Thread: My first box - work in progress

My box is 19mm thick.
The glued mitres are around 27mm
Glued with Titebond III.

I'll try to remember to add a note to the box with a date stamp.
"Completed August 1st 2018"

I'd be interested in knowing the repair info including when first built without splines or keys.

I won't be making splines or keys for this first box.
But will absolutely be doing them at some stage.
They are just too pleasing to the eye.
And since they add strength then so much the better.

My box building mentor rescued me by finished the top for me after my back gave out.
Gotta start my back strengthening exercises again.
And cleaned up the top and bottom edge of the box.
While instructing me on filling mitre gaps etc.


Love the wet glossy look of this pic.
The top is done except for the hinges.
IMG_0143.jpg

Can't even feel where the frame meets the centre piece.
Feel like glass.

Sent me home with the hinge work using chisels.
After instructing me on how to sharpen chisels.
(Chisels definitely not my thing.)
I won't detract from this thread by posting my first ever chisel for hinges work on my first box.
(Did you hear me screaming? Horse now from screaming so much! LOL!)

Just wanted to thank my Box Building Mentor (forum member) for all the support, patience, and hands on training.
I was extremely lucky to find someone to instruct me thru my first box.
A considerable amount of hours to say the least.
Very much appreciated!

Another accuracy vid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlnxdaSygas


mitre (not bevel) preset for 45° is off by 1/4°

set fence to match zero preset
It looks slightly off in this photo but its not its just the angle of the camera lens
IMG_0167.jpg

preset 45° mitre is left of mark and results in 5 mm gap
IMG_0168.jpg

pulled out of preset
and set to result of 0 gap
Must remember to adjust 1/8 of gap
Must remember to cut and recut all 8 ends.
looks like .25° or 1/4 of a degree off
IMG_0166.jpg

This metal clamp is dangerous
Might not be for clamping timber
Inside diagonal measurements match
IMG_0169.jpg


I do remember having this question before:
"Can I adjust the 45° preset to centre the scale on 45° mark.
I remember ringing Makita about it.
I can't remember exactly what they told me.
But never got around to experimenting with it.
-----
I do remember now, that someone did confirm, you could slightly adjust the preset.
But I wasn't ready to have a fair go at the time.

Just rang an authorised repairers.
Who told me you can't adjust the presets.
Another sounded like he wanted to experiment.
Another was absolutely sure he could. $70.
Bummer.

Barry, I should probably shut up seeing the box is nearly done, but I can’t help myself.

I’m looking at your photo of the lid 3 posts up. I can’t help wondering what the inside panel of the lid is made from. It looks like solid timber - probably redgum. If so, then there is a problem. If the outside frame of the lid is simply glued to the inside panel (with or without a fixing mechanism such as dominos), then expansion/contraction of the inside panel is going to work against the outer frame. As the inside panel contracts you get gaps, as it expands it will split the mitre joints apart. From a design perspective, it’s best to regard e/c wrt solid timber as an unstoppable and immutable force, which it isn’t quite but close enough.

For that style I would usually use plywood with veneer for the lid panel. With most man made boards you can effectively ignore expansion/contraction. Not so solid timber.

My apologies if I read this all wrong and you have already taken e/c into account in some way which is not visible.

Any and all suggestions are appreciated.

I'll be keeping this one and will report if mitre joints split.

P.S. Did you see my queries on the box pic you posted?

Originally Posted by barrysumpter

Any and all suggestions are appreciated.

I'll be keeping this one and will report if mitre joints split.

P.S. Did you see my queries on the box pic you posted?

No, sorry, I missed those.

I dont remember that one exactly but I made a lot like that and the method was:

The panel is veneer on 4 or 6 mm plywood. Made oversize. Both sides veneered. Cleaned up.

Frame is 4 pieces thicknessed to final dimensions, then rebates for the panel cut in. Mitres cut using specialised tablesaw sled - the only way I’ve ever found accurate enough. Inside edges of frame and lower face of panel sanded to finish grade. Glued up using a band clamp.

After glueing the frame is passed beam-on through a drum sander a few times to make the joints flat and pretty.

The panel is then cut exactly to size and glued in place (into the rebates). The cutting is the difficult bit, needs patient sneaking-up cuts.

Then the slots for the slip feathers are cut, using one of those little rotary saw things that runs in a drill press. Slip feathers glued in.

Slip feathers trimmed back. Tablesaw set to about 70 degrees, tall fence fitted and moved in close, and the bevels cut using the method I mentioned earlier, just sliding along the tall fence.

Finally, sanded using a linisher (or later a hv edge sander) and drum sander. Brief hand/Ros sand to 350 grit.

Pva glue used throughout. No joint, ever, has failed.

Barry,

As with almost everything there are different views. Matt Kenney (Fine Woodworking) doesn’t agree splines are always necessary:

https://www.finewoodworking.com/2015...-reinforcement

and the views on Lumberjocks also differ:

Splines for strength on a mitred jewelry box. Do I really need 'em? - by Babieca @ LumberJocks.com ~ woodworking community

Some woods take glue better than others, some people (including me) size the joints before glue-up. The size of the box and its use are also factors.

That said, for a jewellery box of around 300 x 200x 85 with mitred corners I definitely would use some strengthening, although I don’t use slipfeathers as I don’t like the look. Just a personal thing, but I prefer to hide the mechanics with internal splines.

Cheers,

Brian

Need a bit more of an engineers perspective

The bottom right hand corner shows the turret for setting the mitre (not the bevel).
It looks like those slots are solid set into the the turret.
I don't see any way to adjust just the 45° bevel setting only.
Again the 0° is perfect.

Anyone else?

LS1216L_01_2.jpg

Originally Posted by homey

Barry,

As with almost everything there are different views. Matt Kenney (Fine Woodworking) doesn’t agree splines are always necessary:

https://www.finewoodworking.com/2015...-reinforcement

and the views on Lumberjocks also differ:

Splines for strength on a mitred jewelry box. Do I really need 'em? - by Babieca @ LumberJocks.com ~ woodworking community

Some woods take glue better than others, some people (including me) size the joints before glue-up. The size of the box and its use are also factors.

That said, for a jewellery box of around 300 x 200x 85 with mitred corners I definitely would use some strengthening, although I don’t use slipfeathers as I don’t like the look. Just a personal thing, but I prefer to hide the mechanics with internal splines.

Cheers,

Brian

I think it comes down to your appetite to risk.

I understand Barry would prefer to pass over these issues just to get box number one finished. Box number 2 can be the one his great-grandkids will fight over, and be made accordingly.

On the subject of veneer slips, here’s a box I made with veneer slips on side and lid. Visible, but only just. I like the look, I have found that exposing a little of the making is something people appreciate because it shows the maker took the time to find the balance between aesthetics and strength. It is a personal thing though.

This box is a bit scratched and banged around. Daily use and a cat that chews timber.

Again, hope the photo orientates itself right.

Cheers
Arron

F9F5C74B-3EE9-409E-A4D4-6AF929089F79.jpg

wow now that is thin.
was that cut with a Japanese pull saw?

That trench for the top look like it was 1mm from the top.

F9F5C74B-3EE9-409E-A4D4-6AF929089F79.jpg...

[QUOTE=Arron;2100360] It is a personal thing though.[QUOTE]

Agree 100% with Arron. That’s what makes it all so interesting - seeing what others like and why, while there is no such thing as “the right way”. For “heirloom” boxes I always prefer dovetails - again a very personal thing - I’ve like dovetails since I started stuffing them up in the 1960’s at school. I do like the thought that some of my boxes will be around after I’m gone. That’s why I use clean white card for box linings rather than Cornflakes packets. No real advantage, just a bit of vanity that when the box eventually falls apart or is repaired they will not know what I had for breakfast!!!

I’m always excited by the thought that the next box might be the ‘perfect’ one (whatever that is) -although it never is.

Thanks to all who contribute to the box making threads - I have learned so much.

Brian

PS Just have to love a cat who likes to chew timber. Clearly a moggie of good taste.

Originally Posted by barrysumpter

wow now that is thin.
was that cut with a Japanese pull saw?

That trench for the top look like it was 1mm from the top.

F9F5C74B-3EE9-409E-A4D4-6AF929089F79.jpg...

No, the top isn’t a panel floating in a dado. It’s plywood, veneered on two sides again. It’s simply cut to size and set into a rebate running around the top of the glued-up box. In fact it’s done in the same manner as the one I described earlier in the thread.

Not done with a pull saw. In fact it’s all done with a tablesaw and a drum sander. Even the top with the time consuming marquetry is put through the drum sander, even though it’s done in 0.64mm commercial veneers. Both machines can be very precise.

Originally Posted by barrysumpter

Need a bit more of an engineers perspective

The bottom right hand corner shows the turret for setting the mitre (not the bevel).
It looks like those slots are solid set into the the turret.
I don't see any way to adjust just the 45° bevel setting.

Anyone else?

LS1216L_01_2.jpg

Is this what you are trying to do https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vJNsvcom6A
I have the 10" model and I remember that I was able to loosen 2 screws on a plate underneath that allowed the table to be swivelled slightly to get the mitre exactly right and then tighten them again.

Thanks but nope.
That vid just shows how to adjust for close to the presets.
It does NOT show have to precisely set the presets.

The 0° is perfect because you set the fence to the 0° preset.

The 45° preset it off by 1/4°

I want to move the 45° preset by 1/4"

----

Wait a minute!

Maybe do it in reverse order.

Set the blade to the preset 45°.

Move the scale to the exact 45°.

Then move to the blade to the 0° preset.

Then reset the fence to the 0° preset blade.

???

Grrrr. That sounded right the first time it went thru my head.
Now it doesn't.
Because I'm still setting the fence to the 0° preset. Where the preset hasn't changed.