Back/Dovetail saw identification

[Bushmiller]

This is a bit beyond me as I know absolutely nothing about backsaws (as opposed to just nothing about everything else) and I am struggling to identify the name on this. It is quite ironical as the stamp is so deep in the brass back, but the letters are unclear.

It is 12" with a depth of 2 3/8" and 12ppi I can read everything except the curved name, which ends ....ner & Co.

I don't know if it is a dovetail saw, which was my first thought because of it's depth, but I thought the 12ppi might be too coarse for such an animal. So maybe a well worn tenon saw.

This saw has some sentimental value as although it was my father's it only came into my possession yesterday.

Encore dovetail saw 005.jpgEncore dovetail saw 001.jpgEncore dovetail saw 002.jpgEncore dovetail saw 003.jpg

As you can see from the split nuts, the saw may be pre 1900.

Any thoughts?

Regards
Paul

[burraboy]

Is that style known as a 'gentleman's saw'?

[Sawdust Maker]

From Ray's site here

turnerthomas.jpg
Turner Thomas & Co. Suffolk works, Suffolk road

But I can't get Turner Thomas out of your imprint
ThomTurner & Co

There's also a couple that use the word imperial which I think might be the italicised writing on the right
Allen Edgar & Co use the word imperial

[Heavansabove]

Made by Thomas Turner & Co. Encore was one of many brands they used (a common Sheffield practice). Guess at late 19th century 2nd quality saw. Doubt it is a dovetail saw, rather it is a carcase saw. No reason it could not be used for dovetails in thicker stock if kept sharp, and with minimal set.

Is that style known as a 'gentleman's saw'?

No. Google "gentleman's saw" for illustrations of just such a saw.

Cheers
Peter

[Bushmiller]

The word to the left of the semi circular logo is "Refined" and to the right are "cast steel" and "Improved."

Regards
Paul

[Sawdust Maker]

Well ignore my 'imperial' thought than

[Bushmiller]

From Ray's site here

turnerthomas.jpg
Turner Thomas & Co. Suffolk works, Suffolk road

But I can't get Turner Thomas out of your imprint
ThomTurner & Co

There's also a couple that use the word imperial which I think might be the italicised writing on the right
Allen Edgar & Co use the word imperial

The logo looks right. This is what I can get from the name:

Hang on a tick; I have just had a 45th look and I think it is indeed (Drum roll)

ThomTurner & Co.

The fifth and sixth letters are the clues. Once you realise that the sixth letter is not a "C" but a "U" without the righthand leg and the fifth letter is a "T" with a daggy bit on the bottom, the rest falls into place.

However, I would never have got "Thom" without "Turner." The stamp looks as though it would continue through to China and yet it is so difficult to read.

Well done men: Thanks for your assistance .

I just have to clean it all up now .

Regards
Paul

[jimbur]

Thos. rather than Thom?

[Bushmiller]

Thos. rather than Thom?

Jim

It could be. The actual letter I can't recognise asanything. It doesn't look like the "S" in cast steel or Sheffield.

Regards
Paul

[jimbur]

Paul, saw this on Old Tools (now sold).

"An old open handled beech dovetail saw with steel back made by Thos Turner & Co, Sheffield."

[planemaker]

Is that style known as a 'gentleman's saw'?

Gent's saw or Gentleman's saw — a small dovetail saw with a straight turned handle.

[Berlin]

Hi Paul,

Is the saw straight? I have a little tenon saw by Abrahm Brooksbanks that was stamped so hard it bent the spine into a decent curve. Once hammered straight it proved to be a nice saw but it was pretty hard to cut a straight line before hand!

Matt

[Bushmiller]

Hi Matt

This saw is a straight as a die. I have cleaned up the brass spline and the sawnuts and sanded back the handle. I just have to deal with the saw plate. This saw, although small, is very heavy for it's size probably due to the relatively large brass spline.

I will take some pix later.

Regards
Paul

[IanW]

.......Doubt it is a dovetail saw, rather it is a carcase saw. No reason it could not be used for dovetails in thicker stock if kept sharp, and with minimal set....

Agree with Peter. Given the height & hang angle of the handle (& further down, Paul says it's heavy), it would make a better small carcase saw, for me. But to each his/her own, and what suits another person may be entirely different from what I like. The main thing is to be able to cut straight & true with it, whatever you use it for.....
Cheers,

[Bushmiller]

This is how the Thos Turner came up. I still have to sharpen it.

Thos Turner resto 004.jpgThos Turner resto 001.jpgThos Turner resto 002.jpg

Regards
Paul