canoe.jpgGreetings from Rochester NY USA,

I am an adviser for a youth group, young folk between 14-20 that enjoy camping as part of the Scout Venturing program. Great fun. They enjoy camping from a canoe but we rent as we go. Cost effective but limits where we can go somewhat. They thought about kayaks but those are one up - tough to bring along a mate (trying to adapt, this is an Aussie forum). I suggested they think bigger and if we can't find them, build them over the long harsh winter. Goal would be to float two in the Summer and work our way up to 4-5. Ability to have 9-12 youth and 3 adults on a trip.

So we are looking at boats that score well with the criteria listed below. Very new to the Goat Island Skiff design. From a bit of reading and youtubing I have tried to rate the GIS for each but I am an observer. Uninformed, ignorant, etc.

Can you chip in and correct me where I am off?


  • Relatively easy to build***
    Looks like plywood is butt joined, not scarfed. Square mast. Internal pieces look big and easily cut and duplicated. Fiberglass tape rather than sheaving, although we'd do the bottom in 3oz as suggested by designer if people are so inclined. We are not master carpenters or boat builders but this looks like it is a terrific design with an enthusiastic (polite way of saying "cult-like") following ready to support. I think the design and build techniques really lend themselves well to involvement from the youth.
  • Relatively inexpensive to build (< $2500 USD) ***
    6mm is cheaper than 9mm in a lot of other plans. Not a lot of sheets of it. Not a lot of fiberglass.
  • Relatively quick to build (< 250 hours)***
    Build blogs show a straightforward approach. Work seems easily split up. Looks like with proper licensing in place it lends itself well to making several copies of each piece.
  • Crew of 3-4 plus a bit of gear **
    I have seen some photos of it under oar with more people on it than the Staten Island Ferry. Have to watch trim - nothing heaving in front. A lot of video of happy 2 up crew. Would love a photo of 3 up under sail, or dare I dream, four.
  • As good with oars as under sail *
    Looks like one rowing station. Several accounts of long passages under oar but she really shines as a sailor. Other designs have multiple rowing stations which literally broaden our horizons.
  • Relatively stable *?
    Stay out of bow. A few to many capsize videos on youtube but all with happy endings. Several people point out that flips are when you are sailing aggressively. I loved to flip my sunfish, part of the sport. But not with gear. So it looks like a GIS is stable when you want it to be and less so when you are in sport-mode? Addition of ballast very helpful in this (people, gear, sand, water?).
  • Relatively easy to sail (lug rig) ***
    Lug for simplicity, no trade offs with GIS approach to rigging. Yawl is interesting for ease of putting head to wind.
  • Relatively lightweight (< 200lbs idea). **
    I think I am seeing 150lbs. More than a canoe but it is more boat than a canoe. 4 teens should be able to move it around, maybe with it slinged under oars across shoulders or something similar.
  • Ability to nest or somehow get more than one on a trailer with custom rack if needed. **
    It looks like it is flared and if you toss a boat cushion on the seats you could have one goat mount another (let's not go there). I've seen it car topped but less than ideal. Rack with slanted shelves maybe.
  • Pride of ownership **
    We'd probably paint interior but leave some bright. Only two stars because I really like the look of traditional lapstrake. Beautiful. Maybe I will eventually build one for myself. And my kid can wiz by and ask me how a goat's butt looks. I was thinking traditional (CLC Dory, DeBois Street Dory, Oughtred, etc.) but this is more like a Caledonia Yawl hooked up with an i550 and this is the love child. If the kids can progress from rowing to sailing they would have a blast with this design. The GIS named GIR really caught their attention. I think they would award the third star. And any boat that is in the water rather than the wood shop is pretty.
  • Durable ***
    Designer says you do not have to glass the bottom, but if you wished to you can use 3oz. Others mix graphite in. The 12 year old GIS still looks great.
  • Seaworthy **
    Mostly dependent on crew. I get that. There are places we'd like to go that are more for kayaks than canoes. Plan is to work our way up over a few years from local pond to Maine Island Trail. We have a lot of protected water around us and are experienced with island camping where you bring enough food along so if you are wind bound you stay and extra day. I am looking for something where the window of acceptable seas state is bigger than a canoe. A GIS made it across Scotland and placed high in a recent RAID; so should be suitable for what we are thinking.


Should be easy with all of these "relatives" ;<) Again, I have not set eyes on a GIS, this is me asking you to correct my observations from I am seeing across the web.

Oh, and an idea. Several people have mentioned adding weight, at least initially. Sandbags or such. I like these:
http://www.thepoolfactory.com/dual-w...ubes-1-x8.html
You can carry them down to the boat empty and fill with your hand pump. Neutral weight if flipped. Soft so if they slide onto your foot... Please accept as humble contribution of goat neophyte.

Thanks - John