Thread: Which wood turning hazard is your highest priority?

Geoff,

You raise some interesting questions and issues. For me, the biggest risks / high ticket items are:

- dust / allergic reactions (I am working on a solution for this one with Bob L and others)
- visitors / novices / UFOs in my shed, always a problem with older people set in their ways (once is once too many and I'm up to two already)
- using unsound wood (which I don't) but there always can be surprises
- big platters (for which I always wear a shield)

As an ex duck shooter, my hearing is shot anyway, so I never wear muffs on the lathe.

Added provisos that lessen the risks:

- use good quality gear that won't let you down
- turn sharp
- learn quickly and cut wood well

Originally Posted by Mobyturns

I PPE items like face shields perform dual hazard control roles. They are actually a high order engineered control for preventing damage to face/eyes from very common lower mass flying objects as they intervene in the path between the hazard & the operator.

In pure OHS speak, face shields are not considered as a form of Engineering Control.

An engineering control is not usually worn but rather is part of a machine, building or an independent structure designed to automatically protect operators of other persons in the vicinity of a machine. Engineering controls often have have mechanical/electrical interlocks or other mechanisms that will not allow machinery to operate in certain situations.

An example for a lathe would be a safety screen bolted to the front of the lathe designed to protect the audience at a turning demonstration. A portable screen that someone has to remember to move into place is a weak engineering control.

Another example is a safety switch on the access cover to a belt position changing chamber. If the cover is open the switch would not allow the machine to start until the cover is closed.
These are pretty much standard on DP and BS but how many lathes do you know that have these?

No Volt switches are another type of engineering control.

As soon as a personal decision has to be made about whether or not a device has to be employed that is usually considered as PPE. PPE has a (sometimes fatal) weakness in that it is possible to forget to use it and that is one of the reasons why it is last on the hierarchy of control.

Automatic darkening welding helmets are in interesting case. The auto darkening feature itself is a form of engineering control but the whole helmet itself is still considered PPE because firstly the helmet has to be worn, then the operator has to remember to have the helmet flipped down (I still very occasional forget), and then they have to have it set to the correct setting.

A face shield capable of being recognising that it is on a person and in the flipped down position, linked to a wireless switch on a lathe is getting close to being an engineering control.

This is probably a good time to mention the hierarchy of control - if you don't know what it is then it is definitely worth following up and where possible apply it in your shed.

Dust collection in normally considered an engineering control but strictly speaking if the operator has to remember to turn it on before making then it has the same weakness as PPE. DCs that are interlinked to a machine start switch (like those VCs with the extra plug on them) are a bit closer BUT until they are hard wired so we don't have to remember to plug the power tool in they are not fully an engineering control. The other problem with those VCa is that they stop dust extracting when the power tool is turned of whereas they should keep going for ~10 minutes after the last dust making activity.

Originally Posted by BobL

In pure OHS speak, face shields are not considered as a form of Engineering Control.

Bob,

Trying not to get to deep just yet with the hierarchy of controls atm.

I agree with every thing you say. PPE is not an engineered control in strict OHS speak, but I prefer to disagree with the mainstream because the face shield does perform the role of an engineered control for low mass high speed flying particles. It is also becomes the primary control for low mass flying particles as there are very few practical alternatives available. It may not be a fixed part of the machine but it performs the role of intervening in the trajectory of the particle from the lathe to the operator very well and is a light weight, mobile, elegant & practical solution in that instance. It's achilies heel is definitely turners actually remembering to use one all the time so it can never be considered an "engineered control" on those grounds alone. I have edited the above to say "performs the role of ...." (thanks BobL I can't edit the other post anymore to fix that)

All controls suffer the subjective hazards - the people factor - because we rely upon people to acknowledge hazards and risk, to identify the hazard, then do something to fix it (control it), then actually implement the controls, review them and of course to actually remember to faithfully follow safe procedures.

Originally Posted by BobL

A face shield capable of being recognising that it is on a person and in the flipped down position, linked to a wireless switch on a lathe is getting close to being an engineering control.

BobL, I like this one - good idea - until you get the smart a**e that works out if you put it on a mannequin with the shield down then the lathe will work. Nothing is fool proof we just get smarter fools.

I lost my left eye when aged 6 and so for me eye protection is #1 priority.

Lately I notice an increasing reaction to dust and shavings so that comes in at #2.

Hearing protection when using a lathe is not so worrisome for me but it is when using a thicknesser or planer. So that is # 3.

Just a query, What is the best value for money face shield respiration protection availabble.
I don't want to go to a powered set up and I have to consider my glasses getting fogged up!!

Which wood turning hazard is your highest priority?

I believe the first priority should be to be absolutely certain you are well enough to go to the workshop or to remain there.

Like most people I have a few health issues, mine may be more then others being prostate cancer, an auto immune liver problem and my lungs have become smaller causing lack of breath. For these I have medications and various treatments which at times knocks me about to the extent that I feel uncomfortable to go to the workshop and have fun turning.

So unless I feel 100 % I stay indoors and ignore the lure of the workshop sirens that call me, yet I know of others that don't and go and turn when they are not well.

Peter.

I think you may be confusing an Engineering Control with an Engineered Product.

A face shield may well be engineered but it does not provide any protection if it hanging from a hook. A face shield is personal safety device worn by a person and is thus automatically classed as PPE and not an Engineering control. This is not my opinion it's part of the OHS hierarchy of control.

Engineered controls should be where possible designed to work without any user intervention or in some cases even a risk assessment - an example of this is motor vehicle air bags, whereas seat belts are worn so are definitely in the PPE class, even if the motor will not start with them in place.

At work we had an issue with the welding screens (to protect passers by from welding flash) on wheels so they could be moved out of the way as needed. This of course relied on the screens being put into place (weak engineering control) so we changed to overlapping hanging curtains that could easily be walked through but always stayed in place (Strong engineering control).

Originally Posted by Mobyturns

All controls suffer the subjective hazards - the people factor - because we rely upon people to acknowledge hazards and risk, to identify the hazard, then do something to fix it (control it), then actually implement the controls, review them and of course to actually remember to faithfully follow safe procedures.

If someone sets out to deliberately tamper with an engineering control, for which there are legal ramifications if someone is injured or killed, then I agree. However, I assume folks will try to do the right thing and will not deliberately tamper with engineered safety controls or if they do over ride them there is a risk assessed reason in doing so.

At tafe the toolrest was also a guard, is it an engineered control? And who removes toolrest for sanding bowls?!

I would not turn wood at all without eye protection and dust protection. I don't bother with using my dust extraction system while turning, just use a good mask.
I also wear earmuffs, not so much cause I think the noise of the lathe is harmful, because I often spend all day at it and my earmuffs have a radio in them which helps with the boredom.
As I work alone I have found out that a potential accident can happen if someone appears out of the blue in my workshop when I don't expect it, it makes you jump which can be dangerous when your using woodwork machinery....or even sharp hand tools. The radio earmuffs can add to this scenario as you will find it harder to hear someone turn up.
Also very careful not to have loose/baggy clothing on.
If I'm turning really big stuff I will put on one of my motorbike crash helmets.
I don't ever turn and drink.
Trying to think safety and be aware of any possible dangers all the time has always been important as at times in my life if I'd had an accident and been knocked out it might have been days before someone had dropped by.

ARTME, if you wan't a really good dust mask I'd recommend a Sundstrom half face mask. They are tops.Unless you sport a beard, then no mask type respirator works very well.

An excellent and thought provoking thread. BobL's mention of "hierarchy of control" reminds me that there can also be a hierarchy of consequences. For example, a relatively minor blow can take an operator by surprise and cause them to lose balance and get entangled in a machine. A minor stroke could cause a fall with major injuries in an untidy shed. Murphy's law is waiting for us so thinking about and mitigating the possibility of worst case scenarios is good policy.

As posted in the other thread, the priority order for me is as follows:

• Being an asthmatic I give the highest priority to my lungs

• Second priority is my eyesight

• Third priority is my hearing. I already have tinnitus and hearing loss

• Fourth priority is physical trauma to fingers and head.

Optimising against dust risk (ie lung damage) means a noisy cyclone (approx 90bB), plus the air delivery noise inside the confined space of a positive pressure helmet-mask that also protects my eyesight.

To protect my hearing from that noise I use earplugs (Moldex Sparkplugs). Yes, it reduces my chances of hearing any developing faults in the wood, but that is reduced anyway with all the noise from the dust protection systems.

However, I might risk a few minutes of dust or noise exposure, as those risks accumulate over the years, but I never turn on the lathe without first putting on a facemask.

I think I will give up wood working and take up a new hobby watching the grass grow....

Jim

Originally Posted by chuck1

At tafe the toolrest was also a guard, is it an engineered control? And who removes toolrest for sanding bowls?!

Its a guard in a certain situation and a risk in others.
Overall I'd say its' a weak engineering control.

Originally Posted by powderpost

I think I will give up wood working and take up a new hobby watching the grass grow....

Jim

You wont have to wait long now and you will be able to see it grow - fast.

Old codgers like you know it all and have more real experience than most of us put together. Seriously though Jim you are one of the safest turners I have seen even though we differ on some topics.