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  1. #241
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    Heaps of local in fighting in the State Gov, at the moment.
    Also Tassie is broke.
    You would think some one would realize the value of long term renewable resources.
    But NO not our short term mob.
    I am glad I am getting older. I won't be around to see the "Wasted State", which is what many of us are calling Tasmania.

    Paul.
    I FISH THEREFORE I AM.

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  3. #242
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    There is a bit happening down there at the moment , isn't there ?
    Rob J.

  4. #243
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    What has happened down there , have the greenies turned off the lights ?.
    Rob J.

  5. #244
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    Have not not heard anything on the news Rob, but I must admit, I have pretty much given up on watching the news.

    Lights still on, but getting dimmer.


    Paul.
    I FISH THEREFORE I AM.

  6. #245
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    Could someone give me any indication of any change of direction ?.
    Andrew spoke a while back about the boatbuilding industry "gaining some traction ".
    Has this continued ? , what is the sense of what is happening now ?.
    Regards Rob J.

  7. #246
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    It looks as though this thread has died.
    I don't think the issue has though.
    Rob J.

  8. #247
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    Heard the other week on the wireless that Forestry Tasmania plus at least one timber
    exporter may be walking away from the deal due to the activities of the loonie green
    extremists. Seems thay have been placing ads in foreign mainstream papers to the
    effect that the forestry industry has been clear felling areas which are protected under
    the agreement or some other form of protection (Nat'l Park / World Heritage / whatever).
    Won't return to the table until the guily party/s are evicted from proceedings.

    Has this been resolved ?

  9. #248
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    Default Tasmanian boat building

    Lets stop complaining and stop blaming the greens the problem has been caused by over logging and clear falling the forests for over 40 years as if it would never run out.
    There is still timber available for boat building on a small scale, in fact I sent a pack away to Darwin a few weeks ago for a guy that is building a 20 foot boat.
    If timber had more value as it has had in the past there will be no problems.
    Regards Bob

  10. #249
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodturner777 View Post
    Lets stop complaining and stop blaming the greens the problem has been caused by over logging and clear falling the forests for over 40 years as if it would never run out.
    There is still timber available for boat building on a small scale, in fact I sent a pack away to Darwin a few weeks ago for a guy that is building a 20 foot boat.
    If timber had more value as it has had in the past there will be no problems.
    Regards Bob
    Fair comment Bob, The industry would be in better shape if the large scale wood chip contracts to supply asian markets in the early 70s (supported by the two political parties) were not handed out. I have seen for myself minor valuble species loaded onto log trucks and delivered to the hampshire chip mill to be chipped and sent oversees. I have also salvaged valuble timber from burn heaps on private plantaions property where the good existing timber was cut down and pushed into a pile to make way for nitens. I believe Forestry Tas had no vision back then either, that is why they are currently unsustainable and a burden on Tasmania tax payers , always has been always will be until there are some major reform. Yet somehow this was the fault of the greens.
    Now putting all that behind us (we cannot change whats happened) trees are still growing and now that intelligent people are aware of whats happend in the past, I do hope the remaining forrests that are valuble, are better utilized for boat building, furniture and construction, not simply chiped and sold for $10 a cubic metre.
    I think this forum should be used for healthy debate not to insult others due to their political views.
    Regards John

  11. #250
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    I don't live in Tasmania, but have been following this thread. I live on the far south coast of NSW, and sadly the situation here is exactly the same. There is a woodchip mill in Eden, and the forests were clear felled around the mill years ago. The logging continues, but now they need to transport logs from further afield, and we now have logging trucks thundering down the main street of Bega. Thankfully they no longer clear fell, but the value put on the timber is so low that the cost of logging is less than what the government gets for the logs, so Forestry NSW is running at a large loss. That of course is payed for by the NSW taxpayer, so my taxes are effectively subsidising woodchipping. The vast proportion of the logs go to the woodchip mill, yet we still have the NSW minister for forestry arguing that woodchipping is a by product of saw logging. I also have seen valuable timber piled up and burned, or large valuable trees felled and chopped up into firewood. We don't have the high value species that Tasmania has, but when NSW Forestry contractors log koala habitat and catchment areas of oyster producing lakes, illegally log aboriginal sites, and illegally log environmentally sensitive areas, one does start to understand why the greenies are jumping up and down. And I don't blame them, if nobody complained then the illegal logging would continue. More intelligent utilisation of the remaining forests is something I and many others would also like to see, but at the moment in NSW there is no sign of it. The conflict continues. I agree with Bob, there needs to be more value in the timber or this sort of madness will continue.

    Peter

  12. #251
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    Default Tasmanian boat building

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyroberts View Post
    Fair comment Bob, The industry would be in better shape if the large scale wood chip contracts to supply asian markets in the early 70s (supported by the two political parties) were not handed out. I have seen for myself minor valuble species loaded onto log trucks and delivered to the hampshire chip mill to be chipped and sent oversees. I have also salvaged valuble timber from burn heaps on private plantaions property where the good existing timber was cut down and pushed into a pile to make way for nitens. I believe Forestry Tas had no vision back then either, that is why they are currently unsustainable and a burden on Tasmania tax payers , always has been always will be until there are some major reform. Yet somehow this was the fault of the greens.
    Now putting all that behind us (we cannot change whats happened) trees are still growing and now that intelligent people are aware of whats happend in the past, I do hope the remaining forrests that are valuble, are better utilized for boat building, furniture and construction, not simply chiped and sold for $10 a cubic metre.
    I think this forum should be used for healthy debate not to insult others due to their political views.
    Regards John
    Hi John, having been salvaging minor species timber on and off since 1968 and seen billions and billions of dollars worth of Tasmania minor species go to the woodchipper or up in smoke can you please tell me why are the greens in anyway to blame.? in my opinion if it was not for the greens there would be no minor species left at all, now I know many, many forests workers - fallers - logging contractors - sawmillers Etc and I have a lot of respect for them all, and many of them I count as friends they are the pawns the meat in the sandwich told to hate the greens, told the greens are putting them out of work what lies and utter bu-l-sh-t has been spread I have just got home late tonight after 3 days away and close to a1000 klm trip why.? to try and find minor species for my customers to build musical instruments value adding this is where our minor species should have gone right from the start not feeding Gunns who then decide to stop logging old growth and then get a huge payout as for insults please tell me who am I insulting.? I am telling the truth shooting straight from the hip, that is what I do tired of the bu--s-it.
    Cheers Bob

  13. #252
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    Hi Bob, I like you know the greens are not to blame in any way shape or form.
    It is easy for failed industry to simply blame someone or some group , for their failings, thats why the greens get the blame, it's easy to pick on a small group, but actually who cares, smarter people from all political backgrounds can see it's not the fault of anyone but the industry it self backed up by forestry tas and state government who have no vision for future needs. Like you say, it is the forestry workers who are the pawns in this mess and thats unfortunate. Sad thing is the Libs still think there is a future in wood chipping.
    I think it is a shame that the arguments resort to insults and anger as that achieves nothing, never will, sick of the merry go round myself.
    I'm not sure what if any outcomes will be achieved out of the round table discussions Giving millions to Tasmania, I don't think will make any difference. Locking up all the forrest is crazy (trees still grow) Foresty Tas and industry simply cannot be trusted to manage forrests sustainably.
    regards John

  14. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by dopeydriver View Post
    Reading a comment by AD on a boatbuilding thread about the availability of Celery top pine , I'm wondering what effect the locking up of the Tasmanian forests will have on the highly prestigious Tasmanian wooden boat building industry.
    Regards Rob J.
    Gentlemen this is the original question at the start of this thread, which was asking about the future not the past . If you think the greens are going to help with making available boat building timber you are dreaming.
    Ian L

  15. #254
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    I'm sure I did not suggest that. Making timber available for a boat building industry, if any good timber resource is left, is green policy, a sustainable timber industry that is not wood chip driven is green policy. John

  16. #255
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    Actually John, the Greens (most recently in Tas State parliament) and other ENGO's have refused to support the cutting of old growth forest required by not only the boat building industry but the entire value adding industry. In fact one of the ENGOs has even stated that our industry can easily transition to a plantation based resource! A celery log needs to be around 400 years old to yield good boat timber - plantation celery anyone??

    If you have a look at the Greens Policy (Forest Transition Strategy 2010) they actually admit that the number of jobs in the value adding industry is "not yet determined" but indicate it is small. They also state that the number of jobs affected by the cessation of native forest logging is minimal and anyway, people change jobs throughout their working life so it really shouldn't matter too much.......(try explaining that to the families losing their income)

    ABS 2006 census data actually show that the industry is one of Tasmanias largest sectors with thousands of people employed across many industries with an annual contribution to the State's economy of over $250 million. The 2009 Farley report into the Tasmanian value adding sector (which was limited in its scope due to funding) showed over 2000 full time employees and over 8000 part time employees and hobbyists. The ripple effect into the economy is huge if this sector is lost.

    The recent IVG reports on wood supply scenarios openly admitted that special timbers were not taken into account in any of the supply deliberations. Special timbers are the elephant in the room as no one wants to admit that old growth forest will need to be cut to support the value adding industry. If the Greens and ENGOs truly support a value adding industry in Tasmania they must come out and support cutting of old growth timber that the industry needs - you cannot have one without the other.

    The figure of 6700 cubic metres of specialty timbers per annum the green groups claim is the industry need ( or less according to Mr Brown on one ABC TV interview) is dwarfed by the decade long average of around 17,000 cubic metres harvested and well below the current contracts of supply of around 23,000 cubic metres per annum.

    There is still plenty of good timber available that can be harvested on a long term rotation to support this industry. FT actually had a special timbers strategy launched in 2010 that did exactly this (min 200 year rotation and included selective logging) but this has been ignored. Nearly all the area set aside for this has been laid claim to by the green groups.

    It still beggars belief that the government - State and Federal have abdicated their elected responsibilty to a bunch of non-elected, narrowly focussed interested parties.

    Am I upset about this - hell yes. I can see a viable value adding industry in Tasmania and the mainland (55% of speciall timbers are exported per year) with thousands of jobs being collateral damage in exchange for preferences at the next state/federal election.

    I'll jump off my soap box now.

    AD
    www.denmanmarine.com.au
    Australian agent for Swallow Boats, Bruynzeel Multipanel Plywood and Barton Marine Products

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