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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by L.S.Barker1970 View Post
    What, like this one Jack ?
    Glad your here buddy, its been a while between drinks/or posts...
    Still on the red cap ? your weather should be warming up for it pretty soon.



    Melbourne Matty.
    OK that's awesome . Look at those legs . Do we have a list of the K range . It's my understanding that this was developed for the aircraft industry . How old is that cut Matty . By the way your gong go love that RS henny found for all you . Vann brought up some unresolved issues with the third letter designation on the course we seem to just regurgitate same information over and over of course there are listings of the letters in the catalogues . But often wondered if some of the third letter designations didn't indicate other factories such as I mentioned BTH . It clearly states in the RT catalogue their special relationship with a well-known manufacture of course we know that to be BTH
    All tools can be used as hammers

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  3. #32
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    Jack, its from the 1927 catalog
    Missing some pages so I don't have the full line up, as far as I can work out its just the KH 6 and 8 inch, the RS is in there too, that was the first of the electric motor driven lathes.

    Melbourne Matty

  4. #33
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    Sep 2008
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    Petone, NZ
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgforsberg View Post
    Vann brought up some unresolved issues with the third letter designation on the course we seem to just regurgitate same information over and over...
    Err... yeah. Sorry about that. But you have to educate the newcomers like me.

    I've struck the same thing in the hand tool sub-forums where every other week a newbie will ask about buying a new Stanley plane...

    Quote Originally Posted by jgforsberg View Post
    ...But often wondered if some of the third letter designations didn't indicate other factories such as I mentioned BTH . It clearly states in the RT catalogue their special relationship with a well-known manufacture of course we know that to be BTH
    That went over my head, first reading. I thought British Thompson Houston made electric motors. Are you suggesting they may have manufactured complete machines?

    Cheers, Vann.
    Gatherer of rusty planes tools...
    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club .

  5. #34
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    Sep 2008
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    Default Operational Questions

    Please help a newbie to woodlathes.

    Two questions on how the lathe works.

    1) To remove the live centre from the tailstock. The cattledog cuts Matty posted (and the RS catalogue cuts online) state "The centres are self-discharging". I take this to mean that if I back the tailstock poppet back as far as it will go, it will eject the live-centre? I've backed the poppet most of the way, but it gets very tight towards the end - and I wondered if that was because of the dings in the poppet

    aRTA22.jpg Poppet extended the other way, showing the scars of many years of abuse by careless students

    2) The switch panel.

    ab1.jpg Rotary switch, left; "On/Off" pushbuttons, right

    There are two "Off" positions; one on the speed control rotary switch; and one on the "On/Off" pushbutton switch.
    I would assume that to operate the lathe I switch on at the push button, and then use the rotary switch to select "High" or "Low" speed, or "Off" if I want to adjust something? Is it okay to use the rotary switch at all, while the motor is running?

    Or do I have to select the speed first, and then use the "On" pushbutton to start the spindle turning? The layout of the switches, with the pushbuttons nearest to the operator, would suggest the "Off" pushbutton should be the primary switch for stopping the motor.

    I have no experience with vintage two speed motors, and really don't want to blow it up .

    Cheers, Vann.
    Gatherer of rusty planes tools...
    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club .

  6. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vann View Post
    Err... yeah. Sorry about that. But you have to educate the newcomers like me.



    Cheers, Vann.
    Not a problem at all Vann it's just that you're so thorough You make us old veterans work hard. Hey we sometimes forget how much fun it is to discover all that kind of silly stuff . But I probably forgive you if you put together a K-line list .

    So you got electrical problems . I'm not too bad with the old electrons so I can tell you what you Got. I will bet that's wired as so but you'll have to show me a couple pictures of the interior . Big knobby thing is what's called in the electronic world the drums switch . That's going to have six motor leads wired to it . The centre position is a stop switch (2 more wires)that will be wired in series With your control stop switch so that when you switch between Motor speeds on the fly it drops out your contacter . The control on off switch is a magnetic switch switching the line power . Control switches are wired three wire .

    Dawning my helmet waiting for incoming
    All tools can be used as hammers

  7. #36
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    OK addressing the BTH building of machines . BTH was certainly capable as they build some pretty massive stuff but that was not the arrangement with Wadkin at least in regards to some of the direct drive components like the PK motor which clearly states on there Motor tag that only the stators were built by BTH . So the arrangement was for wadkin to make the spindles and BTH to build a motor around it with in the confines And work together to build direct drive machines . Wadkin continue this relationship with Brooks motors as well in fact most of Wadkin machines have keywayed rotors in all their motors . By about the 50s wadkin motors are in the store room with much little about BTH . the motor stador castings made by BTH were moulded into the machine like the RT and CC CD . So in that way BTH was a direct Partner in the formation of the machine . This was quite revolutionary and it is said that wadkin were one of the first to pursue this Avenue of motor drive machine and we're following the American model .
    All tools can be used as hammers

  8. #37
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    Default Incoming

    Quote Originally Posted by jgforsberg View Post
    Not a problem at all Vann it's just that you're so thorough You make us old veterans work hard. Hey we sometimes forget how much fun it is to discover all that kind of silly stuff . But I probably forgive you if you put together a K-line list .
    You do know I own no catalogues at all? None, Zilch, Nada, Bugger-all. If I have to use catalogues to make a K-line list, I'll never be forgiven

    Quote Originally Posted by jgforsberg
    So you got electrical problems . I'm not too bad with the old electrons so I can tell you what you Got. I will bet that's wired as so but you'll have to show me a couple pictures of the interior . Big knobby thing is what's called in the electronic world the drums switch . That's going to have six motor leads wired to it . The centre position is a stop switch (2 more wires)that will be wired in series With your control stop switch so that when you switch between Motor speeds on the fly it drops out your contacter .
    Thanks for the explanation. going with your explanation - especially the bit about the centre position dropping out the contactor - I put the power on again tonight and tried the rotary switch. Bingo! When I moved the switch to the centre ("Off") position the contactor dropped out.

    So now I understand how this thing operates - select speed required and press "On" button. To change speeds or stop the spindle, either the "Off" pushbutton or the "Off" position of the drum switch will drop out the contactor. And the operator cannot change from one speed to the other without the contactor dropping out.

    A big THANK-YOU Jack. You've cleared up one of my queries .

    I don't know if this picture is enough for you. I might remove the switch from the machine tomorrow while I have the other one out.

    aRTA23.jpg Big knobbly thing (alias "drum switch")

    Quote Originally Posted by jgforsberg
    The control on off switch is a magnetic switch switching the line power . Control switches are wired three wire .
    aRTA24.jpg Control on off magnetic switch (alias "contactor")

    Above photo: Power in: red, white & blue phase wires and green earth wire at the top. Power out: 3 x red wires (I might do something about that). I'm guessing the purple wires are from the central ("Off") position on the drum switch, to drop out the contactor.

    The "Off" pushbutton doesn't work. In fact it doesn't move at all. I suspect a mechanical problem, not an electrical one. I'll remove this switch in the morning and see if I can spot the problem (what's jamming the "Off" switch).

    Cheers, Vann.
    Gatherer of rusty planes tools...
    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club .

  9. #38
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    Vann, l just read that your lathe is a wadkin/bursgreen BZL lathe.
    Interesting .....

  10. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by L.S.Barker1970 View Post
    Vann, l just read that your lathe is a wadkin/bursgreen BZL lathe.
    Interesting .....
    Yeah, I think he's got that a bit wrong . I'm just looking through Bursgreen cattledogs on VM now - researching an answer.

    Cheers, Vann.
    Gatherer of rusty planes tools...
    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club .

  11. #40
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    Yes, I'm looking at mine now, he's a long way of I think !
    Its nice he's had a go at least, nothing worse than posting with no responses.

    Melbourne Matty

  12. #41
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    I've posted a reply.

    For anybody who's wondering what we're on about - a guy on OWWM suggested my lathe is a BZL (I didn't mean to start a thread on OWWM - just commented on someone else's thread on how far I'd driven to pick up my lathe - next thing I know they've started a new thread for me ).

    Cheers, Vann.
    Gatherer of rusty planes tools...
    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club .

  13. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vann View Post
    I've posted a reply.

    For anybody who's wondering what we're on about - a guy on OWWM suggested my lathe is a BZL (I didn't mean to start a thread on OWWM - just commented on someone else's thread on how far I'd driven to pick up my lathe - next thing I know they've started a new thread for me ).

    Cheers, Vann.
    Ron Kellson is a good lad . In fact I found that bursgreen lathe for him($50). he lives in Ottawa and I talked him into getting It . Hell Wadkin got such a large range I don't even know all the machines. Really I think his remark Vann was about yours being the smallest lathe wadkin ever made and in that regard he was correct .

    All warm beer jokes aside vann your electrical system is exactly as I stated . I suspect those cloth covered leads come right out of the motor . I would get some shrink tubing insulation and go back in as far as you can to the pecker head . Those old leads can get pretty brutal and the shrinkwrap is an excellent repair . The old motor leads on English machines at least in my country were labelled ABC so it's a good idea to keep those arranged and labelled so you don't mix up the two separate motor leads . Really all English electrical is utterly fantastic but does require cleaning . Just remember that stop contacts are normally closed making a circuit and start switches are normally open until you press them to make a circuit . There's probably contacts within the black bakilite discs as it looks like they rotate and engage each motor windings off the Orange feed wires .
    All tools can be used as hammers

  14. #43
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    Default Fixed (I hope)

    I pulled the push button switch out this morning...

    aRTA27.jpg
    ...and found the problem with the "Off push button - it was something I'd done (so the less said about that the better ). It now appears to function correctly, but I didn't have time to re-install it before heading off for work. Hopefully tomorrow. Also couldn't find my heat gun for the heatshrink - for the cloth insulated leads.

    Jack - recognise these?

    aRTA28.jpg aRTA29.jpg

    The one on the left is the one currently on it's way to you (ex-BCK), while the one on the right is off my RT. They're identical (even down to the number cast in the back, so off the same pattern). I'm just sorry that yours didn't have the switches still attached (not as sorry as I'd be if it did have the switches attached, and my RTA switch was munted, and I'd given it away ).

    Cheers, Vann.
    Last edited by Vann; 13th April 2016 at 12:05 PM. Reason: Not enough time to do post before work, so put up photos from home, did text from work.
    Gatherer of rusty planes tools...
    Proud member of the Wadkin Blockhead Club .

  15. #44
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    Jack,

    It's Vann, I have no idea why but I seem to have been logged in under Camoz (probably a glitch, which I am sure will be corrected as soon as I post the K list you were looking for).

    K.H. Wood Turning Lathe
    K.G. Capstan Wood Trimmers
    K.E. Automatic Propeller Shaper
    K.F. Universal Propeller Vice
    K.T. Hand Feed Jointer

    Cheers,

    Camo.....oops I mean Vann, yes it's definitely Vann, now please forgive me

  16. #45
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    Vann,

    Loving seeing more of your RTA, oh and great work on getting that K list together (boy that was strange how you got logged in under me, thanks for logging out again after making your post for Jack).

    Quote Originally Posted by jgforsberg View Post
    It's been unclear whether the PJ had an AC motor or DC and certainly some if not all of John McDougall's early examples were DC motor driven.
    I'm curious about what you have said here, as my understanding was the PJ came out with either pulley drive or motor drive mounted on the floor or below the floor level, not a direct drive setup. The PJ was the double dimension saw, just in case you meant the PL? On the subject of DC motors, the PK had the option for a DC motor, so if you did mean the PL, I could imagine that PL's would have had the option for DC. As you know these machines would have been stamped ##D.

    Cheers,

    Camo

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