Thread: Buying old lathes - Pros/Cons

My preference is toward the old lathes. They were made a lot better than the current lot from China. If you can get one in good shape and you don't mind chasing a few parts for it, then I think you will be happier with an older one. If you are in an area where old machines are hard to come by and command excessive prices then you might be better off with a Chinese one. Not all of them are produced to the same fit and finish so its nice if you can check it out in person.
Darrell

Big difference between the 2 you have shown and newer lathes.

This will depend on the Type of New lathe you are reffering to.

If for instance the New lathe was A Geared Head Model,you would more than likely have a greater speed range.

You would more than likely be able to take bigger cuts at increased feed.

You would more than likely be less prone to drive belt slippage while cutting.

You may not have to use change gears as much for thread cutting on the newer lathe.

you would expect there to be no wear and mimimal backlash on a new lathe.

The chuck mounting would more than likely be camlock on a new lathe rather than a screw on chuck.

You may get greater travel on the cross slide and compound on a new lathe.

You would more than likely get a new lathe with rollerbearing headstock spindle.

You would more than likely have readily available spare parts.

You would definately pay more for a new lathe.

You could have the joy of stripping a new lathe to clean and check and adjust just so you could use it for its intended purpose.

With the older lathe you may find replacement parts hard to come by.

You may need to change the type of belt drive.

You may find the the bed is worn.

You may find there is a lot of backlash.

You may find that all of the original accessories are not still with the lathe.

You will probably find in most instances that the old lathe is still quite serviceable if not a little slow.

You may have to change your machining style to suit the variations of an older lathe.

You more than likely wont pay anywhere near as much for the older lathe.

You will more than likely be able to produce similar results with the older lathe.

You wont have to go through the same cleaning and set up process as you would with a new lathe,apart from cleaning it and oiling and do a test cut.

It will more than likely proven itself as a reliable work horse even though it is long in the tooth.

If your new to lathes I think you would be better of with a new Chinese lathe. I started with an old Hercus and after buying a new 12 x 36 lathe the difference was unbelievable.
If the funds are tight and you can pick up a cheap lathe then go that way, at least you will have something to turn and learn on.
I know they guy that has the rights for the Nuttal lathes. When I was over there he showed me a gear about 4 inch's round and it was $190, so spares for old lathes can get expensive or impossible to get.
Dave

big difference

1 big plus to buying old machinery is you can get an excellent build quality at the fraction of the cost of new and as is now days the quality of the old machines surpasses all that most can afford new no joke a Hercus 260 was $12K new when they stopped being made

the down side and is kinda obvious they are used machines the industry beats the hell out of manual machines now more than ever i think in the case of a lathe that could mean worn ways, worn slides, worn bearings and broken parts or worse missing parts that you will never be able to get

personally i would get a used machine over new one but just be aware of what problems it may have and what you are capable of repairing also in my experience you will find few new machines that wont need a tweak to run in top order

Thanks for the input guys.

I'm very, very new to this and this will be my first lathe (if/when I get one). At the moment I don't know what I don't know. I guess I'm looking to ascertain if there are any pitfalls I'm unaware of with older lathes and if there are things that newer lathes can do, but older lathes can't.

It's only a hobby for me, so i don't mind if I have to work slowly (shallower cuts, etc) as long as I won't be unduly restricted by what functions I can do.

For example would they older lathes be able to produce both imperial and metric threads.

Originally Posted by Vernonv

For example would they older lathes be able to produce both imperial and metric threads.

Hi,
Depending on the age, also you would have to get all the gears with it to be able to cut them.
Most old lathe have been separated from the accessory's they came with from the factory.
Dave

I have had enough of fighting to get accurate results with old rooted lathes... And make no mistake, 99% of old lathes are rooted.... And any good ones usually do bring good money...

I've been thinking about this myself recently, in an ideal world i'd go out and buy an AL-540 or AL-1000 with DRO but just cant afford and justify it for the type of use it would get.

I've been keeping my eye out on ebay but haven't seen a lot come up in Melbourne and if something does come up it's usually from the 1950s.

If I were to buy a second hand one I probably would not go any earlier than 1980, I don't think a lot has changed in lathes since then, does that sound about right? I also don't want anything weighing anymore than a tonne.

Hares & Forbes sell used equipment as well, the prices seem good but I guess it depends on the condition they are in. These are 3 phase but I guess could be converted to 240 via a motor swap or maybe phase converter.

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/Pr...ckCode=XXLA139#

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/Pr...tockCode=XLA77

Also another thing, is it worth going to auctions (real auctions, not ebay) Is there much available and does it go cheap?

Melbourne is the manufacturing capital of Australia, and it always has been...If you cannot find a semi decent second hand machine in Melbourne, well.....

There has been no technological advances in pure manual lathes since geared head machines came on the scene... My worn out Purcell from the mid to late 1950 era is no more advanced then my Chin Hung from 2009.. Only advantage of newer era machines is things like bearings should be easily obtainable..... The bearings used in my Purcell are not available anywhere, they are obsolete..

Originally Posted by .RC.

I have had enough of fighting to get accurate results with old rooted lathes... And make no mistake, 99% of old lathes are rooted.... And any good ones usually do bring good money...

Love it, you have a way with words. thats just made my night. LOL.
bollie7

To add to R.C's comments,
most of the older, smaller, industrial sized machines like your Nuttalls, Purcells, Macsons etc have spent most of their life, either in a production shop where they have been flogged to death by a variety of operators, most who didn't give a rats about the machine, with minimal maintenance done on them,
or in a maint shop where they have been flogged to death by a bigger variety of operators, most who didn't give a rats about the machine, with even less maintenance done on them.
A lot of the smaller machines like your Hercuss's (Hercii ?) etc have spent time in small shops like auto electricians and mechanics where they have been flogged to death by a variety of operators, most who didn't give a rats about the machine, with minimal maintenance done on them,
or even worse, started life in a school or Tafe College where a lot of the operators actively tried to wreck the machine. Quite often succeeding.
I can tell you, there has not been a machine of any kind, ever made, anywhere, that is student proof.
The best used machine to buy is one from a deceased estate where the former owner was a retired machinist who made model trains and had had the machine for 20 years or so. It will be near perfect and will come a qarzillion fixtures, adapters special tools etc.

bollie7

Hi Vernov,
Workshop machinery is not all that different to cars.
You can go out and buy a new Great Wall vehicle and it will more than likely do everything you need, is good value for what it costs and you can jump in and drive away. If anything goes wrong take it back to the dealership under waranty and she'll be Jake.

You can go to the first second hand dealership you see and buy a great old HQ. It may start to leak oil after the first 100 km, blow smoke and need a new quater pannel when the bog falls out on a bumpy road, but again it will do the job.

Or you might find an old Rolls that's been in the garage for the last 25 years. It was only driven by Mum to church on Sundays and runs like a dream. Sure parts can be expensive but it'll be worth it if that's the sort of thing you like. And again it will do the job.

For mine, part of the fun of an old lathe is stripping it down, giving it a clean and putting it all back together. You get to know the machine in great detail and learn a lot along the way. The choice is really up to what you want to get out of it.

Hope I'm not spoiling this for anyone but check out this one:

Myford ML7 metal turning lathe - eBay, Equipment, Machinery, Metalworking, Industrial. (end time 29-Apr-10 19:03:15 AEST)

From the pic's I reckon this is about as good as they get on ebay, of course idealy you would go and check it out but to me, this looks like a bloody ripper and is definately close to being that old Rolls that mum used to drive.

The following link may also prove helpful:

Advice on buying a Lathe

Cheers,
Greg.

Uh, safety??

One topic that usually comes up in this type of discussion is the relative safety of new vs. old lathes.

Given that the OP is an admitted naive newbie, it's worth considering that newer lathes should have more safety switches, safety guards, warning stickers at danger points, enclosed moving parts, etc. than older lathes.

Cheers,
Andrew