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Hi guys, there are a few flattening plates on the market but the ones i have looked more closely is the Veritas and the shapton. There seem to be a huge difference in the plates. I'm talking about the cast iron plates used for flattening off yr stones etc.
So anyone have any experience with both that can draw some conclusion?
For what it's worth I just use a large thick piece of Floated glass seems to work just fine.
Cheers
Steve
Hi Steve, i use glass at the moment as well. Just looking for a little cleaner solution that's all.
Hi SinjinQuote:
Originally Posted by sinjin
The flattening plates you mention are for two different purposes.
The Veritas plate is for lapping blades or planes. Just a plate (although ground with precision). It uses loose grit.
The Shapton is for lapping waterstones. It is a diamond plate made to very high tolerances.
Regards from Perth
Derek
I use a piece of marble from a kitchen worktop. Kitchen fitters who use this material always have a bit left over that they cut out to fit the sink. If you ask nicely they'll give it to you for free.
Where this whole lapping plate situation confuses me is what does one use to lap his lapping plate once that is slightly worn?
If your lapping the sole of your plane with grit or lapping a stone(who's function is to wear away metal) on a plate then surely it will wear down over time also.
I just use 12mm glass with wet&dry or sanding belts for rougher grits. No problems so far. The plusses with glass marble etc is you can get it cut to a larger size than most conventional lapping plates come, so you get longer strokes before the heel/toe of your plane or whatever overlaps the edge.
Makes more sense to me
Regards,
Lewis Allen.
Hi Lewis i'm the same as you.. i use glass and WD paper.. i just wanted to get it a bit cleaner using plates. The plate from Shapton is around the $500US mark..bit of a gob smack..
The "Diamond lapping plate" as they call it seems to be for the glass stones? and you can get it considerably cheaper Sharpening Supplies - Shapton Ceramic Water Stones.
And for general stone truing they offer these.
Haven't tried either sorry, but have been researching a fair bit recently as I am up for a purchase of a new sharpening system also, but not for a while.
Lie-Nielsen Australia are also Shapton dealers from memory so maybe give them a call.
Hope this Helps.
For flattening my carborundum oil stones I use a concrete paver ,water and garnet blasting grit .
I use a circular figure of 8 pattern turning the stone end to end frequently and keep the grinding medium fairly wet .
Kev
You can view a video on this blog about flattening waterstones using a diamond whetstone.
| giant Cypress
This blog is by member wilburpan.
I think it is a very simple and easy way to keep your waterstones flat.:D
Cheers
Gunn
Is there more potential for actually putting convex camber on your stone by doing plate to stone rather than the usual stone to plate? I saw Rob Cosman do it on one of his online videos recently (with Shapton stones and plate) and I thought "he seem to know what he's doing in this whole woodwork lark but it just doesn't look right". And now the Giant cypress is doing it too. Have been doing it all wrong?
Cheerio,
Virg.
The top of the line flattening plate from shapton is a double sided unit. It cost around the $500.00 US...so can only imagine what it costs here in Aust.
Shapton have a few options in plates, and at different prices. The double sided one has one side for lapping blades and the other for waterstones. Not necessary.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Which one did you get Derick?? Derick by chance you don't have any links for the N02 or NO 3 Lie Neilson do you??
Hi Sinjin
Basic, single-side. On the right ..
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a2...mondstones.jpg
A cheaper alternative is the Extra Coarse DMT diamond stone on the left.
Links to LN planes? Not sure what you mean.
Regards from Perth
Derek
sorry i ment do you know of any reviews for either of those 2..Heaps for No4 etc. can't find any for the 1,2 or 3..thanks anyway
The DMT DuoSharp plate in Coarse/Extra Coarse (shown on the left in Derek's photo) may not ultimately be as flat as the Shapton diamond plate, but I would contend that it is more than good enough for flattening waterstones, etc. for sharpening purposes. By the time you've run a blade over a flattened stone (even a Shapton) just a few times....it ain't perfectly flat any more !
(1) Its much cheaper than the Shapton plate, especially if bought on eBay from various US sellers. I think I paid under A$100 for the largest DuoSharp with Coarse diamond on one side and Extra Coarse on the other.
(2) Use the Extra Coarse (black) plate for flattening stones, etc., while the Coarse (blue) plate is useful for rapidly forming new primary bevels, cleaning up chipped cutting edges, etc.
Since using a DuoSharp to flatten waterstones, I've noticed that I get a much flatter surface bringing the (oversize) diamond plate to the stone rather than rubbing the stone on a plate or abrasive on glass. Remember the larger DuoSharp has a 10" x 4" abrasive surface, i.e. much larger than most waterstones or Shaptons.
I have a couple of the Shapton M5 ceramic plates on order from Stu (in 5000 and 12000 grit), so looking forward to taking my sharpening beyond the 8000 grit I currently use......:o.
Thanks for your replies.
My stones.
Norton 320 i think it is and 2000 and 4000
King 800, 1000, 6000, 10,000
Japanese natural stone...not sure who knows but around the 15,000 plus
Diamond plates, fine medium and coarse.
Flattening 12mm float glass and w&d
The reason i was talking about the Shapton double sided plate is a couple i have spoken to on the phone who use them say they are very good except for the cost as i said around the $500 bracket. As people like Harold Stanley from HMS tools says.
Plenty of systems work but these new plates just make it easier and quicker.
For Japanese blades etc...its all fine. On Western blades where we tend to have micro bevels 1mm wide maybe its not nearly so obvious how flat stones are.
But when doing Japanese plane blades etc i seem to be flattening water stones alot to keep the bevel dead flat. And this goes for a couple of very big Japanese chisels i have also..roughly 50 and 65m wide chisels.
Anyway i think what works for everyone is well and good.
I use the same idea but use a Besser block - the sides are large and surprisingly square.Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodlee
sinjin - I think you'll find the coarse Norton stones pretty hopeless for flattening. They are so soft that they dish after only a few strokes with an A2 blade.
Unfortunately I bought a Norton 220 grit before I worked this out. Its still lurking at the bottom of my waterstone pond, unused and unloved......:(
Hi SinjinQuote:
Originally Posted by sinjin
An observation: a flat stone is really needed when (1) you are lapping the back of a blade, or (2) if you use a honing guide.
A flat stone is far less critical if you freehand a blade (since the effective length of the stone is increased). Honing guides require a longer (and therefore flatter) expanse to work.
Harrelson Stanley is the agent for Shaptons in the USA, so he would be supporting the use of the Shapton diamond plates. He is a good guy, nevertheless, and has much to offer in the world of sharpening. Get his DVD on "Side Sharpening". It can change your world.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Derek i have his DVD. And Derek i will have to just disagree with you about how flat plates need to be free or or using a jig for Japanese blades and thats whats these forums so good everyone has an opinion.
Hello, do you guys recommend the DuoSharp with Coarse diamond on one side and Extra Coarse on the other, or the Fine / Coarse combination for flattening waterstones? I have the #1200 and #6000 grit stones.
Definitely Extra Coarse/Coarse, and preferably the 10" DuoSharp. If you have a look on eBay there are several US sellers offering these at a fraction of local prices.
About 12 months ago, when the exchange rate was nowhere near as good as today, I got a complete set of 10" DuoSharps (Extra Coarse/Coarse, Fine/Extra Fine), plus the DuoSharp base, including shipping, for less than the price of ONE DuoSharp locally.
I'm sure there are still some good eBay deals on these.
thanks MrB for this advice, am following it up now. Out of interest, what would be the effect of trying to flatten a waterstone with the Fine / Extra Fine Duosharp ( 600/ 1200 grits)
I'm sure it would work.................eventually. You'd be there a long time though !
Ceramic stones like the Shapton are pretty hard, so you need a fairly aggressive abrasive to flatten/de-glaze them quickly.
To be honest I use both the Coarse and Extra Coarse sides of the DuoSharp for flattening stones, and either works just as well.
Maybe check out the best eBay prices you can find on the 10" DuoSharp, then price up one of Stu's diamond flattening plates for comparison?
Haven't bought from this guy, but here's one example:
Sharpening Stone DMT DuoSharp 10" Coarse/Extra Coarse (eBay item 230575228857 end time 17-Feb-11 08:12:00 AEDST) : Home Garden
That's about A$125 including shipping......vs. about A$200 locally.