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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Sydney
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    16

    Default Fast-cure Filler alternatives

    On the weekend I had to get some paint primer down onto cabin-top gelcoat asap to ensure the primer dries before sundown (boat on water).
    The day before I had filled dozens of under-10mm screw holes with my epoxy mix filler.

    So, after sanding, there I am needing to "top-up" a number of patches and imperfections (up to 3mm deep) with filler, and I need it to set quick so I can sand and paint within the hour otherwise it has to wait until next weekend.

    Don't particularly like polyester filler, especially since I'm applying it over 14h old Epoxy filler.
    So, I tried 15-minute epoxy (quite expensive, USA made, 250ml from hobby shop). Mixed in some filler powder, and applied.

    Big disappointment - it set soon enough, but after an hour it was still rubbery to the touch (instantly clogging sandpaper). After three hours still not sandable, so it ruined my day.

    So, I've done a quick search on the forum but did not get useful hits (other than a good caution from PAR that Plastibond tends to fall out with vibration).

    What are the options for a fast-cure filler that would be sandable within 60mins max (non-structural, above-waterline and filling areas of less than 10 x 10mm, possibly over cured epoxy)?

    a) Quick-set Epoxy:
    As mentioned above, quick-set Epoxy did not work for me (stays rubbery). Maybe there is a specific brand(s) of quick-set epoxy that quickly sets hard and sandable?

    b) Epoxy putty sticks:
    Very little work time, and quite stiff (can't smear it).

    c) Quick-set Epoxy Creams: No experience of (keen to hear of some).

    d) House painter fillers:
    One-pack fillers in a tube used by house painters - for example Nordsjo. Sets fairly quickly, but I would expect not relevant on flexing boats.

    e) Polyester fillers: Do they all perform essentially the same, or are there some higher quality products that adhere significantly better than the average builder's bog available from the hardware store? I don't believe the fibre-reinforced ones will stick any better.

    f) Any other options ....(one-pack, two-pack, pricey, imported, made at the south pole, anywhere - just sticks well and sandable in 60 mins)?

    Thanks
    Karsten
    (If this issue has been discussed at length, pls post link)

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Eustis, FL, USA
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    Use a thickened epoxy, preferably a fast cure, then post cure it with heat and very low humidity. The shallow depression you have shouldn't take very long, though the heat must be continuous, it doesn't have to be especially "hot". At about 50C you'll half the cure time of most normal and fast cure epoxies. At 65C you're cooking as fast as regular marine grade epoxies can cure. You can buy special epoxies, formulated to set fast, but at much higher the ambient temperatures (150C), as well as specialty adhesives that do the same. I have a powder that works this way. It's a slightly gummy powder until about 65C, then it goes liquid and flows, setting up in just minutes. These types of epoxies and adhesives are expensive and not typically available through retail outlets.

    The polyesters just don't stick very well to epoxy, so regardless of brand, you'll probably find them "circling out" fairly quickly.

    The handyman quick set epoxy tubes, sticks, creams and other assorted "hobbyist" formulations usually make huge sacrifices in physical properties, in order to get the quick, handy set. My exsperence with the sticks is they cure fast, underwater even, but often can't be mixed properly or in the correct ration for a complete cure (which sounds like your issue). Also they tend to be brittle or overly pliable.

    House painter's filler comes in two types: acrylic and polyester, both truly suck on a boat. Again they tend to be cakey and brittle. Their fine for filling a knot hole in a door jam on your front porch though.

    Sometimes you just have to wait. A bit like your first date with a girl you've been dieing to have. You got to pick them up, talk to the parents, pet her dog without getting bit, go to dinner, make meaningful small talk and only then can you consider how the rest of the evening might go.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    16

    Default

    Thank you for that, PAR, clearly advice coming from considerable experience. Seems my options are limited unless I can utilise heat.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Eustis, FL, USA
    Posts
    2,270

    Default

    I've found a tarp tent, with some space heaters under it can generate a surprising amount of heat. Now most of these type heaters have a thermal trip which kills them when the temperature reaches a certain point. I've removed or modified these in mine, but unless you have some electrical experience, you should leave these alone.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    5,773

    Default

    If the timber is already sealed and even undercoated and you have small shallow imperfections.

    Have a look ar automotive knife putty...you should get a tube from anu auto refinish suppiler.

    It is intended for filling small chips and imperfections found late in the finishing process.

    I have a tube of 3M product blue tube and it is red oxide colour and has a strong solvent smell.

    It dries up pretty damn hard and goes off reasonably quick especilly on a warm day an in thin section.

    it is a fairly stiff paste and as the name illudes you apply it with a knife or spatla.

    If you are carefull with it you can apply it pretty accurately to hasten drying and minimise sanding.

    And it does not seem to go off in the tube either.

    cheers
    Any thing with sharp teeth eats meat.
    Most powertools have sharp teeth.
    People are made of meat.
    Abrasives can be just as dangerous as a blade.....and 10 times more painfull.

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