Thread: Bowl gouge

My first real turning tool was a new Crown 1/2 inch, actual size 5/8 inch, bowl gouge. I have since bought used Sorby, Thompson, Penn State Industries Chinese, no name Sheffield Steel, and Henry Taylor high speed steel bowl gouges. All are about the same in cutting ability except the Sorby, which gets dull quicker than any of the others.

I would not pay extra for the side, Irish, or Ellsworth grind. One of the used ones I bought came with the side grind and I was eager to use it on a part hollowed bowl on the lathe. Turned on the lathe, eased in the gouge, BAM!!!, bowl flew off into the end of the shop.

Unless you are experienced with side grind bowl gouges, you might buy one with a conventional grind, use it, and when you resharpen / touch up gradually go toward the side grind. By the time you have sharpened to a side grind you will be used to the extra pressure and aggressive cutting.

If you are planning to do a lot of turning of hard abrasive Aussie timber, look at the powder metal gouges that promise longer cutting between resharpening.

Some reading:

https://www.google.com/search?client...utf-8&oe=utf-8

There have been several discussions about bowl gouges here, do a search.

As Paul has said there are many and may well need to do some research on whats out there. Aussie hardwoods, well at the end of the day there much that will stand up to them.
I have, like Paul a wide variety of makes ie Hamlet 2060, Henry Taylor, P&N, Thompson etc all have their merits. The only really durable cutting edge I have found is TCT tips that Brendan Stemp recently trailed.

http://c.ymcdn.com/sites/www.woodtur...detogouges.pdf

A personal view of bowl gouges

This will help, but stick with something around 3/8 to 1/2 these are handy sizes that cover most of your needs. To a large extent brands and types of flutes are a personal choice.

I have a spare P&N I think its 1/2" I have never used it nor sharpened it.
PM me if your interested

































7

I can understand what you mean by side grind and wanting to have one. I resharpen/reshaped one of my P&N bowl chisels to this type of grind. What you need to remember every time you pick up this chisel is to be aware of the wings so that they do not catch the piece you are working on. It it a real shame to have a piece destroyed after spending a far amount of time making it.

Originally Posted by Christos

I can understand what you mean by side grind and wanting to have one. I resharpen/reshaped one of my P&N bowl chisels to this type of grind. What you need to remember every time you pick up this chisel is to be aware of the wings so that they do not catch the piece you are working on. It it a real shame to have a piece destroyed after spending a far amount of time making it.

But worth having too? Just a matter of being careful and learning how to use it properly?

A swept back grind is definitely useful, although I think some people take them too far.

But, like a skew chisel, they can bite you hard if you misuse them.

Most of mine are all good quality std. gouges that I've ground back myself. If you ever intend to do similar, I suggest you avoid even trying with a v-profiled flutee. Stick with a deep U. Otherwise it's a nightmare trying to a) get the grind profile right and b) keep the grind profile right.

Just sayin'.

Don't fret too much about the grind as I am sure you will change it a few times as you figure out what works for you. There is a lot of sales hype about what is the best but in the end what works for you is the best. As Skew says stick with a deep U in a good steel. I have a soft spot for P&N but even a cheap Chinese HSS gouge does a reasonable job. My starter set of cheep chisels keep getting reshaped as new experiments. That said I tend to lean to the general bowl gouge shape as the highly swept back grind has not enhanced my work.(still need to get out the scraper to finish). I also find that a lot of jigs for complicated grinds takes too much time setting up that can be used in turning wood. I have drawn back to basic freehand grinding just using a rest set for the bevel angle.
Regards
John

Orraloon's post reminds me that one of my most recent used bowl gouges is an actual 3/4 inch almost straight grind with the wings just a bit back of the bottom of the U. It has a nice open U shape. I have a huge long handle on it and grind it free hand resting on the flat rest used for grinding scrapers. The grind is called a bottom feeder.

When hollowing a bowl I go straight in with the tip and it plows out timber like na bull dozer. With a fresh grind and hone it is wonderful for finishing the bottom of a bowl.

As others have said, we each have to figure out what is most comfortable and best way for the result we want. Several catalogs have many pages of tools each promising or at least implying that if we buy this or that Famous Turner endorsed tool we will instantly be an accomplished turner. Ain't gonna happen. Two hours a day in front of the lathe with a decent sharp tool on 10 to 15 consecutive days will surprise you.

Here are some of my early adventures with turning:

https://www.woodworkforums.com/search...rchid=20118146

I use a conventional grind and a long fingernail they both have there uses the conventional grind is far the better to start with and can cut a much deeper bowl than a fingernail especially if you take a little of the heel off.
You did not say how much experience you have turning bowls and which type of gouges you already own. If new then like many have stated start with a conventional grind and work up from that.

Originally Posted by Paul39

Orraloon's post reminds me that one of my most recent used bowl gouges is an actual 3/4 inch almost straight grind with the wings just a bit back of the bottom of the U. It has a nice open U shape. I have a huge long handle on it and grind it free hand resting on the flat rest used for grinding scrapers. The grind is called a bottom feeder.

Paul39 The description you give makes it sound like a spindle roughing gouge I hope I have read that wrong and it is in fact a bowl gouge

Paul39 The description you give makes it sound like a spindle roughing gouge I hope I have read that wrong and it is in fact a bowl gouge

This, with the rod 3/4 inch / 19mm:

http://cdn3.bigcommerce.com/s-pa1dw/products/79/images/394/Bowl_Gouge_2_WEB__73644.1441248297.380.380.jpg?c=2

There was also a 7/8 inch but I don't think I have enough horsepower to keep from stalling the lathe.

Originally Posted by Paul39

This, with the rod 3/4 inch / 19mm:

http://cdn3.bigcommerce.com/s-pa1dw/products/79/images/394/Bowl_Gouge_2_WEB__73644.1441248297.380.380.jpg?c=2

There was also a 7/8 inch but I don't think I have enough horsepower to keep from stalling the lathe.

Looks like I was reading it wrong

Originally Posted by Skew ChiDAMN!!

A swept back grind is definitely useful, although I think some people take them too far.

But, like a skew chisel, they can bite you hard if you misuse them.

Most of mine are all good quality std. gouges that I've ground back myself. If you ever intend to do similar, I suggest you avoid even trying with a v-profiled flutee. Stick with a deep U. Otherwise it's a nightmare trying to a) get the grind profile right and b) keep the grind profile right.

Just sayin'.

Absolutely

Originally Posted by brainstrust

I want to buy a good quality deep fluted bowl gouge with a side grind, no other specifics yet!

Any suggestions, ....?

Confused yet, BT?

Asking a group of woodturners which bowl gouge to get is like asking a dozen lawyers for legal advice and getting thirteen different opinions... : -0

I also have and use most makes, including the various flute styles. They are all quite good compared to what was available in the bad old days. You can't go badly wrong with any of them.

If I was buying my first bowl gouge today and could only have one I would get the D-way V flute and use the fingernail grind that comes on it as my starting point.

1/2" Bowl Gouge - Fingernail Grind | Bowl Gouges | D-Way Tools

Note: This is the opposite advice that has been offered by some of the other experienced turners here. None of us are wrong, we just have different opinions based on our extensive experience.

My Reasoning: In my experience the D-way gives the best finishing cut of all the gouges I have used. It doesn't hold its edge quite as well on our hardest woods as some of the high vanadium steels, but it takes the sharpest edge and in practice it is not that far behind any of the others on durability. A fair trade-off, IMO.

On the V flute profile, this is as much a matter of personal preference as anything. There are equally well qualified advocates for the U profile. I much prefer the V profile myself and also the swept back grind. This configuration also allows me to do a reverse scraping finishing cut on the inside of bowls up through the end grain as an additional use of the gouge.

I have an old P&N U fluted BG that is gathering dust on my tool rack that never gets used, which you would be welcome to try. From memory it is 5/8" and it currently has a straight across grind that you can modify. PM me if you are interested.

Freehand sharpening was the only option for my first three decades of turning. Since their introduction I prefer to use a jig. For me I don't find it any slower. For new turners it at least removes one variable.

I hope I haven't added to any confusion you may have already had.



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Now even more confused Neil Thought I had settled on a u shape but now you have me thinking.....
I do very much appreciate everyones experienced advice though, thats one thing i'm sure of!

Braintrust,

People made bowls before there were bowl gouges. All the learned esoteric discussions about the very best shape, metal, grind, handle, etc. are for down the road after you have made 20 or 50 bowls. Before then it won't make much difference. If you get a decent quality, medium size - 13mm, bowl gouge with a comfortable handle and use it for 50 hours, you will find that you can make a nice bowl quickly and not have to sand much.

Somewhere in that 50 hours you may or may not find that a different grind, or a larger or smaller gouge, or a U or V shape will work better. If you find that the one you have is very useful, but another different one would also be useful, you are on the way down the garden path to being a tool slut.

Says a guy with maybe 8 - 10 bowl gouges from 3/8 to 3/4 inch in U & V shapes. All but one bought used at 1/2 to 1/3 or less new price. They all work, some do a thing better than another.