Thread: CoronaVirus ==> Empty Shelves

Originally Posted by Lappa

OK, that sorts post 237. What about post 233?

History..

It was actually the figures you are providing.

Just checked Worldometers. Interesting site. Thanks Graeme. Looks like they have references to all their figures

All my figures come directly from news updates you can find on any online newspaper, TV station or Govt website kungsleden. The funny thing is they, for once, all agree with each other

Originally Posted by kungsleden

Edit: Replying to Graeme's post.

Figures, statements, numbers without sources are meaningless.

worldometer. They appear to have references/sources for all the figures they quote from the figures/charts I’ve looked at.

This is worth a listen/look.
Dr Norman Swan recommends 'severe' shutdowns - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

Judging by what I saw in a drive around Brisbane this afternoon there's no shortage of people treating this lightly. Restaurants, pubs and cafes appear to be doing a roaring trade as usual and there didn't seem to be any fewer people on the streets. Telling people to avoid crowds will have about as much effect as telling them to limit their purchase of bathroom consumables I suspect.

YouTube

Originally Posted by kungsleden

Edit: Replying to Graeme's post.

Figures, statements, numbers without sources are meaningless.

If you read carefully you will see that WHO sources were actually referenced.

I deliberately did not fully reference the Worldometer stuff as I am almost certain that it is a secondary source, and I have no information on its credibility - issues that I very carefully highlighted.

Originally Posted by Tccp123

there's no shortage of people treating this lightly.

My Macca's wasn't busy this morning for brekky or this evening for dinner. At both occasions it had an empty drive thru, one couple inside and myself. It's usually busy at the times I went. I guess people have too much food. Cole's was stripped bare this evening with only my junk food available and other crap that no one wants to eat (vegan stuff!)

For younger people I guess nothing short of the death of an older Relative will make much difference.
My son would once have been like that but now with two kids (one autistic) he really relies on us and in laws for support and help so if he loses us his support mechanism will greatly reduced so he’s taking the whole thing very seriously. He normally has a 2 x 40 min car/train commute to the city and works in an office with 25 other blokes but fortunately is able to work from home for weeks on end if needs be.

Originally Posted by Lappa

Another interesting point from my sister is that even if you have symptoms they don’t have the testing kits available to test you.
Its the local [USA] authorities and State Governors who are proactive (rather than waiting for Trump) in making decisions to close down schools and socially isolate.

this is another illustration of why the SYSTEM of government in the US is by design so very weak.
Militarily the US is super strong -- outspending its closest competitor (China) by a factor of almost five -- but when it comes to civil administration, the task is by design left to the local authority (county).

The situation first came to the general Australian public's attention in 2005 with Hurricane Katrina (a strong category 3 storm) -- the City of New Orleans was left to its own devices to recover from the flooding. New Orleans may have "dodged a bullet" when the most destructive sector of the hurricane (the NW quadrant) made landfall west (rather than east) of the city -- leading President Bush to conclude everything was OK. New Orleans was actually destroyed by the flooding that accompanied the storm.

Covid-19 is just another example of the same by design effect of the US Constitution. Individual rights, as expressed through the winner takes all electoral system at the level of each individual county, means that it is the individual county that is the first responder to any public health crisis. BTW, there are almost 18,000 (actually 17,985 according to Dr Google) police agencies in the US.
What this means is that it is the individual county which is responsible for the first response to a crisis like Covid-19. The next level of response is the State Governor who can, where deemed necessary, deploy the state based National Guard to "keep order" -- I'm not so sure about 2nd element "keeping the peace" let alone the 3rd element "good government".

There are Federal Level agencies with the necessary contingency budgets -- but Trump has to declare a National Emergency before cheques can be written and the money flow to each State or county who in turn will engage contractors to deliver the actual health services required.

If there's one tiny bit of good news it is that my age is finally working for me (at supermarkets between 7 - 8 am). I wonder how they'll enforce it? Will they have security people on the doors where you have to flash your senior's card?

What's it like living in a full lock down situation?

Here's an information Post by the Mayor of the locked down town of Belluno (36,000 inhabitants) in Northern Italy.
Perhaps unlike other parts of Italy the people in this region have above average common sense.

1) Some Parking meters have been turned off and some parking restrictions lifted around supermarkets enabling seniors to park closer to supermarkets.
2) Large outside markets are closed but small vending stalls spaced at sufficient distance apart in outside locations are permitted.
3) Street and building disinfection will be undertaken on a regular basis and public rubbish bins will be emptied and disinfected more regularly than usual.
4) Police checks will continue to be undertaken on people's movements and socialisation, 300 homes and 800 commercial activities have been checked in 24 hours with 2 fines issued.
5) Parks: Persons are allowed to use parks using common sense. eg maintain social distancing. Solo walking cycling etc are permitted staying as far as possible away from everyone else. No stopping to chat. Avoid sitting on park benches.
6) Supermarkets. Do not bring anyone else with you to do the shopping. Keep away from other shopper, staff and the register. Don't handle goods unnecessarily.
7) Watch out for scammers - then a list of some of the things they are doing.

There's a lot more but that gives you the flavour ie flexible, practical common sense
I wonder when the time comes if we can do likewise.

And the mayor finishes with

Someone pointed out to me that "our grandparents were asked to go to the front to get shot at, today we're asked to be locked in the house on the couch". I mean, surely we can do that

And a sign on the supermarket door in the small village where another relative lives.
This is directed to Non-regional people, ie tourists or escapees from large cities invading the countryside to escape the epidemic.

"The health facilities in this region have been designed to support the numbers of permanent residents of the region. Your presence will overload and possibly collapse the system if it needs to serve you."

In other words if you are "not from these ere parts then F-OFF"

I live opposite the entrance to a primary school. I watched for a while as kids arrived this morning. There wasn't a lot of "social distancing" happening...

Originally Posted by ian

this is another illustration of why the SYSTEM of government in the US is by design so very weak.
Militarily the US is super strong -- ......

So true, Ian.

I watched much of Hurricane Katrina unfold from my local yacht club. Many of us were puzzled by the apparent absense of the American govenment or releif agencies. A visiting American yachtsman's explanation, and I quote*: "It's a f*cking n*gger town". Truth from a bottle of bourbon? And when the US military belatedly arrived they were very heaving armed; A Viet Vet commented that "They got more sh*t than we had in Nam".

Six months or so later two Cat 4 cyclones hit FNQ, both were stronger than Katrina, and I watched the news reports in the same yacht club in the presence of several cruising Americans. They were amazed at how quickly and effectively the Australian military and SES rolled into action; Hercules relief aircraft landing when the winds were still gale force, orange jump suits everywhere, Navy ships steaming north within 48 hours, and zero armaments - "The Australian Army does not bear arms against Australians" was greeted with incredulity.

Or as one American summed it up "Australia seems like America but it ain't."


* It's a quote; please do not shoot the messenger, please!