Second Hand Drill Press - Runout & play in quill

[Sebastiaan76]

Hi all,
So I bought a second hand Drill Press - Rexon DP500f, 1.5Hp 12 speed, 20mm Chuck 100kg floor standing. It's been used in the past for drilling metal & I paid $450 for it. For that money, it's a beast!

Works fine, but I'm noticing play in the quill, and before I go and buy a new Chuck & Arbor, I just wanted to check with those more knowledgeable before I go handing over more money!

The Chuck & Arbor have a fair bit of pitting, and look worn, and when I feel in side the sleeve that recieves the arbor, there are a couple of rough bits up at the top. But my main concern is with the Quill slightly lowered, there is obvious play back & forth when I push/pull it? Is this normal? Or will part of my expenditure now also be replacing bearings?

I know I got the drill for a bargain, so don't mind spending a little bit to really get it humming, but I guess I just need to know where to start. I will buy as dial indicator, but I can easily tell that thus far there is definite runout, even just looking by eye. and comparing hole size to drill bit size after drilling ( i.e. loose fit! ).

Where would you begin? Happy to post photos/vid if it helps.

[malb]

A lot of the Asian drills have poorly executed quill bores in the head casting, which leads to lateral freedom for the quill. An obvious give away is that the problem is worse once the quill is advanced off the upper stop, which tends to force it into alignment. If the drill has an offset depth stop, the quill will often cock to the side once fed to the depth stop as well. I have seen some that will move across enough to snap a 3mm bit when they bottom out at the depth stop. Depth stop limiting should not be an issue if the depth stop is one concentric with the feed pinion shaft, as these limit at the the feed arms, rather than the quill.

If you have play with the quill fully raised you may have bearing issues as well.

[Sebastiaan76]

It's tight as a drum when fully raised, and the play is only there when it's partially down, and seems to be more side to side, than front to back. There is no play between the spindle & Quill that I can tell, so those bearings seem to be OK? Either way, I think the Chuck/Arbor is cactus,so will get a new ones.

The drill bit still looks to have a bit of 'wobble' even when it's spinning in the fully up position though. Bent Spindle?

If it is the bore, any tips on how to rectify? Or will I just have to put up with a bit of runout. I'll try to get a dial indicator to measure exactly how much there is.

[Evanism]

Im curious about this too.

I have a TradeTools K-1720 and can get the damned thing to hold a bit straight. I've replaced the quill, but it wobbles, just like this one. The wobble isn't much, but a precision tool it isn't.

I'll be interested to see how yours resolves.

[Burnsy]

On the left side is a grub screw that you may be able to tighten slightly to remove the side to side movement. The screw is filed flat on opposite sides and this usually correspomds to the screw driver slot. The slot should be up and down so the flat faces on the other end of the screw ride in the machined slot of the quill and don't grab.

[malb]

The drill bit still looks to have a bit of 'wobble' even when it's spinning in the fully up position though. Bent Spindle?

If it is the bore, any tips on how to rectify? Or will I just have to put up with a bit of runout. I'll try to get a dial indicator to measure exactly how much there is.

If the bit wobbles with the quill fully raised, it is most likely either bearings, a poorly machined spindle or arbour, or strained chuck. You really need to get access to a dial indicator and mount to check the spindle taper and arbour before throwing money at a chuck/arbour set to ensure that you are working in right area.

If it is the bore, the normal issue is that when the bore is machined, the manufacturers are being cost concious and either the boring bar is too skinny and flexible or they are not allowing sufficient time to machine and finish a parallel bore. Generally the bore ends up bell mouthed so does not evenly support the quill over it's length allowing the play. Sometimes tightening the grub screw that runs in the quill keyway can push the quill to one side and increase contact area and reduce play, at the expense of the quill not being square to the head and extra feed friction.

[Sebastiaan76]

I tried to get the grub screw out, but even after removing the nut around it completely I was unable to turn the screw more that 1/8th left or right.

I'll try to find a dial indicator somewhere and measure runout at the chuck jaws, and then also at the arbor.

If it's bearings, then at least I can replace those ( *if* i can find the right ones ).

Off to ebay for a dial indicator then!

[Burnsy]

Here is a picture of mine in bits, see the slot running up the side of the quill (??), that is what the grub screw runs in. You may need to drop the quill out, turn the screw 180 degrees before pushing the quill back up. The screw won't turn beacuse they are filed down on two sides to fit in the slot.

[Sebastiaan76]

Ahhh, OK. Wasn't aware I had to drop out the how Quill to remove the screw.

I've found a good Youtube and PDF guide on removing the whole Quill/Spindle assembly and replacing the bearings, so will do that this weekend.

Regardless, I've also bought myself a Dial Indicator and magnetic base ( I've secretly been waiting for an excuse to buy one haha ), and also ordered a new Keyless Chuck & MT3 Arbor.

The whole Quill and much of the drill is pretty tarnished and dirty ( it's 9 years old after all ), so probably worth doing a bit of a clean up etc anyway while I have it all apart.

Will try and post some pictures if there is interest.

Here is a picture of mine in bits, see the slot running up the side of the quill (??), that is what the grub screw runs in. You may need to drop the quill out, turn the screw 180 degrees before pushing the quill back up. The screw won't turn beacuse they are filed down on two sides to fit in the slot.

[Sebastiaan76]

OK. I may have accidentally taken a wrong turn today and had to stop somewhere and ask directions. Turns out the place I went was Carbatec, so whilst I was there I bought a Dial indicator!

So I've come home and done a quick check both at the base of the drill bit just below the Chuck jaws - and it looks to be -0.1mm to +.4mm, so a total runout of 0.5mm. At the spindle I have 0.1mm.

Unless I'm reading my dial indicator wrong?

Some vids here:

Drill runout at bit - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8zSVdDjQa0
Drill runout at Spindle - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hH1JRnIeGlI&list

So definitely looks like things are pear shaped at the Chuck.

Anyone have any thoughts?

[Sebastiaan76]

So for anyone who might be interested, I got a new Chuck ( Keyless 1mm - 16mm ) and runout at the bit close to the chuck is ~ 0.17mm now, so quite a bit better.

Given it's not a mill, i'm reasonably happy with this.

Is 0.17mm runout acceptable? Or should I still be aiming for better? I guess I could change the bearings :/


Seb

[Evanism]

Interested too... mine is 0.011 (0.297mm)

I:

- remove the chuck from the quill and cleaned the quill thoroughly
- measured the runout at the quill and rotated it... out by < 0.001
- put the taper in and measured it at the lowest end... 0.002
- put the chuck on, gave it a few love taps ... 0.011
- rotated bit in the chuck 90 degrees and retested, same... 0.011

Is 11 thou OK? I can see the wobble with my eyes!

Pics of my setup attached.

DSC07561 (1024x685).jpg

DSC07562 (685x1024).jpg

[Evanism]

Took out the old chuck, inserted a new PSI keyless chuck and cleaned all surfaces with both metho and turps... in it goes with an encouraging love tap to persuade it and its now only 0.002!

I had a bum chuck. Might keep it it for the tailstock on the lathe. Since it wont spin it won't matter.

Sorry to hijack the thread.

[hiroller]

Sounds worthwhile. Where do you source a PSI chuck?

[Evanism]

Sounds worthwhile. Where do you source a PSI chuck?

it was off Amazon. I couldn't find one locally without paying a motza.

It is this one: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004CVJC3E/

I have to admit, my drilling has been extremely precise since replacing it. It's amazing how such a trivial inaccuracy made such a dramatic difference.