Is Pfeil steel good?

[Frank&Earnest]

No offence taken, Ivan, we are saying the same thing. What I was after was a statement, similar to the one you linked, by someone who could state with authority: "Pfeil uses ZZZ steel, which looks different from all others because of YYY and it is preferred because XXX". Then it is up to the individual, whatever his/her level of expertise, to decide accordingly.

[issatree]

Hi Again,
I just have to reply to rrser & nz carver.
I my opinion, 95% of " The Carvers " I know, all use Pfiel.
I'm talking about Ladies as well as Men who only Carve.
I go to "The Carve-In " every year, held at the Lady Northcote Recreation Camp, between Bacchus Marsh & Anakie, at Glenmore-Rowsley Area.
We have up to 52 " Serious Carvers " for a weekend in May.
Unfortunately I'm not aware of any of them who belong to these Forums, because they could write for themselves.
There is a big Group in Doncaster, People from Bendigo, Glenmore, & the Geelong Group Vic. as well, & I will swear, they all use Phiel Carving Chisels, & they all can't be wrong.
Regards,
issatree.
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[jimbur]

Another related question is, "how many only use one brand?" I'd be surprised if there were many who stick to one brand only.
Cheers,
Jim

[rsser]

Issatree, you might as well say that since lots of folks drive Fords they must be good. But when you take a look at their fault rates ....

The only way to properly answer 'how good?' is with comparative tests. One from AWR has been posted. Feel free to check the FWW website for my recollection but their test report may only be available to subscribers.

[Frank&Earnest]

Yep. What you said. I am concerned for the desperation shown by your signature, though. Thanks for the quote I borrowed for mine.

[issatree]

Hi Ern,
I think your a little rough on comparing a Chisel to a Ford that has 1000's of moving parts against a Chisel of 2 pieces. Never owned a Ford & never will.
I would rather go for " Word of Mouth " on the likes of these particular Chisels, than on Words in a Book.
You have to believe in the People who use any of these Chisels.
The People who write up these Reports, get paid to do so, where as the People who Use These Chisels don't, & are always there to help you.
F & E, if you are going to carve Totem Poles, then you have to get something different.
If you are just going to Carve Mirror Frames or Birds or Animals, then the Pfeil will see you through, Dastra if you like, & someone said 2Cherry's, or whatever.
Get into Carving & get that Pfeiling, as it is very relaxing, frustrating sometimes as well.
Regards,
issatree.
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[Frank&Earnest]

Get into Carving & get that Pfeiling,

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I'll pay the pun.

[rsser]

It's not a comparison issatree, it's an analogy.

'Word of mouth' .... at one stage and place in woodturning, those words had you hollowing a bowl with a scraper.

The 'words in a book' that you choose to ignore come from expert tool users using thorough methods to test popular opinion.

Popular opinion ..... groupthink; the herd view?

[jimbur]

It's not a comparison issatree, it's an analogy.

'Word of mouth' .... at one stage and place in woodturning, those words had you hollowing a bowl with a scraper.

The 'words in a book' that you choose to ignore come from expert tool users using thorough methods to test popular opinion.

Popular opinion ..... groupthink; the herd view?

Heard it described as pooling ignorance and expecting a sensible result. However, it works for religion and politics. Doesn't it?
Cheers,
Jim

[underfoot]

The only way to properly answer 'how good?' is with comparative tests. . Feel free to check the FWW website .

Curiosity got the better of me and I checked the FWW "editors" review of the Pfiel bench chisel.
Interestingly there were two reviews of the same chisel by different editors

This by Chris Gochnour in 2008
Because of its shape, the hornbeam handle is particularly easy to grasp from the end. The blade was perfectly flat with nicely softened edges, making it easy on the hands. The cutting edge held up better than average. The fine craftsmanship and high performance make this a very close runner-up for best overall among the Western chisels

And this by Rex Alexander in 1999
this chisel’s large-diameter round handle keeps the blade from touching the bench at any point. I found that the chisel was always rolling around on the bench, something that none of the other tools did. This chisel ranked below all others in the toughness test. The tool scored an “average”

Hmmm......seems not even the experts can agree

[rsser]

Snap. Now back at a computer with a high speed link I just did the same.

AFAIK heat treatment is a skilled business and it may be reasonable to expect some variation in batches.

[underfoot]

Snap.
AFAIK heat treatment is a skilled business and it may be reasonable to expect some variation in batches.

This is the Swiss we're talking about here.....I don't think they have a translation for "batch variation"

[rsser]

LOL.

No, perhaps not.

But there's variation in all things.

Spice of life or burr in the sock depending on your attitude ;-}

[Frank&Earnest]

Aha, now I understand perfectly: to maintain their good reputation they hid the crappy batches in Australia!

[rsser]

Or maybe they thought they were sending them to Austria ;-}