Thread: Timber box sizes for markets

Well, from experience i would say that,

Whatever you make they won't want.
Whatever you don't make they will want.
And sometimes you get lucky

Mix it up with varying styles and sizes.

It's extremely hard to pick what people want. A couple of examples: First, I had three boxes in a gallery for eighteen months and was losing hope of them selling, even though they were really nice boxes. Then in the space of a week, they all sold to different people. Second, I made a box for an exhibition which was an experiment. After I'd finished it, I wasn't sure the experiment had been successful, so I put a second, quite different box in as well. Both sold as soon as the exhibition opened. DD above sums it up well.

Figure it backwards.

Go to the markets and take a walk around. Look at stuff. Look at what sells as you wander. Don't matter what: t shirts/crafts/ a brown eyed puppy.... What you're looking for isn't what sells, but what it sells for.

From there you'll get an idea of what the discretionary spending limit is locally. Its often very local because of microeconomic stuff.

70% of your stuff needs to be profitable around that limit.
15% of your stuff needs to be profitable below that limit.
15% of your stuff the sky is the limit... that's about what you can do, as opposed to what you can do for a price.

If you can't make a box under the local discretionary spend limit don't make it.

Depending on what type of market you intend trying your hand at you may also need to consider the likes of an EFTPOS machine as boxes probably won't fall into the "got the cash in my pocket" category. Most people nowadays carry very little cash especially younger people. If someone sees something they like and needs to go get cash, they usually don't come back.

Hi WC
It's all about the finish ... and the design of course.

By finish I mean both inside and outside.

A nice waxed finish .. combined with a bit of velvet lining and small dividers goes great.

Only the woodworkers passing by ... just looking and not buying .... will be able to critically assess the difference between handcut dovetails and machined finger joints... trust me on this.

The designs need to be unique... and individual ... a row of the same/same doesn't do well.... you just take up table space ... keep the extra copies under the table ... something about being the last of it's kind on the that table brings sales rather than promises of Ï'll be back"

At markets you will find it difficult to sell the $300 plus boxes ... need to do that in art studios or galleries. So pick designs and wood that you can manage within a 3 hr turnover per piece (from start to finish).

Dont forget to brand .. or put on a sticker with your phone number for repeat business after the markets close.

Good luck

Rob

For selling stuff direct, markets are a complete waste of time.

For taking orders, markets are an order-taking nirvana!!!!

I only ever display samples. I keep three copies of A3 binders with samples and photographs of everything I've ever made. Even if the photos are bad, that's ok. Officeworks makes these books up for you. In the book I put indicative pricing ($150-$250... $40-$80, etc). At the front I have a take away sheet listing woods, finishes, options and ideas.

Always always always ask for an order and always always ask for them to come back with their own ideas. ONLY EVER talk to the women. Men are a complete 100% waste of time. Flick them off ASAP. Women will quickly tell you "hubby can do this" and "hubby can do that".... But then say "but he never actually does it", or "his skill isn't what he thinks it is" or "it's been 2 years and...". Again, the men will sneer and claim they can do what you do... But watch the wife's eyes. If they roll in her head, it's a slam dunk 100% sale.

ALWAYS ask her to take a card. Offer it and say "just for later, just in case you think of something. I love to talk about ideas".

I get a 100% strike rate with these, every single time. I've at least 25 repeat clients. All lovely ladies. Not one dude

Thanks for the tips guys. I will sus out my local markets and talk with the organisers as some of them said that I would be the only one selling timber items so I may have a chance. Thanks for the tip on getting rid of the time wasters quickly.

Originally Posted by woodPixel

For selling stuff direct, markets are a complete waste of time.

For taking orders, markets are an order-taking nirvana!!!!

I only ever display samples. I keep three copies of A3 binders with samples and photographs of everything I've ever made. Even if the photos are bad, that's ok. Officeworks makes these books up for you. In the book I put indicative pricing ($150-$250... $40-$80, etc). At the front I have a take away sheet listing woods, finishes, options and ideas.

Always always always ask for an order and always always ask for them to come back with their own ideas. ONLY EVER talk to the women. Men are a complete 100% waste of time. Flick them off ASAP. Women will quickly tell you "hubby can do this" and "hubby can do that".... But then say "but he never actually does it", or "his skill isn't what he thinks it is" or "it's been 2 years and...". Again, the men will sneer and claim they can do what you do... But watch the wife's eyes. If they roll in her head, it's a slam dunk 100% sale.

ALWAYS ask her to take a card. Offer it and say "just for later, just in case you think of something. I love to talk about ideas".

I get a 100% strike rate with these, every single time. I've at least 25 repeat clients. All lovely ladies. Not one dude

The people who visit your stall have a complete different mind set to those i encounter. I will have up to 20 boxes on display for sale and i find i'm able to cover most tastes if people just like and want for themselves or think the recipient will like it as a gift.

What i find hard to fathom is the ones who will pick a box and ask if i could make one to fit said items. I confirm that i can, confirm the design and the timber but i obviously need to know the size of the items so i can make it for THEM. I tell them how long it will take, they take a card and promise to get back to me that afternoon and then i never hear from them again. This has happened many times and I've even googled my own name just to make sure there is nothing scaring people off

Sales is a wicked job. One persons "skills" translate into something creepy on another.

I don't know what the X-factor is for it, but I do apply a very simple formula. I target only the women. Men are OK to talk to, for many will gather around and compliment you or ask questions - but they won't purchase. The women however are completely different. They love to pick up, inspect, ask questions. Use open hand gestures to show it (fingers together, palm up, like a servant would serving food), don't point, invite them to touch it. Invite them to smell the item.

I find a story really really helps. Where did the wood come from (mapleman!, dustEater! great stories), the intention of the thing and finally my patented "a box holds secret and sacred things" dialogue.

You can't finish up with a "call me if you want something" or similar. Its a dead end. Finish with "keep my card, just in case. If you have an idea, email me and we can talk about it".

Leave it with an open dialogue/invitation. Don't close it.

Also, a good seller must be a magpie. Talk, talk, talk. All too often I go to markets and see vendors sitting in a deckchair all too unwilling to stand up. Gods that irritates me. No quicker way to kill a sale.

Also also, NEVER EVER ask a person "how they are". (a.k.a Bunnings "greeters"... owww arrr ya?) DEAD. END. Ask them an open question... "This box is my sisters favourite"...."Do you have many wooden things at home?".... "These items are fairly generic for the markets and are very nice, I custom make too"...

Thank them for visiting somewhere early on in the conversation and AGAIN thank them towards the end. I read a review by an accounting firm (of all things) and they statistically showed that sales improve 20% simply by thanking the person for their time. A small show of gratitude made a HUGE impression on the sale and post sale follow up.

On each box, I also write a quick note to include with it on care, the story, the materials, what to do if it's damaged (return it for a fix!) or if extra trays or internals are needed.

woodPixel - I think you're well ahead of the curve

Some very useful tips there for selling any handmade items. Like you, I often see glum-looking people sitting behind a table of items for sale at markets, not engaging with customers, and wonder why they think they can sell anything to anyone......

Some people have the gift of the gab, some don't, but there are methods (like yours) available to all to help close the gap. Once learned, of course, it is amusing to see the same techniques being used on yourself

Selling isn't a natural skill. One must learn it. No one is "natural" in as much they innately know how to sell, those people are just genuinely helpful... And their friendliness and helpfulness gets them some of the way there. People like their vibe. Being introvert/extrovert is irrelevant. There is no "type", only helpful.

I was very lucky to have a boss very early on in my career who thought sales should be "taught". What to say, what to do, how to present, asking of open/closed questions, knowing the products features/benefits/advantages and how to close. (Equally, what Not to do for each of these!)

For some it feels vile and artificial and approach it mechanically... Or worse, use it to manipulate people into buying the wrong product. I see this all the time at Hardly Normal and... Ugh... Bunninks.

Only yesterday I was there (gods help me!) and wandered through the gardening area and watched a (tool) trying to sell a whipper snipper to an older couple.. He was worse than useless, in fact, I'd say he talked himself out of a sale and poisoned the couple against buying there (good for small local business!).

All you are really doing is aligning a customers needs to what you can offer. One shouldn't need to force a sale, it's distasteful. So is sticking to a "script" or "method". It revolts me seeing salespeople sticking to a mechanical dialogue. They aren't helping people or giving them what they need. They are simply ramming a square peg into a round hole.

But here we are all super passionate about wood, woodwork, process and the love of hand made things. That's easy to sell, for you jut externalise your passions. People are at the markets to experience them... Smells, sights, tastes, touches... Simply give them what they are there for

What is a bit hard is keeping it up for the day. It burns me out and takes a lot of mental energy.

Mr Brush, you are right about being sold to. There is nothing worse than the aforementioned businesses, for you know in your soul that they have little/no product knowledge (perhaps dangerously wrong knowledge*) and were literally selling washing machines or watering plants yesterday.


* there is a thread where people were regaling the forum about the insanely dangerous electrical info being advised to customers in the Bunnings electrical area. Eye poppingly dangerous stuff....

I don't like to be sold to so i try not to go there unless i see a glimmer of interest. I always greet and then wait for them to make eye contact and when they do i may tell them a little about the item they were looking at. If they are standing with their hands behind their back, or have their hands full i will hand them the box, this usually gets their interest and gets them asking questions. And yes the majority of buyers are women with the men folk lurking in the background trying to stay out of it.

I really enjoy talking with people who know about or like wood and are aware of what goes into making things, most will be honest and tell you if your pricing is good or not.

I always have cards on the table and most people will take one and if not ill invite them to take one. I also have some pens printed with my name which i give out to anyone who shows interest.

All purchases are wrapped in tissue paper and presented in a "eco friendly" brown paper bag with handles that i stamp my name on. I also include a care and maintenance sheet a pen and a business card as well as a decal for the car.

Oh, and then there are the people who stop just because they love the smell