Thread: Removing screws under wooden plugs

You can use a forstner bit. The bit should be equal to or slightly bigger than the diameter of the plug. Drill carefully, there is usually a bit of space between the screw and the plug, so you should be able to stop before hitting the screw.

A Plug Cutter would do the trick, just drill out the old plug and break it off with a screw driver.

Joez

Using a drill bit will usually screw up the hole, be it forstener or plug cutter style. A quick, easy and unlikely to damage the surrounding wood technique I've used for decades, is a plain old wood or drywall screw. Start the screw in the center of the bung (the plug) and slowly turn it in. The point will bottom out on the fastener and the surounding plug wood will ride up the still turning threads, which does one of two things; splits the plug into a few pieces, which are easily plucked out of the hole or the whole bung (plug) lifts clear of the hole, on the threads of the screw. I've removed 10's of thousands of bungs over the years and this method is the most reliable way, while preventing damage to the fastener hole and fastener head.

I agree with Par and if the person who built the boat in the first place was any good as a tradesman the slot on the screw should be running

a. Either with the grain of the timber or
b. Being the gunwale/rubbing strake along the line of the rubbing strake (fore and aft)

Cheers
Peter

What happens when the previous plugger has used epoxy to glue em in won't the edge split. I assume then the next size up plug cutter is the only option. Just a thought.

Originally Posted by joez

A Plug Cutter would do the trick, just drill out the old plug and break it off with a screw driver.

Joez

Just be aware that you are going to end up with a very large hole. A plug cutter is very difficult to control with anything other than a drill press. You are likely to ruin the hole.

A plug cutter is useless in this application and anyone that's removed fasteners that has tried them, very quickly realize why. Trust me, after many thousands of removed fasteners, the plug cutter just doesn't work additionally, once it hits the fastener, it's trashed.

The screw method I mentioned can be "mechnizied" if desired. Cut the head off a screw and chuck it up in a drill. They (again) turning slowly, it will bottom out on the fastener head and the plug will split and rise up. Even if epoxied bungs are used, this works, though the remaining hole usually needs more "cleaning" when epoxied bungs are encountered. I use this method if I've determined the bungs will come out fairly easily, usually after several by hand. You have to be very careful with a the drill method, as you can very easily slip and make problem into a much bigger one. This isn't the case if you do it by hand.

Screw head slots should NOT be lined up in any particular fashion in their holes. There is a point when a screw bottoms and it's head has engaged the work. Anything other then this is wrong. Simply put, if you back off the screw a touch to align the slot with the grain it's not tight, which is wrong and asking for trouble. If you tighten the screw, past it's "set home" point, then you are actually starting to strip the threads in the wood, which is also wrong and asking for trouble. When the head is fully engaged, it's obvious to anyone that's driven a few screws. This is where you stop. No more torque, no less or you're promoting a problem. Slot alignment is irrelevant.

Par, your method is very clever.

Sorry but I have to disagree about " heading" of screws.

I was always taught that they should be headed where visible also where the screws there were to be counterbored and then plugged.

Another way of removing the plus is to use a steel shaft screwdriver and punch it in along the grain of the plug. If the screw was headed the tip of the screwdriver should line up with the slot of the screw.

The reason that I was taught that they should be headed was that way it would always be known where the slot is located.

Much harder now with Phillips head screws.
Peter

Why does it matter which way the slot is facing?
Either way you've got to get the plug out
Either way the slot will need some cleaning up to give a screwdriver purchase on the head to get it out
Correct "set" of the screw tightness surely has to be a higher priority

So, let me get this right Peter, if the slot is facing in the wrong direction, you either back it off as much as nearly a half a turn to align it, or you start the stripping process by over tightening about a half a turn . . . are you kidding?

The only way to align slots (again it's futile and meaningless) is to very carefully set the counter sink depth to insure the slot is aligned the way you want, when the head bottoms in the counter sink. This is a very difficult proposition in wood and a trial and error thing in metal This is relitivly easily (tedious) in metal, but not so much in wood. Anything less the a fully setted head is a loose fastener that needs another half a twist. Anything more is a set of threads which have started to strip out, by a half a turn (it only takes one full turn to strips the threads folks).

There is absolutely no benefit of having a fastener slot aligned with the grain. Removing bungs is easy, simple, mindless work, if you use the technique I've described. Even if you split the bung with a sharpened screw driver, the bung doesn't mind which way the slot is facing, nor does the tool used to split it. Besides, who bothers with slotted screws any more, particularly with so many much better choices available.

You don't need to know where the slot is, so alignment is moot. Once you've removed the bung, a quick hole cleaning with a scratch awl will reveal the slot, if it's not already partly or completely visible, which will need further cleaning to insure good screw driver bite when you remove the fastener.

If you are aligning fastener slots, stop, as it's not sound wood working practice in any industry.

Thanks for making it personal.

Maybe I am not up to date with the more illustrious thinking on this but that was my training by some fairly well credentialed tradesmen in the early 1960's

The slot can't be out my more than a quarter of a turn.


If I can I use slotted head screws as that is what was used the boat that I am restoring. Sometimes they are not available so I have to use Phillips head. The screws that are available here in Melbourne tend to be of realtively poor quality Chinese imports and just can't handle any real load on them.

I have manged to source some new old stock both brass and silicone bronze screws for my project. All is proceeding well so far with this new old stock items

I am sorry if my ideas don't conform with some others. We are all here to be of assistance and spread our experience/experiences.

From now on I will hold my council and leave it to other experts
Peter

Originally Posted by piquet

From now on I will hold my council and leave it to other experts
Peter

Please don't!
Many of us value the opinions of those more experienced.
I'd like to know why you think it might be an advantage to have the slots aligned with the grain of the wood
Has anyone tried covering screws with something to avoid them getting gummed up with epoxy? (eg, candle wax, soap, vaseline, paper circle, etc?)

It is interesting how the subject of aligning screw slots, timing, clocking or what ever term you choose to use often invokes heated debate. Clearly there is two very distinct schools of thought.

I've read a reason for clocking in some applications is for safety as a fastener working loose can be instantly seen.

I've also read clocking is an amateurish affection and something that would not be seen in a professional boat yard apart from perhaps high end boats in a decorative situation.

Anyways piquet please continue posting your opinions and experience as I hope PAR will, FWIW I don't think he is being personal.