Thread: Attitudes to the road toll

Originally Posted by matt_s

Have you checked the speedo against a GPS? Took wife's new Golf for a run and had people passing us constantly. Checked the speedo and it's fully 7kms/hr off. Speedo says 100, we're doing 93.

Yep, in my car when I am doing 100 km/h by the GPS the speedo reads 109. But that is legal (can read lower by up to 10% plus 4 km/h - you can have your speedo reading 100 and actually be doing 86 and the speedo is within the tolerances.) That standard came in a few years ago. Cars I had prior to the standard generally had a speedo which was out by reading under, so the speedo could read 100 and I could have actually been doing 110 in an older car. Speedo is legal but you still get booked for it.

Is it any wonder drivers get frustrated.

Originally Posted by beefy

There's countless times I've pulled out to overtake a driver doing say 90-95 Ks. As I overtake them I notice I'm not getting anywhere yet I'm at 100. I go up to 105 and still I'm not gaining. So up to 110 and I manage to get past them. Finally I pull back in the lane and reduce speed to 100. Now they start dropping behind me so obviously they sped up when I started to overtake and only reduce speed afterwards once they've enjoyed screwing me for no reason. So this ridiculous Kiasu is alive and strong here. I really don't understand what the f*&k is wrong with a lot of people. We live in a wonderful country and yet so many are angry and confrontational and wanting to screw each other for the sake of it.

I often find when driving on the open highway there will be a vehicle going along at 90 km/h or so - until you get to an overtaking lane where you think you can finally get past them. As soon as you get onto the overtaking lane they speed up to 110 and stay there until you can't pass them any more then drop back to 90 again. Happens all the time.

Rob, I've never driven in Texas, but I'd be interested in hearing your comments on LA driving. I'd never driven in the USA before this year, but a few Americans had warned me about LA driving, so I wasn't looking forward to navigating my way in an unfamiliar car, to LA Int'l Airport during the evening peak hour.

Frankly, I found it far less terrifying than expected. Sure, it's fast, and the drivers sit close behind, but they'll let you change lanes, and I didn't notice any road rage. (Also, the roads are well signposted.)

Alex,

LA drivers can be extremely fast, particularly at peak commuting hours but as you observed they often know how to drive fast. I've found that you must be ready to go-with-the-flow or you'll be run down.

The major US coastal cities are all similar in that way. I remember driving on the DC beltway at about 85 mph at rush hour, my tires skipping and squealing on the pavement joints with surrounding cars so closely packed that they were literally within touching distance. If anybody had made a false move it would have been mayhem. It's likely that the demands of highway driving quickly weed out those whose skills aren't up to snuff. BTW, beware of cars bearing diplomatic plates in the DC area if you go, they don't have to obey the laws - diplomatic immunity.

Drivers in the major cities of Texas are also very fast but with the critical difference that many of them are extremely unskilled. We've also had a couple of road rage shootings recently in SA. The only place where I think drivers may be worse is Arizona.

Originally Posted by rob streeper

BTW, beware of cars bearing diplomatic plates in the DC area if you go, they don't have to obey the laws - diplomatic immunity.

We get the same in Canberra, Rob

Good points about checking my speedo, I'll look into that.

Talking about other countries:

I think many would consider life cheap in 3rd world countries, and if you are on a main road when you shouldn't be, you may end up as an asphalt pizza.

Nearly 30 years ago I was in super busy Bangkok. I was crossing at the lights of one of these 6 lane busy roads, and I ended up crossing after the lights went green. I thought I was dead meat, staring in horror at a wall of cars that I envisioned were about to plough me down, but to my amazement EVERYONE stopped at the line and waited for me while I ran to get to the pavement.

And no angry shouts, gestures, or honking horns. Wow, was I impressed.

Imagine what would happen here, it would be like a horn orchestra with lots of "singing". Multiple conductors too, with all the arms waving in the cars. Sorry, couldn't resist LOL.

Originally Posted by beefy

Nearly 30 years ago I was in super busy Bangkok. I was crossing at the lights of one of these 6 lane busy roads, and I ended up crossing after the lights went green. I thought I was dead meat, staring in horror at a wall of cars that I envisioned were about to plough me down, but to my amazement EVERYONE stopped at the line and waited for me while I ran to get to the pavement.

Many years ago now, I turned left into the left hand lane of a six-lane street in Jakarta. A car stopped and let me in. My next challenge was that I was turning right in 100 metres. As soon as I flicked my indicator on to change lanes to the right the cars in all five lanes in turn slowed down to let me change lanes and I made it across into the right hand lane with maybe 50 metres to spare. Never try that in Melbourne.

Thing is - they have learned that they HAVE TO drive like that. Next time it might be them who needs to get across. Nearly 30 years later Australian drivers are still driving with a ME ME ME attitude.

We've gone a little off topic here, but that's okay. We're getting to the root cause of accidents, not necessarily road deaths. Most, if not all accidents are caused by drivers not paying attention, or being aware of their surroundings. IMHO, knowledge of road rules play a minor part in traffic accidents, attitude toward other road users plays a much larger part.

Have a look at this graphic from a recent newspaper article and tell me who you think was at fault. Try not look for reports of the accident, just give an opinion based on the graphic. I will post the link later.

cranbourneCrashMap729px.jpg

2 is at fault. Traffic already on the road you are entering has right of way. Even if 1 was speeding, 2 needs to give way.

Just recently there was a head of the judiciary appointed in one state in Australia. She had the effrontery
to criticize those who are critical of decisions made by her fellow judges!

When we have a judiciary that believes, and acts, as though it is is beyond reproach or examination then we have problems aplenty!!

Originally Posted by Grumpy John

Have a look at this graphic from a recent newspaper article and tell me who you think was at fault. Try not look for reports of the accident, just give an opinion based on the graphic. I will post the link later.

Impossible to tell from the information available, GJ. Depends on unknown circumstances of relative speeds, was someone exceeding the speed limit, inattentive, intoxicated or just downright stupid? From that graphic there is not enough to give enough detail to tell without jumping to an ill-informed conclusion.

Plenty of information Doug, who has right of way - the person already on the highway, or someone leaving a private property? The rules do not state whether you're speeding or drunk.

Originally Posted by Grumpy John

Plenty of information Doug, who has right of way - the person already on the highway, or someone leaving a private property? The rules do not state whether you're speeding or drunk.

Maybe so if you take a narrow view of things from just what is available from the picture GJ, but "failure to give right of way " is just one of many potential contributing factors to that accident. How do we know for example that the car that left the school didn't come out when the road was clear and get caught behind other slow traffic only to get hit from behind by a speeding motorist who would have hit the car in front of them if they had not entered the road? Like I said, there's too much we do not know from just the picture so I will stick with my original answer and not make an ill informed accusation.

Whoever was first on the roundabout is not at fault (even if it came out of a private property) but the other is.

Road rules state that in entering a roundabout you must give way to cars on the roundabout which is different from the normal give way to the right on normal intersections.

Peter.

Okay Doug you make some good points, however in this case car #2 had no one either in front, or behind and there is a long stretch of clear road to the left. And they are leaving private property, they are NOT on public road.