Thread: Slippery slope?

Originally Posted by Caliban

I want a boat that can be car topped, used with a 6hp motor, rowed if necessary, can carry my wife and me and some fishing-picnic gear, doesn't need to win any races but does need to be dry, stable and not slam and bash like a punt does.
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Caliban, I have just re-read your OP and answered my question regarding use. I'd definitely go for the extra beam that. Passengers of the female persuasion generally don't like "tippy" boats (lol)

But as you are seeing, all choices are a compromise. The characteristics that make a boat a good rower are different to what makes her good under power. You'll need to trade one off for the other and think about how much you would row/power and what's your preference as this will dictate design parameters.

AD

from what I can see on the NSW Maritime site,if the vessel doesn't need to be registered-which means keeping to a design under 5.5m and 5hp or less would get around it? Please correct me if I've got this wrong.
Dave.

G'day Dave,

Unfortunately not. I have spoken with Maritime NSW and they see the ABP and rego as two seperate issues. They advised that all recreational craft except those on the exempt list require an ABP to be fitted whether they are registered or not.

regards,

AD

G'day Everyone,
All too often, when sourcing materials to build the boat, one of the most common materials to substituted is, the plywood. Usually when purchasing plans, it comes with a materials list and off we go making phone calls, pricing and ordering. The problem is, by substituting, you can effect the ABP.

Recently a client who ( without my knowledge) had substituted Gabbon ply for hardwood plywood from his local hardware store. In days past, this would not have mattered to much ( providing it was still marine) However, the result was , the boat ended up heavier ( boat alone) For those who are not aware, in ABP calculations, the weight of the boat ( not displacement) and motor is the basis of the calculations.

Alarm Bells !!!

The result was, the ABP information provided initially was now no longer applicable and if he had not informed us, the result would have been wrong information being engraved on the plate.

My suggestion is, if you have any intension of changing or modifying your power boat, or even substituting materials, I cannot stress enough that it is important that you consult your designer first. (ie Ross, Mik, myself, whoever.... it must however, be an Australian entity), in order that the plate info can be rechecked.. This is a policy that even Quintex alloy boats demand from their dealers, when clients wish to put additional items on board. It's all checked prior and if need be, a new plate is issued.

This relationship however, can be good, as sometimes a client will have a great idea that eventually ends up becoming a part of the design. A win/ win situation.

For those interested, one of the standards used for the plate is the ABYC
"The ABYC (American Boating & Yachting Council) mission is to develop quality technical practices and engineering standards for the design, construction, maintenance and repair of small craft with reference to their safety.
The Council shall also disseminate these standards and be the principal source of related technical information and education for the marine industry."
Here's their link
http://www.abycinc.org/

In regards to the plate itself, it is YOUR name that goes in the "builders section", however, some states are now also requiring the name of the competent person, who supplied the ABP info, also be on the plate. (eg NSW, Qld) in this case, it would have to be Ross, Mik, myself, who ever is competent to provide the info.

Obtaining a plate is easy. It cost $30 and for all States, to obtain a plate or, for more additional information, you can contact Amanda below at:
Where can I obtain an Australian Builders Plate?
Australian Marine Industries Federation* can provide information for ordering plates. Australian Marine Industries Federation can be contacted:

http://www.amif.asn.au/home.1.html

Office: Unit 14, 795 Beaufort Street, Mount Lawley, Western Australia 6050
Telephone: +61 8 9371 8872z
Facsimile: +61 8 9371 3973w

Is it bureaucracy gone mad?? It can be. But it seems we're only just starting. At the last Naval Architect conference held last week, we were informed that there is now a world wide push for a single standard instead of the major 3 we now have. Does this mean that some time in the future, we'll have to go through all this again.!!!
Time will tell.
Regards
Mark

Thanks everyone and Andrew in particular.
The choice has narrowed.
I either need (in no particular order)
1. The Flint by Ross
2. The skiff by Mark
3. The rowboat by Mik
4. The prototype v-nosed punt on Mark's drawing board.
5. Something else, perhaps something like the shkiff by Uncle John's boats but redesigned by an Aussie.
6. A custom designed car topper by any of you (and a new badge for my old evinrude to downgrade its power)
7. A swift kick up the posterior

Oh. I don't want to paint it. Timber is sooooo sexy. This means more Midge like worrying about end results.
Slippery indeed.

http://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/fr...+2009+pt.3+0+N
What are we to make of clause 46?Looks like a get out of gaol free card for craft not requiring registration to me at, first reading-and I presume this is the current legislation NSW Maritime is obliged to work from.Maybe something useful has come from Macquarie St for once.(Don't get me started on the marine reserve fiasco).
Dave.

Dave,

It does read a little different at first glance but the senior fellow at Maritime NSW was adamant that even vessels not requiring rego were to have an ABP unless specifically excpeted by the legislation.

I had to read the section a few times (its been a long day sanding) but I reckon what it is getting at is this.

Section 45 says that if you have a vessel that requires an ABP, you can't sell it without the ABP or they nick you 50 penalty points (is that $5K??).

I think what Section 46 is getting at is that an ABP is still required but if you are prosecuted for trying to sell your boat without an ABP, and you built the boat and have owned it for 5 years+ then this can be a defence to the prosecution.

I don't know why it would be a defence and I don't know if I would like to try it out but it certainly does look fishy. I'd be writing to Maritime NSW for clarification before I'd run the gauntlet on this.

Well picked up.

Caliban,

why not have one of each??

AD

Originally Posted by bloggs1968

Caliban,

why not have one of each??

AD

If I did that then I could go to option 8 (which I deleted)
8. a divorce and a single seat kayak
Do not tell her I wrote that or I'll need a coffin.

Too much windage in a coffin. Better to arrange burial in a boat, then you can have fun with it first.

The coffin will give you grief Caliban, too much of a bow wave and will slam in chop ha ha

Originally Posted by Caliban

If I did that then I could go to option 8 (which I deleted)
8. a divorce and a single seat kayak
Do not tell her I wrote that or I'll need a coffin.

be easier to lift onto the roof racks..................

AD

Originally Posted by bloggs1968

be easier to lift onto the roof racks..................

AD

not if I'm in it

I'm too heavy to lift myself...ah forget it, it's like standing in a bucket and trying to lift yourself
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Sorry dead joke.

Originally Posted by Caliban

not if I'm in it

I'm too heavy to lift myself...ah forget it, it's like standing in a bucket and trying to lift yourself
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Sorry dead joke.

I was talking about the single person kayak mate.

AD

Crikey Caliban,
Coffin idea sounds great.

Here's you coffin ABP plate numbers. Its for free !!

Max HP = 2 HP
max outboard weight = 14kg
Max number of people ( would you believe) = 1 (ha ha)
Max capacity = 59kg
Fl;oation used : basic ( you'll need 3 ft^3 of foam)
standard used : ABYC

This an actual calculation would you believe. !!!
Better let me know if your using brass handles, flowers etc as the numbers might change ha ha ha

NO CHARGE HA HA HA

regards
mark