Custom Holdfasts

[tuscany33]

Hi everyone,

I am thinking of approaching a blacksmith to order some forged holdfasts but I am at a loss as to what specifications should be given. Although the Gramercy hold-fasts are readily available I would like to support a local craftsman.

My quandary is that I have no idea what specifications I should give. For the sake of utility I plan to make the holes in my workbench 3/4" in diameter as I am partial to the Veritas bench dogs and related tools - that diameter would accept the Gramercy holdfasts according to their website.

Does anyone have any advice on what specifications should be called for? Or should I just find a 'smith who is happy to engage in a bit of trial and error to get a holdfast that will clamp well?

[FenceFurniture]

Crikey, I dunno about getting them made when they are available from Terry Gordon for $95 a pair.
http://www.hntgordon.com.au/bench-vi...holdfasts.html

There was a thread running a couple of years ago about getting a batch made but nothing ever came of it. I think getting them made will blow a hole in $95 in no time flat because it's unlikely they'll be right first time if the smithy hasn't made them before. Spring steel, angles, etc etc......

You may find at the end of the day that the smithy wished you hadn't tried to support him!

[Fuzzie]

There seem to be a few more designs floating around the web now than the last time I looked.
https://hyvelbenk.wordpress.com/2014...ay-and-sweden/
http://www.instructables.com/id/Ye-O...fast/?ALLSTEPS
https://www.pinterest.com/source/bohlfamily.com/

[DSEL74]

They are not that hard to forge, if you want the simple round kind which most are now, if you want the traditional roubbo with the squared off corner then that is a bit of forge work.


Easy





Hard




Really Hard - A lot more time to forge this one. But it is pretty!

Here are some statistics: The holdfast weighs in at 5 lbs. 6 oz. The shaft is 17” long. The neck has a 7” reach from the centerpoint of the shaft. The pad is 1/4” thick x 1-9/16” wide x 1-7/8” long.
Why does it work so well? My guess is that it’s the shaft. It measures about .985” in diameter all along its length. It just barely slides into a 1”-diameter hole. But slide it does. This close fit is what wedges the holdfast in place when struck with a mallet.

[Vann]

A guy (RichardT) on the UK forum made a whole lot for fellow formites. The thread is here...

http://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/p...ldfast#p580014

If you read it all, I think you'll find most of the information you need. Unfortunately RichardT died suddenly last year.

Cheers, Vann.

[Chesand]

Another thread has just been started with reference to McJings having them at $18 each.

[mark david]

What nearly $100 a pair
Would be surprised If they cost more than a few Dollars to make.

Think the McJing ones look Like a fair price?

Crikey, I dunno about getting them made when they are available from Terry Gordon for $95 a pair.
http://www.hntgordon.com.au/bench-vi...holdfasts.html

There was a thread running a couple of years ago about getting a batch made but nothing ever came of it. I think getting them made will blow a hole in $95 in no time flat because it's unlikely they'll be right first time if the smithy hasn't made them before. Spring steel, angles, etc etc......

You may find at the end of the day that the smithy wished you hadn't tried to support him!

[marphlix]

The thing that frustrates me is that if the Gramercy ones were purchase in the US, they would only cost about $45 AUD ($36USD) for a pair. The problem is the shipping to AU - i priced it and its about $80AUD ($63USD) to get them here.

So that said, HNT Gordon price is actually not too bad considering they need to get them in to AU somehow.

[mark david]

Yes I know what you mean, the Aussie dollar has taken a major pounding on the exchange recently and a lot of U.S companies seem to charge very high postage costs.
I have ordered a few things from the U.S recently and it is a painfully expensive process.

I love living here in Australia but somethings are very hard if not impossible to source over here after living in England most of my life, where you can get hold of pretty much anything you want.

The thing that frustrates me is that if the Gramercy ones were purchase in the US, they would only cost about $45 AUD ($36USD) for a pair. The problem is the shipping to AU - i priced it and its about $80AUD ($63USD) to get them here.

So that said, HNT Gordon price is actually not too bad considering they need to get them in to AU somehow.

[FenceFurniture]

What nearly $100 a pair
Would be surprised If they cost more than a few Dollars to make.

Think the McJing ones look Like a fair price?

Don't know Mark. Unfortunately the words "Chinese", "Steel", "good quality" just don't seem to work properly in a sentence. I remember an American magazine (Pop.WW I think) tested several hold downs, and several of them broke (one with the first hit).

[DSEL74]

Brett that is because there are cast ones also on the market. I don't know how a cast one is supposed to flex and spring to work.

[IanW]

I'm sure steel holdfasts can develop more holding power than my wooden 'bench ducks' (see this thread, starting here), but just how much holding power do you need?? Mine have done everything I've asked of them, so far. I haven't broken a single one in normal use (I deliberately belted one down to destruction, just to see what they will cop, and it was far more than I am ever likely to ask of one!). They take very little effort to make, & you can use scraps of hardwood that might otherwise have gone to the fire. So if you are concerned about cost - these are just what you need....

Cheers,

[FenceFurniture]

Yes I'd forgotten about your duck-duck-duck-ducks Ian. Definitely worth a go at making. I've got two so far unused Gramercy holdowns (gotta have a bench that can take dog 'oles) and if I want more I'll definitely be giving them a run. Not having used wooden ones (or steel, or cast iron thank gawd), if they don't hold firmly enough - and I trust you implicitly when you say they do - you can always glue a piece of rubber mat to the business end.

Nothing like the satisfaction of a tool you've made yourself!

[IanW]

Yes I'd forgotten about your duck-duck-duck-ducks Ian.....

Well, you don't see them almost every day, like I do, Brett..

.....Nothing like the satisfaction of a tool you've made yourself!

Particularly when they work even better than you expected - "smug" is almost the right word.

I should put in a disclaimer, which is that I only use my ducks for what I'd classify as light to medium duty. That includes anything likely to be encountered in routine cabinetmaking, but there are probably situations where you'd want to really tie something down, and the wooden holders may not be up to it. For example, holding a very thick piece of wood would mean a lot of the rod sticking above the bench, putting a lot of force on it at the 'fulcrum' point. If that is your thing, you could consider using 1" dowel instead of 3/4", but that would mean boring bigger holes in your bench top, which wouldn't be compatible with some of the other gadgets you might want to use in them. I use mine mostly as 'secondary' holders to steady the ends of long boards clamped across the bench in the tail vise. But I've found all sorts of other uses for them, & I'm sure you could use them as primary holders if that's what you want them for. One duck will easily hold a board against a plane, for e.g.

Another consideration for me is that I've never been a fan of metal holders of any type, for woodwork. Apart from the bruising of softer pieces that is more likely to occur with metal, the possibility of a cutting edge meeting a steel dog or holdfast is too horrible to contemplate.....

Cheers,

[BobL]

Another consideration for me is that I've never been a fan of metal holders of any type, for woodwork. Apart from the bruising of softer pieces that is more likely to occur with metal,. . . .

I have often wondered why the surface that contacts the wood is not leather lined since this would eliminate bruising as well as providing a better grip with less pressure. This would probably also be the case for wooden holdfasts.

the possibility of a cutting edge meeting a steel dog or holdfast is too horrible to contemplate.....

Good point!

I have some steel rod sitting on the floor of my shed awaiting mid winter when it will be easier to fire up my forge and have a crack at making some of these.