Waterstone board

[derekcohen]

Here is a picture of my "waterstone board". The downside of using waterstones is that they can get messy with water slopping around. One of the tips I got from David Charlesworth's video was to use a spray water bottle (one of the ones made with gardening in mind) and mist the higher grit stones as needed. These stones are stored dry. The lower grit stones remain submerged in a Veritas Stone Pond, which is kept nearby.

Holding waterstones in place while honing was an issue before. I tried the "holders" that are sold specially for this purpose. They slide around. I tried router mats. Better - but they still slid around. So I have incorporated an adjustable clamp system into the waterstone board (for different size stones). I could have built in more than one, but I prefer just to use the one at a time.

The other issue is maintaining flat waterstones. I use King waterstones (800, 1200, 8000) and these respond well to 220 grit drywall mesh. The waterstone board incorporates this to the left of the honing area, with a clamp that hold the mesh at one end - this is sufficient to hold it flat (especially as it is also held down with surface tension when wet), and one end may be lifted to clean underneath or sop up excess water.

The waterstone board's surface is flat (carefully checked), and waterproof ( covered in laminate). It is solid and heavy (made from 65 mm chipboard). The front incorporates a stop so that it can be held on a benchtop in the same way as, for example, a shooting board.

My wife loves me again as I no longer need to use the laundry to sharpen blades.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Schtoo]

You know, I am not certain but I think there is a 'quick-release' water stone holding device in the stores around here. Like I said, I am not sure but I can check.

Funny, where I am here is well known for a few things, among which are the stone dug out of the ground and the old arts that still get plied around here, including sword makers (at least 3 I know of), yet I don't use stones and I don't use much in the way of Japanese tools aside from saws day to day.

Anyway, when I get to a tool store I'll have a look see and take a picture. I'll just tell them I can't read the signs that say "no pictures".

[Wood Borer]

A good solution Derek.

[Termite]

I can't post any pics but I've made 4 individual waterstone holders all with their own little moat.
To flatten the stones I use the glass plate with plastic film and grit as suggested by Mr Lee senior, works a treat. Then as per his suggestion I flatten my 4000 & 6000 stones on the 800 stone.
I've tried all the methods suggested on this forum and have found this the best for me.

[Wood Borer]

That advice is hardly worth ignawing, thanks Brother Termite I will experiment with your suggestions.

- Bro Borer

[Schtoo]

What kinda plastic sheet?

I got #36 grit and a stone with a 1/4" dish in it but didn't think I could combine the coarse grit and the dished stone for a good result.

I already tried flattening on concrete blocks, and I now have 2 very smooth concrete blocks...

[Termite]

What kinda plastic sheet?

I got #36 grit and a stone with a 1/4" dish in it but didn't think I could combine the coarse grit and the dished stone for a good result.

I already tried flattening on concrete blocks, and I now have 2 very smooth concrete blocks...

PSA backed mylar sheet stuck to glass.

[derekcohen]

I flatten my 4000 & 6000 stones on the 800 stone.

Termite

There is nothing wrong with this approach (other than that I think that the 4000 stone is unnecessary since the 6000 is so close to it in grit size). Of course it is a given that the 800 stone must be flat.

I prefer to use a predictable reference, that is, the flat surface on which I place the drywall mesh. There is no fussing about. The 220 grit mesh is always sharp, much more aggressive than the 800 waterstone for the polishing stones, and more convenient to use than sandpaper. The advantage of the mesh is that the residue can fall between the mesh holes, so the sharpening surface does not become clogged or lose its flatness. It also drains well. When you need to mop up, just lift the one side and sponge it off. The mesh is stiff and lies flat. No glue is required. It last a long time and is cheap. No, I don't have shares in a company that manufactures the stuff

But it is horses for courses and the mesh is not for every occasion - either by personal preference (viva la difference) or because of materials used. I use King stones and these are slightly softer than Nortons, although the mesh works well here too I'm told. Some of the harder stones, especially the ceramic ones, require special treatment (they do dish although they are not meant to do so).

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Island Nomad]

I really don't have this dishing problem with my stones. I have a Norton black and tan and a silicone carbide stone for general carpentry work. In the workshop I use the Japanese King waterstones and an Arkansaw oilstone for finer tools.

I was taught to use the entire stone when honing, a combination of figure 8's and straight strokes, works for me, no problem with flatness. I guess it takes a little practice to get it right, but once you develop the technique it is quite easy.

[derekcohen]

I was taught to use the entire stone when honing, a combination of figure 8's and straight strokes, works for me, no problem with flatness. I guess it takes a little practice to get it right, but once you develop the technique it is quite easy.

Hi IN

I am curious to know if and how you tell that your waterstones are flat? Perhaps I have misread you, but your reply seems to suggests that you believe that you maintain a flat surface just by the way you hone. You never or rarely use sandpaper/other stones/plates/etc to flatten your waterstones?! That is some eye you have! All of the most experienced pros I know make a fetish out of checking and flattening their waterstones after a maximum of 2-3 blades, and often in between blades. In my own experience, when I am going at it freehand, I will apply more/less pressure on different parts of the blade to create a camber or a straight edge, and this has the tendency of wearing that part of the stone more quickly. My stones are never much out of flat, but they are enough out to affect the blade geometry if I do not correct it immediately. Then again, these are King stones and on the soft side compared to Shaptons or Arkansas.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[routermaniac]

My experiences are similar to Derek. I too find that because of alternating pressure on different parts of the blade (depending on the desired effect) that the stones wear out unevenly. This is even using figure 8 and attempting to use the sides of the stone as much as possible. Mind you since I started using the veritas guide, figure 8 is not that easy to do (much easier freehand).

I find that unless the stone is flattened regularly that the problem is just made worse over time and the stone requires much more work to flatten. So I opt for the easy option and flatten my stones on industrial quality wet and dry fixed to a plate of glass. That is not to say that you cant go on using the stone like it is and never flatten it, it just makes it less likely to get the sharpest edge possible if the stone is uneven. And that is a can of worms we don't really need to open again.. or do we guys?????

regards

Marios

[Schtoo]

I inhereted the stones, and they weren't used for anything other than knives for cutting material and thread, which don't really need flat stones to sharpen them.

And because I can't seem to get them flat effectively, I don't use them yet. Spent nearly 3 hours grinding away on two concrete blocks and still not flat yet.

Maybe I shoulda just lashed out $30 and bought a diamond lapping plate...

[IanW]

Yeah - I was also taught to do the figure of 8 thing, and try to wear the stone evenly, but of course it doesn't. Particularly when you are sharpening chisels and gouges on a regular basis, there is enough uneven wear to make a pigs ear of a wide plane blade, after a while. I use harder (oil) stones, man-nade and 'natural', so don't have to attend to them as often as you water stone types. It was with great trepidation that I first tried using the next grit size to flatten a stone, but when I found how easy it was, the fear soon evaporated. I was worried about larger grits from the coarser stone being embedded in the smaller size, but they don't seem to get stuck very solidly, if at all, and careful cleaning after the process seems to do the trick.
In my next life, I'll start with water stones, for sure, but having come this far with oilstones, I think I'll just finish up with them, thanks. They have a couple of advantages, like the slower wear, and in our climate in Brisbane, the less water that gets near my precious tools, the better!
Cheers,

[Island Nomad]

That is some eye you have!

Thanks Derek, I know.

I use a small engineers steel rule periodically to check flatness. I must admit that I don't try to put cambers in my blades, I do use a microbevel though. I don't really use any curved blades or carving chisels at all.

I just went and checked my original Norton which is 25 years old, and its still flat as.

I think that I do spend alot of time on the backs of blades (no figure 8's here), probably as much time as on the beveled edge, and this may help with maintaining flatness.

I use harder (oil) stones, man-nade and 'natural', so don't have to attend to them as often as you water stone types

IanW,

I am with you, I have always used oilstones rather than waterstones. However have just bought a Veritas Stone Pond which came with a couple of waterstones. They are soft aren't they!

[IanW]

I am with you, I have always used oilstones rather than waterstones. However have just bought a Veritas Stone Pond which came with a couple of waterstones. They are soft aren't they!

Yep. Even the softer grey Si-carbide oilstones don't wear as quickly as any water stones I've tried. But they can be very easily shaped with a coarser stone for special purposes.

But even oilstones need a bit of maintenence now and then. They can get a bit glazed, particularly with HSS, it seems to me, so a bit of a rub now and then not only keeps them nicely flat, but keeps them cutting well, too.

Good point about spending a lot of time with the back of the blade on the stone - it must help the stone as well as your edge!

I like to use kero with a dash or two of engine oil added, on my stones - what do others use?

Cheers,
IW