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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
    Posts
    108

    Default Setting up a Triple Garage

    I've just bought a triple garage (with a house attached)

    I'm looking for advice!


    It's a brick garage, attached to the house, with direct access from the house to the garage (down three steps). It has a finished ceiling at the moment. We're not sure if there is any scope to store stuff up in the roof. We think it is seven deep x eight metres wide with a double and a single roller door at the front.


    Layout - There's enough space (at the moment, i'm sure there wont be in the future) to do a proper job of a workshop. I've been googling around. Do you have any good web-sites to look at, or particular threads for me to have a look at.


    Floor paint - Concrete floor, seems flat. But one third is painted black. So I'm planning to paint at least that section with a concrete paving paint. Do you have any recommendation on type of paint and why? I've heard that gloss paint can be slippery under dust.

    Wall paint: i'm considering painting the three brick interior walls white to help with light levels. What paint do you use on bricks? Should it be White or is some tint better?


    Improved lighting - there are currently two narrow windows on one side (amber, textured glass ). It was obviously intended for cars, not as a workshop and is fairly dark. I am considering combinations of skylights (two), replacing the roller door with sectional doors with translucent panels, Replacing the amber glass with clear/frosted, adding an extra window on one side, and of course, bribing the tame nephew electrician with access to my workshop for lots and lots of electric lights.


    Ventilation: I will be buying a 2hp dust extractor (single or double bag?) , I have a carbatec room air filter (650 cfm).
    Considering adding common bathroom type extractor fans to keep the air moving. Any thoughts?


    Noise insulation - it's brick. with tiled roof. and roller doors. and two small windows. The side with the windows faces the nearest neighbours. Considering double glazing those two windows. Thoughts?

    Mobile equipment - i've seen the advice of putting equipment on wheels. Anybody know where to find push-down wheels so I can make some mobile stuff?


    Photos will not be available until mid April

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    3,260

    Default

    Floor paint - Epoxy garage floor paint or possibly one of the heavy duty paving paints. If slipping is a worry, you can add some anti-slip grit or sprinkle salt crystals over the still wet finish. When dry, wash the crystals off, leaving little craters. I prefer a slippery finish as it's easier to clean and roll things over, and those rubber floor mats are cheap enough to cover large areas with them.

    Wall paint. Whatever's cheap. Expect to do at least three coats. Some sections can have (say) a sheet of 12mm ply on them to provide hanging tool storage.

    For dust extraction...read the dust extration threads. When you've finished reading them (that'll be sometime late next year) your choice will be a $5k cyclone system or an Aldi vac and some 50mm pvc piping.

    And when googling for shed designs, google workshop designs instead. That'll pick up all the American blogs and things.

    Also think about things like insulation on walls that get a lot of sun.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Pakenham, Victoria
    Age
    53
    Posts
    350

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Master Splinter View Post
    For dust extraction...read the dust extration threads. When you've finished reading them (that'll be sometime late next year) your choice will be a $5k cyclone system or an Aldi vac and some 50mm pvc piping.
    Awesome space. Enjoy it. I have the same space and have my amateur benches on wheels. That way depending on what you are working on or what else in in the garage that day, you can easily expand or contract your workshop. I have just used cheap 75mm castors available from eBay or discount $2 shops. Brakes on the front wheels. So far they are fine.

    In fact I'm off to the shops this morning to get some for my new chop bench.

    Danny

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Albury Well Just Outside
    Posts
    13,315

    Default

    Congratulation on your new garage.

    I agree with Master Splinter on the wall paint. I would add on a personal level I would not want gloss on the walls as the reflection can be annoying.


    Do keep posting when you decide on the layout.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    3,260

    Default

    And another 'get 'em done quick-like' option. You could do worse than the Bunnies Rack-it stuff for benches ( http://www.handy-storage.com.au/prod...e/rack-it.html ) as you can get wheels to go with it. Build the cupboards and drawers, though, as they are a little on the pricey side.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Perth
    Posts
    27,756

    Default

    Congrats on the new shed. It's a great feeling!

    Dust-wise, stock 2HP is in general a very poor dust collector.
    The main reason for this is their use of 4" ducting throttles DC so that it cannot move more than ~400 cfm which is only 40% of the generally accepted amount of air needed to be grabbed at source to capture fine dust (1000 cfm) while it is being generated and so that a aged can be adequately ventilated to get rid of escaped dust.

    If you do a search for "generic 2HP DC" in the dust forum you will find a thread showing how to modify a stock 2HP DC to use 6" ducting and perform much better (~800 cfm) but even the modified unit will still be too small for a 3 car garage because the length of ducting required to service a 3 car garage is well beyond the ability of even the modified a 2HP system to cope with.

    The only way that more than 400 cfm can be moved by a conventional DC is to use 6" or larger ducting. In general PVC ducting is cheaper than metal and while it is still expensive, short of making you own ducting with MDF you have no choice.

    BTW Not ducting your shed and towing the DC from machine to machine is a very poor decision - read on

    Assuming you are stuck with using the 2HP DC here are a few tips about dust extraction
    The worst thing you can do for dust extraction is to let the DC vent inside the shed.
    The main reason for this is because they all leak invisible dust and that is the worst kind to breathe.
    The reason they leak is
    - poor construction
    - leaking collection bags - swirling chips inside the bag creates pin holes through the bags
    - poor quality filters
    - leaks around rucks where the collection bags seal against the bag housing.
    The problem is made worse when DCs are towed/moved around inside a shed, the and their bags/filters get bashed and holes get punctured in them so this creates even bigger leaks.

    The best thing you can do to reduce dust levels in a shed is vent the DC outside and use ducting inside.
    This lends itself to fixed machine location or at least a specific location to where machines are moved to be connected to a short length of 6" flexy.
    The closer this location is to where the DC is located the shorter and cheaper the ducting and the more air and dust will be captured.

    A DC does not physically need to be located outside the shed (although it takes up less room if it is) but can be housed inside the shed in an airtight cupboard and just vented outside.
    Either way while you are knocking holes in walls you maybe should think about this.

    Using 6" ducting is wasted on most machines since most use smaller dust outlets so if you want to benefit from larger ducting most machines need to be modified to open up the collection ports.

    Finally, in terms of cost, dust extraction should be factored into the general cost of shed construction/renovation. When I raised this with SWMBO suddenly funding was far less of issue when safety was involved and it seems like a much smaller amount when compared to the cost of the shed.

    More grimy detail can be found in the Dust forum.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Hobart
    Posts
    5,105

    Default

    Good Morning Eowyn

    My shed is a mere 15 x 25 feet - it was built pre-metric - and was very spacious but is now full of stuff. Perhaps I will just list the mistakes that I made.

    Floor. I assumed that the concrete floor was flat and level - it is neither - uneveness makes it harder to drag things around and then everything has to be chocked and trued. A PIA.

    Walls and Ceiling. Three walls are brick painted primer pinl and the other wall and ceiling is estapolled pine VJ. Thought it looked OK, but these are actually dark colours. Should have painted them white or similar.

    Lighting. Now have 4 x 1200mm double fluoros on 3 metre ceilings. Lighting is still inadequate - probably need another three, or four!

    Powerpoints. Should have had many, many more powerpoints installed.

    Planning. Should have done a ten year plan of where I wanted the shed to be in the future, especially storage for materials. SketchUp might be a useful tool, here.

    Now, to fix the problems is really difficult. Where do I put all the stuff while I level the floor?



    Fair Winds

    Graeme

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia.
    Posts
    1,268

    Default

    I was in Aldi this morning, they are having a painters equipment sale on starting today. Currently they have 10 litres of interior white paint for $50.00, I looked at what it can cover and brickwork was one of the surfaces it would cover, according to the blurb on the side of the oval shaped plastic container. Made in Germany paint at that.

    With regard to the floor paint, I have the Staseal product on my concrete floor with a light grey tint, brilliant stuff. If you have some fine dust and leather soled shoes, I could see how it may be possible to slide a bit if you try, but I don't wear leather soled shoes as they are too hard on my feet, so not an issue with me. Plus, I rarely, if ever, have fine dust on my floor.

    http://www.concreterswarehouse.com.a...emium-sealers/

    They are in Keysborough and have sharp pricing.

    This is the first personally owned concrete floor I have painted/sealed, I would never have an unsealed/painted floor after this, the difference is like chalk and cheese. So easy to clean, so easy to look at and unbelievably easy to find a dropped nut or washer.

    Mick.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Towradgi
    Posts
    4,835

    Default

    Eowyn, first of all, you are a barsteward of the highest kind!

    Grizzly has a workshop organiser to work out where you place tools.

    As to lighting and power, ther is never too much. In my new shed I have a 20amp circuit, 15 amp circuit and 2 10 amp circuits + lights. A double GPO every 2 - 3 meters along the wall is a good start.

    Paint the walls flat white. I covered my concrete floor with Yellow tongue flooring to soften the effects on my back and to take away the variations of the concrete floor and to save tool edges.

    Get the dusty it's own little shed away from the main work area and up size to the best you can afford.
    Pat
    Work is a necessary evil to be avoided. Mark Twain

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Canberra
    Posts
    3,260

    Default

    The Aldi stuff should be as good as any cheap paint if not better (the stuff I used was around $22 for 4 litres)...and you could possibly pick up some of their 18W LED fluro units too.

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
    Posts
    108

    Default

    Thanks for all the replies. About to settle in for a morning of research. The workshop planner looks interesting.

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
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    Hobart
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optimark View Post
    ......

    This is the first personally owned concrete floor I have painted/sealed, I would never have an unsealed/painted floor after this, the difference is like chalk and cheese. So easy to clean, so easy to look at and unbelievably easy to find a dropped nut or washer.

    Mick.

    Good Morning Eowyn

    Micks quite correct - bare concrete has lots of nooks and crannies to capture dust. Painting makes a big difference. I have used Berger paving paint with excellent longevity. Factory flooring paint is an even tougher version of the same product - designed to have forlifts driven over it, constantly.

    If I could totally redo my floor now I would go for a softer finish such as yellowtongue - kinder on feet and tool edges.


    Fair Winds

    Graeme

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Sutherland Shire, Sydney
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    71
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    1,301

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    I used Bondcrete on my garage / workshop floor over 30 years ago. It dried basically clear, with a bit of a sheen to it. I would happily use it again, as there is no sign of wear or flaking etc, and stops the concrete from creating it's own dust. Slipping on sawdust isn't an issue, and wiping up spilled oil etc. is not a problem. Sweeping up is so much easier on this surface compared to raw concrete.
    If I was starting again, I would certainly use a coating of some sort, such as a light coloured paint as long as it is good wearing and not slippery, or Bondcrete, depending on price, but must admit that yellow tongue chipboard flooring would be well worth considering, as long as there is no possibility of rainwater getting on it near doorways etc.

    Lots of power points and plenty of lighting are a must have, and some sort of cross ventilation to make things much more comfortable in hot weather.

    Good luck in fitting out your new workshop.

    Alan...

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Bowral
    Posts
    837

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    Eowyn, I'm in the process of getting a shed built so that I can have a workshop. The space I will end up with will be about a 3 car garage space. I've used the workshop planning tools, and also drawn many plans of the space myself, to work out where things will go. This is my second workshop, so I'm going to avoid some of the mistakes I made first time around. I'm going to seal my concrete floor with Staseal or something similar. I want an epoxy finish that is durable, light coloured (but not white) and flat. My shed is being constructed out of colourbond, so I'm going to insulate the shed with polyester batts (same as we used in the house), and then line the internal walls with plywood panels cut to 1200 x 1200 - so that I can just take them down and replace them or move them if I want to rearrange the work space. That way I won't be afraid to screw or nail anything to any wall. I will paint the plywood panels in light colours to aid with light. I am getting a separate 3 phase power board put in the garage, with 2 x 20 amp sockets, 2 x 15 amp sockets, and lots of 10 amp power points. I haven't sorted lights yet, but I don't like flouros. I'm thinking I will get some large industrial spotlights with LED bulbs (less heat). I'm putting doors up that will allow me to open up the space to allow for very long boards if necessary. And I'm putting in quite a few windows, for light. I have a 2hp dusty and I want to build a small enclosure outside my shed for it and duct it inside. It is mainly used for my large combination machine (mobile). I realize I may need to upgrade the dusty. I have two portable vac/cyclones that I use for the smaller machinery. I also want to put in an air filter, but I haven't got that yet. I have planned where my timber rack will be, and for some additional storage above one of the internal rooms. I have planned all the locations for my existing workbenches (not mobile), lathe (not mobile), bandsaw (mobile), router tables (mobile), sink (not mobile), sharpening area (not), power tool storage (not), hand tool storage (not), and my new flash as-yet-unbuilt hand tool workbench (mobile). I'm also going to put in a compressor and air lines. I think I will house the compressor outside with the dusty (need to soundproof that so as not to annoy the neighbours). Good luck with yours.
    Bob C.

    Never give up.

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