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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
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    Up North
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    Unhappy In trouble again

    Got the thing put together now.
    However, when I start up the spindle, when I get to 140 rpm it get an ol1 or an ol2
    Spindle is still cool and so is the coolant.
    Also, it refuses not to run backwards. Tried to swap wires, made no difference.
    Any recommendations please?
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
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    Canberra
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    Default

    I've forgotten - exactly what machine do you have?

  4. #3
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    Dec 2004
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    Default

    It used to be a CNC Shark now it's a whatshammacall it in solid aluminium
    Inverter is only connected to spindle, not control box, so the speed can be controlled manually.
    Still using the Shark controller for the time being to move the gantry until I get the other CNC set up with Mach3 and learn how to use it.
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Alexandra Vic
    Age
    69
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    2,810

    Default

    When you say it gets to 140RPM, are you reading this off an VFD display or is it being measured by a tacho on the spindle?

    A lot of generic VFD's have a display showing the supply frequency to the motor, if this is the case with your system, at 140Hz it would be running around 8000RPM, probably still significantly underspeed. I have never seen a spindle motor run as slow as 140RPM except when braking for a tool change. At 140RPM constant speed, the VFD would be supplying at about 2.5Hz which may be too slow for the spindle.
    Are you sure that the VFD is supplying all three phases to the spindle? Loosing a phase will definitely increase current draw on other phases, cause motor to struggle etc, and ultimately destroy the motor or VFD. VFD's are generally well protected against this, it could be the cause of the error message. Otherwise cannot help you without more info about setup.
    I used to be an engineer, I'm not an engineer any more, but on the really good days I can remember when I was.

  6. #5
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    Dec 2004
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    Up North
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    Default

    Spindle starts at very slow speed, when it reaches "max" speed before the error message, I can still see the dimples on the collet from the computer balancing, so I guess the speed is fairly close to what I read on the screen.
    The Hz only gets to about 40-50 before the ol error comes up.
    Without the spindle wired up, the inverter works OK.
    I have been reading the 136 page thread about the HY inverter, it looks like I should go through the setup and PD numbers?
    They are called f numbers on my inverter.
    Will also re-check the wiring. The spindle worked OK in the bench test.
    I have a good manual in Chinese but I guess I can read the numbers OK.
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Alexandra Vic
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    Default

    You say the motor was fine during the bench test. Now that it's in the machine, is it hooked up via the same cable/connector as used for bench testing, or a different one. If a different one, I would suspect the cable/connector setup. If the one used for testing, any chance that it was knocked/kinked etc during the changeover. I am really suspicious of the the 4 pin microphone style connectors used on some spindles and cables, as they tend to promote users going to undersize cables to fit them, or if you use appropriate cable, it is often too large to fit into the solder cups on the connector terminations, and so not properly connected.
    I used to be an engineer, I'm not an engineer any more, but on the really good days I can remember when I was.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
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    Up North
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    Default

    The inverter/spindle was supplied with 8 metre heavy 4 core cable with the connector already attached.
    A screw on kinky nut (I know it's the wrong name but it is an old family joke and by now I have forgotten the correct name) with a female ceramic plug and a dimple to ensure it is connected correctly. Don't know how else to describe it.
    http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NTY3WDU2Nw...Euw~~60_12.JPG
    This is as supplied
    I must have the codes wrong because when I disconnect the spindle, I do no get any Ol messages.
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
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    Up North
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    Default

    Used the tach
    126 rpm and it conks out.
    I have done something wrong but I don't know what
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    The plug fitted to the cable in the image is a 4 pin microphone plug made for push to talk microphones of office/factory PA systems and two way radios. Two contacts were microphone signal and earth, and two were push to talk contacts. Have tried 3 sources to find the voltage and current ratings for them, but no one even gives them ratings anymore. Twenty years ago they were rated at 60V/100mA, a far cry from the use the Chinese are putting them to. The contact mounting body which you refer to as ceramic is generally a glossy phenolic moulding, but they have been made with a low melting point plastic body as well. These pecular beasts tended to melt as the cables were soldered on.

    A giveaway is the fact that they strip the cable back some way and insulate with heatshrink to get small enough to cope with the cable entry. My concern is that any undue tension on the cable in the heatshrunk area could break a cable free from it's lug in the connector, leaving the motor running on two phases only, or heaven forbid unearthed.

    At this stage I would remove the cable from the VFD, and do continuity checks from each cable at the VFD end to the contacts on the connector, there should be a 1:1 correlation between wires and contacts. I wouldn't open the connector unless there is not a 1:1 correlation, indicating a fractured joint.
    I used to be an engineer, I'm not an engineer any more, but on the really good days I can remember when I was.

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    26

    Default check your power in

    It could be the input power is not up to specs or is variable. Power at industrial type neighbourhoods can change quite a bit as other businesses switch on their machines and as mentioned previously check your phases. A dodgy phase can do some strange things.

  12. #11
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    Dec 2004
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    Up North
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    Quote Originally Posted by saczel View Post
    It could be the input power is not up to specs or is variable. Power at industrial type neighbourhoods can change quite a bit as other businesses switch on their machines and as mentioned previously check your phases. A dodgy phase can do some strange things.
    Fortunately for us, not too many industries here, apart from the cane cutters and they are fuel operated.
    I have been put on hold (aka bedrest) for a couple of days, came down with pneumonia this morning
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  13. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by malb View Post
    A giveaway is the fact that they strip the cable back some way and insulate with heatshrink to get small enough to cope with the cable entry. My concern is that any undue tension on the cable in the heatshrunk area could break a cable free from it's lug in the connector, leaving the motor running on two phases only, or heaven forbid unearthed.
    Not this one. The cable goes right through the shell to the connections, all 4 wires are connected and the cable secured with a hinged clamp with 1 screw on each part.
    At this stage I would remove the cable from the VFD, and do continuity checks from each cable at the VFD end to the contacts on the connector, there should be a 1:1 correlation between wires and contacts. I wouldn't open the connector unless there is not a 1:1 correlation, indicating a fractured joint.
    Will do when I am allowed into the shed again. May get a picture then.
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  14. #13
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    Up North
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    MalB
    Just to show you not all Chinese manufacturers go the cheap and nasty way
    SpindleConnection.jpg
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Oxley, Brisbane
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    3,041

    Default

    Hmmmm
    I would have liked to see a bit of insulation between those connections. However, it is a better connector that the average that we get that uses the audio connectors.
    It costs a lot, but I am slowly removing all the audios and putting in Amphenol plugs and sockets.
    Bob Willson
    The term 'grammar nazi' was invented to make people, who don't know their grammar, feel OK about being uneducated.

  16. #15
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    Default

    Actually, it is difficult to see but all 4 connections are covered completely with heatshrink.
    If only I could get the blasted thing to work.
    Every day is better than yesterday

    Cheers
    SAISAY

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