Thread: CBN for Tormek

Originally Posted by

Moi?

Yes, VOUS!

Originally Posted by Pat

I have decided to order a Woodcut CBN wheel to replace my Tormek grey wheel, which is due for replacement anyway and bloody has corrupted/converted me to the spark/high speed versions . . . that will happen when I need to replace the current wheels.

I don't wish to rain on anyone's parade, but I don't get the concept of a CBN wheel on a Tormek when used for shaping/sharpening HSS woodturning tools.

Yes, a good CBN wheel doesn't need to be re-trued, so has that advantage over Alox.

And, there might be a case for that combination with carbon steel blades (cool/slow grind, etc).

But, for HSS woodturning steel, that seems to me akin to having a Ferrari and only being able to drive it at car park speed.

I'm not commenting here on the Tormek, per se, but on the optimum use of CBN wheels.

And, sure, the water and drip tray on the Tormek will collect and keep the metal swarf off the bench top and floor, but that for me would be a small advantage that comes at the cost of speed (and $s if you don't need the other advantages of the Tormek).

If I needed to sharpen more carbon than HSS I might have a different view.

Although, I have used my diamond and CBN wheels to rehab very thin carbon steel kitchen knives (down to 10deg included angle) without getting any of the dreaded blue. Likewise on a belt sander.

And, in case anyone thinks the above comments are based on any prejudice against waterstones, I love all of mine, but not for sharpening my HSS woodturning tools.

Hello Neil, everyone has there own preference for sharpening their tools. I shape and sharpen to a degree on my high speed grinder and then on the torment for final sharpen and to maintain the shape and sharpness. I use the jigs to help me maintain a single facet bevel, which to me, helps me make cleaner cuts and is aesthetically pleasing. My Torment wheel is due for replacing, it works (I tried it a DUTA) and it is actually a cheaper option then the oem product.

I've tried so many types of grinding methods, each with it's own pitfalls. I've had a Tormek for the last year or so and it's come close to being the mainstay of my grinding needs. But not close enough. My main gripe is that it's slooooow, it actually takes away time that can be well spent on the lathe. When the Tormek and CBN wheel combination was first suggested to me, my main thoughts were the same as Neil's. But, I'm actually after nirvana. Maybe this combination could be it?

I'd like a decent review on this, if I could please. I don't want to go and spend $300+ for nothing. So far Jim Carroll has answered 1 of my questions (is the wheel okay immersed in water). However does the CBN sharpen faster than the Tormek supplied wheel? (Pat, I'm looking at you! hehe). I'm wondering if Jim can answer this question as well, am I better off buying a Tormek blackstone over the CBN?

Sharpening nirvana seems so far away

First off Scott, a few questions for you.

1. Are you just sharpening turning tools or other woodwork or domestic tools?
2. Are you reshaping or sharpening?
3. What are you using the (turning) tools for and is the timber hard, soft or variable?
4. What sort of work? Fine stuff like Ken Wraight or stuff like normal people?
5. What did you have for breakfast?

Sharpening nirvana depends so much on what people are trying to achieve and what sort of work they do, it is a little bit variable in what is required.

The most important thing to remember is that sharpening is literally in the hands of the operator.

Originally Posted by

1. Are you just sharpening turning tools or other woodwork or domestic tools?

Woodwork only, specifically woodturning tools.

Originally Posted by

2. Are you reshaping or sharpening?

Both. I've got a small grinder with an alox wheel in it to reshape and use the Tormek for edge maintenance.

Originally Posted by

3. What are you using the (turning) tools for and is the timber hard, soft or variable?

Both.

Originally Posted by

4. What sort of work? Fine stuff like Ken Wraight or stuff like normal people?

Define normal More normal people stuff however I've caught the KW bug and have done some fine stuff.

Originally Posted by

5. What did you have for breakfast?

That'd be telling

Just to throw in another option: for high speed grinders taking both high carbon and HS steel take a look at Norton 3X wheels. They cut fast and cool (impt for HCS) but are slow to glaze and wear. They're $75 each and use seeded gel AlOx. The #46 is ideal for reshaping bevels esp. with abused bench chisels and plane blades. The #80 is for touch-ups.

Jim Davey Planes & Sharpening - eShop - Sales - Abrasives & Grinding

Declaration: no financial interest.

Hello Scott, I use Jim's demo model at DUTA. To me it took the same amount of time to refresh an edge as the gray torment wheel. A couple of reasons I am switching : Cost, the cbn is cheaper than the replacement Torment wheel and the fact that the cbn wheel does not lose diameter, keeping settings constant and repeatable. I run Alox wheels for grinding new bevels and major repair work - bloody concrete floors, but find even with the Torment wheel at #220 it takes me 20 - 30 seconds to get a fresh sharp edge for what ever concrete equivalent I am turning. I'll look seriously at replacing the Alox wheels with high speed CBN wheels when they are due.

One of the ways you can increase the rate of cut with a Tormek when you have to reshape a bevel is to run the diamond truing tool more rapidly across the wheel face so as to produce a grooved or 'corduroy' finish. That increases the effective pressure on the bevel. But also sees more of the exxy abrasive ending up in the water tray.

Get the CBN. It's absolutely awesome.

I just sold my slow speed grinder. I haven't used it once since I bought the CBN and gave me a spare 8" grinder of his.

I've done a bunch of chisels and about 100 hours on the tools with it and I'm still amazed at the quick Sharpen. Fairy fingers are the key.

Still use my Japanese stones for everything else, but for the lathe chisels it's no competition.

Get the CBN.

What we have found so far with the CBN wheel on the tormek is that the 180g works well, to improve the finish off the wheel the next lot will be 250g.

The reason behind this is that most want a far superior finish of the wheel plus those that use the mini tools find the 180g a little coarse compared to the 220g that is standard on the tormek.

If you do need to reshape a tool the best option is still the spark grinder with its faster speed set up with the BGM100 jig then move to the tormek and get that final finish

I have sharpened about 30 tools so far and it still feels a little coarse but is smoothing out with each use.

Originally Posted by Evanism

Still use my Japanese stones for everything else, but for the lathe chisels it's no competition.

Get the CBN.

Ditto