Four new saws (hmm 60+ yo maybe)

[pmcgee]

No figure in apple .. why I oughta ...

you've all been spoilt .. the lot of you ...

[IanW]

No figure in apple .. why I oughta ...

you've all been spoilt .. the lot of you ...

Yep!
Apple is a fine wood & makes excellent, highly practical saw handles, but we live in a land replete with all sorts of alternatives.....

[Heavansabove]

Paul, I know boiled linseed oil is the time-honoured treatment for tool handles, but frankly, I reckon it sucks on saw handles. For a start, it goes horribly dark over time, and smothers any figure the wood may have (ok, your handle is most likely Apple, which is devoid of figure, so that's not an issue in this case). My other objection is that it takes forever to cure, as you've demonstrated, and can remain sticky for weeks to months depending on the weather & the particular brew. If you must use an oil, most of the 'Danish' oils you can get are based on linseed, and so also have a darkening effect, but at least they contain metallic driers and cure pretty fully in a week or two.

Notwithstanding, you've got a pretty decent result (at least partly because you've scoured a good deal of the BLO off ). I suspect if you let it cure another month or two, it will buff to a very nice, tactile surface, either with the cloth wheel or with lots of use.....

Cheers,

Ian and Paul

A good (traditional?) mixture is Linseed oil (raw or boiled) + Turps (pure is probably best) + Kero + Metho. This also cleans the wood, you can scrub it in and use a scourer pad. There are multiple mixes - probably start with 1: 1: 1 for first 3 components and then enough metho to go on easily. Remember to label the screw top wine bottle you make the mix in!

Cheers
Peter

ps if really dirty, a scrub with water and detergent works well as a first step

[pmcgee]

Yep!
but we live in a land replete with all sorts of alternatives.....

oh yeah ... with ya tiger-striped ring-spalted salmon maple gidgee ...

this apple's got colour mate ... it's got soul ... tears have been cried on this handle ... and not just when I glued my thumb in the thumbhole ...

it's lived life ... smelt the sawdust ... cut through the bull.. Oh, my pills are here.

Paul

[IanW]

It's okay, Paul, it's okay; dry the tears. I like your Apple handle too, for all the reasons you stated. Wouldn't think even for a split second of changing it. I've got 3 Apple-handled saws in my tool kit, and one of them, the one I inherited from my old pot, is just as beat-up as yours, and that will stay that way 'til the day I relinquish it.

There, feel better now?

But if you ever made a saw from scratch, or had to make a new handle for a saw with a completely cactus one, where are you going to get the Applewood from, hey?? But there are alternatives that are a bit easier to source.......

[Bushmiller]

I haven't ever had any 'paste wax' here, so I went to the hardware and ended up with carnauba wax.
I also didn't have steel wool.
I tried it on the drill press with a soft mop and green compound ... possibly could go for a much faster speed/more pressure but I hadn't tried it before so I was being conservative ... then tried rubbing on the wax with a tshirt.

Attachment 308078 that left it very matte ... and a bit resin-y to the hand, rather than smooth.

This is after more with the tshirt and back to the drill-mop without any compound added.

Attachment 308079 Attachment 308080

The 2nd photo shows where the three cracks were ... I glued then up with ordinary PVA in a couple of goes.

It was pretty nice for a user result ... not like those awesome new handles from the makers on here ... but pre-aged and very much as I like.
It still had some of that resin-y feel. I've had it near the laptop and pick it up and handled it for a few weeks now and it feels smoother over time.

Just took a photo just now trying to minimise the impact of the flash ...

Attachment 308097

Coulda gone with less BLO originally, but pretty happy with the experiment.
Could probably mop it a fair bit harder ... I understand carnauba is a 'hard' wax.
Cheers,
Paul

Paul

That handle has come up pretty well with an "aged, cared-for" look. It has a softness about it not replicated with new (say only 60 years old ) saws.

Funny you should say about the wax. I am in the same boat, never having had any in the house unless you count the aural type . Oh, I did try some car polish that I found, but it wasn't impressive even on the plate. I took the advice of the local man at Toowoomba Woodworks who recommended carnuba wax too. This was the result on the early D8 panel saw.

Handsaw resto 11 002.jpgHandsaw resto 11 001.jpg

I would have liked to use one of the hard burnishing products, but didn't really see how I could maximise their benefit without using power buffing, which while not impossible, is difficult on a handle.

Regards
Paul

[Sawdust Maker]

Hi Nick. The metho soak should do the trick. What type of saw nut assembly are you after. Early split nut type or later. Take some measurements including the handle thickness, suitable dia. of the saw bolt head and nut, as well as the thickness of both that would best suit and I will see if I have something to match. The dia. of the early type range from 13.80mm down to 12.5mm, and the thicknesses are from 2.3mm to 3.57mm. I am already setting aside 1 assembly for Bushmiller. Just waiting on some further feedback to finalize.

Stewie;

Stewie

Ok
Now I have the the blade back (thanks muchly Pagie) I can answer these questions

Handle thickness
@ top saw nut is 23.4 mm
@ bottom saw nut is 23mm

Size of hole in blade is 6.10 mm (trouble is they are oval)

bottom bolt head is 13mm
top bolt head (ie that with washer) is 15.5 mm

saw nuts, really all over the the place as I think they've been chopped out by the hex nuts but realisticaly 15mm

As to whether split nuts or more recent types, I dunno
which do you think might look the best.

I've gone through the few I've pulled out of the saws I've recently acquired and none of them come to the same size shank as the hole in the blade

cheers

[planemaker]

Stewie

Ok
Now I have the the blade back (thanks muchly Pagie) I can answer these questions

Handle thickness
@ top saw nut is 23.4 mm
@ bottom saw nut is 23mm

Size of hole in blade is 6.10 mm (trouble is they are oval)

bottom bolt head is 13mm
top bolt head (ie that with washer) is 15.5 mm

saw nuts, really all over the the place as I think they've been chopped out by the hex nuts but realisticaly 15mm

As to whether split nuts or more recent types, I dunno
which do you think might look the best.

I've gone through the few I've pulled out of the saws I've recently acquired and none of them come to the same size shank as the hole in the blade

cheers

Hi Nick. From the sizes mentioned the early type split nuts wont do the job.The big issue you face is the damage you have on the nut side of the handle. Trying to patch these up is going to look fairly untidy. You are probably better off boring them out to a larger dia. on both sides of the handle. You will need to find 2 sets of oversize saw screws that will do the job. Don't be overly concerned at the moment with the hole sizes in saw plate. Once everything else has been sorted out this will seem much easier to resolve. Get back to me if you need further help or advise.

Stewie;

[Sawdust Maker]

Thanks Stewie
Think I've got a set taken off something else that will probably do the trick

I've concluded that I'm never going to get this handle anywhere near pristine
A few dingles, which I'm not that worried about
The annoying thing is dark stains/blotches, was thinking about bleaching but I think I'll go with it as it is
I'll do a final sand today and put on a coat of something

[Sawdust Maker]

I didn't know whether to throw this in here ...

No probs
the dabate was interesting
I this this and the debate has convinced me not to bother with BLO
I've used it one turning chisel handles and not been that happy

I'll more than likely use the poly turps mix I used on my lil dovetail saw

[Sawdust Maker]

It wasn't as difficult as I thought it might be

husky_7213.jpg

[Sawdust Maker]

I had wanted to re-assemble the little backsaw and the Disston no 76 today
but wanted some new saw nuts.
thought I'd wait until I picked up my next addition to the stable.

On the weekend I noticed a little packet of saws for sale on ebay.

1 hour to go, hmm
6 saws hmm
pickup only, bugger (usually)
suburb next door, hmm
interesting carving on a couple of the handles ...

anyway I bid and ended up with 6 new saws. 2 of which I won't bother describing
numbering is all over the place (but sort of follows from that previous posts)


Saw # 24

Disston
Tote has lost it's top and bottom horns (some time ago)
and there is a split just above the 3rd nut
Medallion says "Disston Phila"
the blade is stamped 9 and is filed 9 ppi x cut.
the blade is 22" long and 6" deep at the tote

saw #24_7816.jpg

Saw # 22

Disston
small chip from top horn
stamped 11 and filed at 11 cross cut
Medallion says "Disston Canada"
Blade is 22" long and 6 1/4" at the tote

saw #22_7815.jpg

Saw #25

No Name

Square front
stamped 6 and filed 6 ppi xcut
blade is 26" long and 6 1/3 at the tote
no markings that I can see - no etch
the blade has a decent bow in it - so probably not useable
I did the thump test on this blade - Sounds sweet - I'll have to video for those who like such things!

saw #25_7819.jpg

Saw # 23

No name - dodgy handle - Disston?

no etch that I can see (did a little sanding)
obviously a replacement tote
saw bolts in back to front
blade is sharpened 4 ppi - teeth look a little strange
medallion Disston & Sons Philada
I reckon replacement handle using the same saw bolts
Blade seems to be thicker at the tooth line than at the back (I haven't measured)

saw # 23_7821.jpg saw #23_7824.jpg

anyway

#24 and #22 look like peas in a pod, No 9's maybe (except for damage), but the medallions are different. Same length and about same depth of blade. I'd thought one was cutoff/shortened until I'd seen the second.

#25 is the sweetest sounding saw I've heard - definitely bell like*

#23 has supplied a couple of better saw nuts for my little backsaw - I'll have to polish them up, they are in better condition than the ones I had planned on using.

I now have a couple of saw nuts etc to fit the little backsaw betterer




*and I should note I've heard heaps - well about 12 or so ...

[pmcgee]

Seeeee ... it's not just me ...

That 90degree saw with the great sound, you might find there are ruler markings down the straight back of the saw.

They were I guess sorta a 'gimmick' in that the etched rule on the blade and the square at the handle ... but like you've heard yourself ... if it sounds like that, there's no convincing me the blade is rubbish.

Your first two are #12s ... they are/were the top of the top model in my opinion.
There were others that cost more (D115, rosewood handle) ... but these are the bomb.

They must have still been popular - in the US they are found in all sorts of conditions from Near-New, to used rough, to virtually disappearing.
I have several with handles like yours that suggests an energetic usage, but good blades.

Two things -
First, they should also have a great sound, but being 22" might cut that back some ... and loose handles (if they are) will kill it for sure.
Second, at 9ppi and 11ppi it suggests someone was doing some relatively fine work with them ... interior fit-out maybe? cabinetry?

I have remained surprised that it wasn't just the fine points that people had #12s in ... you also find them as 5ppi eg ... so I feel like in the same way that cabinet-makers could have any sort of backsaw ... but liked their very lovely brass-backed saws with fine handles, ... I guess some carpenters or joiners or whatever felt strongly about their handsaws too.

I posted once about the relative prices of these things ... about 1918 I think. --> yup ... https://www.woodworkforums.com/showth...89#post1757989

Cheers,
Paul

[Sawdust Maker]

Seeeee ... it's not just me ...

It really is!

I'm just trying to relieve the pressure - would hate the west to sink into the ocean under the weight of all that handsaw steel

In all honesty I was looking to acquire saw nuts ... the rest is mere baggage

That 90degree saw with the great sound, you might find there are ruler markings down the straight back of the saw.

They were I guess sorta a 'gimmick' in that the etched rule on the blade and the square at the handle ... but like you've heard yourself ... if it sounds like that, there's no convincing me the blade is rubbish.

I'll have a look - from the 1918 Disston catalog it's probably not a Disston
Interestingly the handle is actually quite comfortable in the hand - I haven't tried to saw with it though

Your first two are #12s ... they are/were the top of the top model in my opinion.
There were others that cost more (D115, rosewood handle) ... but these are the bomb.

They must have still been popular - in the US they are found in all sorts of conditions from Near-New, to used rough, to virtually disappearing.
I have several with handles like yours that suggests an energetic usage, but good blades.

Two things -
First, they should also have a great sound, but being 22" might cut that back some ... and loose handles (if they are) will kill it for sure.
Second, at 9ppi and 11ppi it suggests someone was doing some relatively fine work with them ... interior fit-out maybe? cabinetry?

I have remained surprised that it wasn't just the fine points that people had #12s in ... you also find them as 5ppi eg ... so I feel like in the same way that cabinet-makers could have any sort of backsaw ... but liked their very lovely brass-backed saws with fine handles, ... I guess some carpenters or joiners or whatever felt strongly about their handsaws too.

I posted once about the relative prices of these things ... about 1918 I think. --> yup ... https://www.woodworkforums.com/showth...89#post1757989

Cheers,
Paul

I'll do a bong test on camera shortly

I also thought that they must have been used by a woody practicing the finer skills given the toothing - not sure whether owned by the same person though.



Now to the real reason of the post ... tah dah


the 76 has been remarried to its tote
I've tried a test cut and can only conclude that I really need to learn those sharpening skills

piccies:

Disston 76_7827.jpg
Disston 76_7828.jpg

[Bushmiller]

Nick

If the bottom pic is anything to go by I can see why it wasn't cutting too well . The totes are coming up well.

Regards
Paul