Thread: Oily Nipples

Originally Posted by DSEL74

I read a post in another forum while researching Myfords, so it could have been anywhere, The post stated that person had been discussing way oil with the Shell Oil rep, and the way oil only came in larger quantify drums. The rep told the fella to just go and buy some Chainsaw Bar oil in a small bottle that was a suitable volume for his needs as the oils were the same thing, including the stiction. Right or wrong I can't say.

Yeh that is very interesting.
Chainsaw bar oil is one of the biggest bastard oils around...yeh it will have some specific additives t make it stick to the chain and the bar.

But it is often made up of other oils that did not make it.
sometimes it just smells like oil, other times it smells of amonia like gerabox oil.....its a disposable low performance oil.

Its very close to 80/90 gear with a bit of sticky additive.

Just to head off any doubt...I always buy Sthil branded Castrol bar oil, not no name rubbish.....because it is competitivley priced and it sticks to the bar and chain well.

cheers

Hi Dale,

Just stick with OEM recommendations when it comes to lubrication. way oil isn't chainsaw bar oil, chainsaws aren't precision machines, ( at least not usually! )

Michael pretty much said it all as far as multigrade oils. Unless someone with a doctorate in tribology comes along with more information.

Ray

Edit: I use Western Waylube Light, we go through a 20l drum every few months, so if you want a few liters let me know.

This thread is sorely missing pictures. Enjoy. (Click on it if it doesn't animate for you)

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[QUOTE=soundman;1819927]

DEXTRON automatic fluid is still an SAE30 oil....


cheers[/QUOTE

Are you sure about this???

Ray, That be good. I did have a small bottle but it seems to have gone AWOL in the move. Let me know how much I need to givecyou for it.

Originally Posted by DSEL74

Ray, That be good. I did have a small bottle but it seems to have gone AWOL in the move. Let me know how much I need to givecyou for it.

No charge I'll organize a container.

Ray

Originally Posted by soundman

Specifically why detergent is a problem.
cheers

The reason given for recommending that detergent oils should not be used in low speed car engines pre 1930s with unfiltered lubrication systems is that without detergent the carbon particles and other abrasive impurities will settle out as a sludge in the sump, so are not continuously recirculated. When using detergent oils these impurities are held in suspension so they can be removed by a filter, so will be recirculated if no oil filter is fitted. I have cleaned out quite surprising amounts of sludge from old filterless engines on occasion.

I suspect that this might be the origin of the suggestions not to use detergent oils in modern high speed small engines like those on mowers. I have no idea if this assumption is valid or if other reasons have been mentioned. Offhand I cannot think of any likely ones. I have several makes of small modern air cooled engines, and, from memory, none of their owners manuals specifically state that non-detergent oils should be used.

.Frank.

Originally Posted by soundman

If it is as you claim.... do you have any specfic detail about the effects.

Like which additives will attack what metals or machine parts.

Specifically why detergent is a problem.

As oil ages it will oxisidise and the components in it can decompose. Some of the decompositions will change the pH of the oil and both acids and alkalies will attack metal parts, as well as some non-metal parts. Copper and copper alloys are attacked by organic acids for example and chlorides can leach zinc out of brass as well. Things like viscosity modifiers (the additives that make oil multigrade) are damaged by mechanical action too, so after a while you have not got the viscosity you thought you had. This is why it is recommended that oil is changed periodically even in things that get little use so that problems don't arise. As Franco has said, detergents can hold particles in suspension. Have I personally experienced these issues? - not that I'm aware, although both my mill and in particular my lathe have suffered damage from some fool who thought there was no difference between grease and oil as a lubricant.

I take the view that on a public forum like this it is important to not propagate misleading or poor practice. While you may run caster oil in your mill or lathe if you wish, you take responsibility for the results. If it fouls things up or leads to premature fail those are the consequences that you have to accept for your actions. There may be guests or members reading this that have little knowledge of lubrication and unless someone speaks up may take any information stated here as the correct thing to do.

In my machine tools I run Shell Tonna both for slides and general lubrication as I had a good friend who was an engineer at Shell. He investigated this whole issue for me and that was the conclusion that he came to. In hindsight even that is probably overkill for what I need and once the drum is empty I'll consider changing to a (quality) hydraulic oil as it is more readily available in small quantities.

For the record, what oil do you run in your lathe and mill?

Michael