by another 50% and we'll do it in one call.

Still took an hour of my time though.

Even though Origin are a bit smarter about it than AGL, they still try it on. They're trying to tell me that the discounts I am on are loss making for them.

Another John Elliot response!

Why the hell would they be bothered giving me a loss making discount just so I don't leave? It is not logical Captain!

They may not be making very much out of me, but there is no way they would subsidise my bills just so I don't leave - I'm just not quite that likeable!

AGL installed a smart meter for us (???) in September. No mention of any tariff changes leading up to the change, but no sooner is it in and they send me an email with new peak, shoulder and off-peak prices that made my eyes water (and my blood heat up to uncomfortable levels). The peak and shoulder rates were only 1c per kwh different and were 24% more than the previous general usage tariff. Guess what discount we were on - yeah that's right 24%. To rub salt in to the wound the email started, " We recently reviewed your account and found that the pricing originally quoted for your energy plan at....... was incorrect." Naturally I looked around for a better deal, and found one. Once AGL realise we're leaving they come back to us with a 32% discount, which results in an almost identical bill to the new supplier.

I hate all this sort of c#$p! None of these companies are worthy of our custom, but most of us have to use someone. Why is it so much more viable for them to get a new customer than to keep an old one? We'd been with AGL for about 5 years. Maybe if enough people leave and tell them why they'll finally get it.

I look back on the days of the Sydney County Council and think how good we had it. The price was what it was and this is how much you owe us.

About 6 months after I had the house retired and a new meter fitted, AGL sent me a letter to say they were going to install a Smart Meter. I rang thrm up and asked why. They said it was so the meter could be read without coming on the property. They were very cagey when I asked about various changing charges at various times so I said - “no thanks, I don’t want the meter. Mine was only replaced 6/months ago.” . They said “O/K we won’t fit one”. So obviously there is a choice as to whether one will be fitted or not - as far as AGL goes.

On another note, there was a guy from the Electricity industry in Victoria on TV last night talking about the large take up of solar panels in Victoria.
He stated that the existing electricity supply infrastructure was reaching a point where it wouldn’t be able to cope with the amount of electricity being generated by solar panels during the day when demands were low.

Originally Posted by Lappa

On another note, there was a guy from the Electricity industry in Victoria on TV last night talking about the large take up of solar panels in Victoria.
He stated that the existing electricity supply infrastructure was reaching a point where it wouldn’t be able to cope with the amount of electricity being generated by solar panels during the day when demands were low.

Lappa

This has been the cry from the detractors for some time. There is the potential for more power to be going out than was ever designed to come in. However installations have to be "approved" and I presume that the level of solar for any given location is taken into account.

The other issue is that our single phase supply is taken from one of the three phases available and there is also the potential for another imbalance. However that is also true for incoming power. To my mind the increasing level of solar power should all be allowed for as and when upgrades take place. This should be an ongoing issue. Take any street in the country and the demand today is vastly increased to, say, fifty years ago. The incidence of appliances, air conditioners and other electrical devices has increased out of all proportion. So it is with the increase in solar installations. It is ludicrous to state that solar is a problem because the infrastructure is inadequate. (I appreciate the Electricity guy may have been stating the existing situation rather than detracting). The Electricity distributors have to wake up, acknowledge that the nature of electrical generation is changing, do their share and provide for the future.

I have to say that if all this was still in the hands of the governments and not private enterprise it may be less of an issue. Private enterprise just sees such things eating into their profits. I can see why a private enterprise is not receptive to such change at their expense but it also demonstrates why public utilities (electricity, gas and water) should not be in the hands of private enterprise .

Regards
Paul

You would like to think that it would be better if it was still in government hands but when you look st other public services and infrastructure they run I am not so confident.