Machinery without DE

[Astrodog]

Hi all
Could be sacrileges around here.... I'm looking at picking up thicknesser/jointer and table saw very soon. I do intent to sort out DE for them soon too, but need the planers mainly to finish off a bed project. So my question is - will the machines work ok for quick stuff without DE, and just make a mess.... I do wear a canister filter dust mask....
Jointer - 6", thicknesser 330mm, table saw TSC-10HB....
I know I should spring for the DE up front, but it may need to wait a few weeks or so.
Lee

[Ozkaban]

The jointer and table saw will be ok but will just make a big mess.

I think the thicknesser will struggle more, but I've not had a lot of experience with that. Maybe using a shopvac to clear it out after each pass would be OK? Others may offer better advice here.

Cheers,
Dave

[Jim Carroll]

The saw you could get away with just messy

The jointer and thicknesser definatly need a 2hp extractor.

If you dont use a dust extractor the shavings get dragged back in with the blade and not only do they cut but they compress the shavings between the timber and blades and leave nice impressions on the freshly planed timber.

[Astrodog]

So I really do need to stump for the DE up front?

[Ozkaban]

The saw you could get away with just messy

The jointer and thicknesser definatly need a 2hp extractor.

If you dont use a dust extractor the shavings get dragged back in with the blade and not only do they cut but they compress the shavings between the timber and blades and leave nice impressions on the freshly planed timber.

Thanks Jim. I stand corrected.

[Astrodog]

I thought I read on here somewhere you could get away with 1hp on jointer/thicknesser (1 machine a time)?? The overall plan was to get a 1hp for them, and a separate 2hp for TS....

[Harry72]

For the price for the two dustys a single 3hp will give more suction with a few $$$ left to help pay for pipe work and connections(which often cost's more than the machine).

[Jim Carroll]

I thought I read on here somewhere you could get away with 1hp on jointer/thicknesser (1 machine a time)?? The overall plan was to get a 1hp for them, and a separate 2hp for TS....

You can get away with the 1hp on a lathe or saw bench just but the others need the 2hp.
The 1hp are allright for getting the dust out of the way but heavy material can soon clog the pipes and reduce the draw on the extractor.

If you compare the cfm between a 1 and 2hp it is almost double and try and stick to a tiawanese one as they are more efficient again.

[BobL]

Astrodog, I notice in your first post you are concerned about wood dust dust as a health issue more than a the fact that a mess might be created.

If this is the case then neither a 1 or 2 HP unit will provide the flow rate and air speed to grab enough of the fine dust at source. To do this you will need ~4000 fpm linear airspeed and ~1000 cfm flow rates at the dust making source. The 400 fpm is easy to achieve (just make the collector aperture smaller) but doing that as well as achieving 1000 cfm is not so easy.

While some 2HP units will claim they can deliver 1000+ cfm this is often the capacity of the impeller without any restrictions ie without any bags. filters and/or ducting. In practice no 2HP is likely to achieve 1000 cfm a few minutes after it has started to collect dust. My experienced is that manufacturer quoted CFMs should be divided by about 2 to provide a more realistic working CFM

Of equal significance and acting as a counterbalance is where the DC is located. If a DC is located inside the work area, short of using a cyclone and a bank of HEPA filters at the outlet the fine dust will pour out of most DCs and fill up the work area. An alternative is to locate the DC outside the work area and duct the machines. I realize not everyone can do this but it is by far the safest method. Using longer and more ducting means lower CFM but the DC can always be left on for some time after the last dust making activity to clear the shed.

[Astrodog]

Best I could do, at least initially, is wheel the dusty to the open garage door and hope the wind is blowing the right way! Will eventually go down the cyclone/better filter, would like to get some damned machines first.... these dustys are no fun at all!

[BobL]

Best I could do, at least initially, is wheel the dusty to the open garage door and hope the wind is blowing the right way! Will eventually go down the cyclone/better filter, would like to get some damned machines first.... these dustys are no fun at all!

Unfortunately parking the DC in an opening such as a doorway is a waste of time. The DC creates a low pressure region of the machine and a high pressure in the region of the DC so the dust flow will be exactly from DC back to machine.

An alternative to putting the DC outside the shed is to enclose the DC in an air tight cabinet and vent the cabinet to the outside. I have seen several very mice implementations of this.
In both cases this also reduces the horrible noise these things make.