Shoulder Plane Confusion

[D.W.]

^{A Slater Bullnose! Gad Dave, I forgot I have one of those! Restored it from a piece of junk. It's still a piece of junk for the furniture I build even though it now works ...}





OK, Dave .. I now think that you truly have an obsession for double irons.

Regards from Perth

Derek

I missed the first part about the slater, but I do recall when you first got it. In my case, a friend's dad was a trade carpenter in the UK. When his dad became ill, he brought the tools back to the US - minimal kit. A combination carborundum stone and a washita stone (he threw those away before coming back, I didn't know what a washita was at the time, anyway). His dad's tool kit included a 5 1/2 record, a 4 stanley (UK), a block plane and the bull nose. They had been heavily used and somewhat neglected, but they had his dad's owners marks on them. He didn't want anything but the 4 and he was going to throw the rest away. The Slater had no iron, so I had to make that, but that's a twaddle for such a small plane. It works a treat.

I refurbished the tools I had, not something I would do to someone else's dad's tools, but they were in such rough shape (the rear post was rotted through on the record and the wood broken) that I wasn't harming anything by refurbishing them. I figured the friend would take them back once they worked well, but he refused them so I have the bullnose and 5 1/2 for good. He's not sentimental, that's for sure!!

[D.W.]

I think that could be said of quite a few 'specialist' tools......

While I lived happily enough for many years without a shoulder plane, & used chisels for trimming shoulders, etc. as Derek mentioned, it is a nice thing to have on hand if you can afford one & have the space in your toolbox. Mine only come out two or three times a year for a serious workout, and they get used for a few fine trim jobs in between times in a 'convenient but not essential' role. They're not quite a one-trick pony, but they don't have a big repertoire, that's for sure, so I wouldn't rate them on the list of 'must-have' tools. I'm pleased I have mine, but they are far from the first tool I'd buy if I had to start over.

On the general philosophy of when to acquire specialised tools, clearly mileages vary, but if you are in the early stages of your woodworking career, I certainly wouldn't recommend you rush out & buy any new tool without seriously considering how much use it will get. Unless you are fortunate enough to have an unlimited tool budget, I'd suggest you work on acquiring the most essential & the more versatile tools first. If you do a lot of hand work involving wide tenons and other joints involving end-grain that need to fit seamlessly, a s.p. can make life easier, but there are workarounds that, with care, will deliver just as good a result, so if your need is very occasional, a s.p. could be an expensive luxury. A good quality inch & a half or inch & a quarter chisel, at a fraction of the price, kept very sharp & the back really flat, can do a very fine job of trimming shoulders to a knifed line, as Derek has said - in fact I would reach for one to trim a narrow shoulder rather than a s.p.. While not as technically pleasing, perhaps, a good set of chisels is much more versatile than a shoulder plane.

I think most of us go through stages of wanting tools that seem like a quick way to an end we are struggling to reach. It's very easy to be seduced by a bit of tool bling (& I'm just as susceptible as the next bloke!), but I second D.W.'s advice: acquire tools gradually & learn to fettle & drive each thoroughly. Many of the tools I once thought essential I now know I neither need nor want.

Of course it's easy to dispense 'wisdom' from my current position. In the last 20 years or so, as my finances recovered a little from mortgages, children, and all the other vicissitudes of life, I've added a few 'nice' tools to my kit, so I risk sounding like a bit of a hypocrite. However, I've added nowhere near as many as I would have done if my discretionary spending had been up to it 40 years ago. In a strange way, it's comforting to know that if some disaster forced me to start over, even though I'd sorely miss quite a few, I could still do a tolerable job with about 1/4 of what's in my tool cupboard at the moment....

Cheers,

I offer the comments as a suggestion, but I would be an absolute hypocrite to suggest minimalism is the path I took, too. I've got an obsession with sharpening stones and have probably had ..I don't know...100? ( not all necessarily worth much $$).

I had a lot of bench planes, I had a lot of joinery planes, I still have a lot of chisels. I started hobby woodworking when the magazines and blogs were going strong and starting up, respectively. There was little suggestion in them other than how useful each specialty plane was. To some extent I was had, but otherwise I like to try things for myself, which is a waste of money and time in the long run.

I'm with you on the 1/4 kit. I could go there pretty easily and would love if a newbie beginner showed up with cash in hand wanting to "Try a lot of tools". I always think I'll miss something if I sell it and have trouble letting go of anything I don't have two of, but once I let go of such things, no sentimentality. The bigger issue now is listing and mailing - that's a pain. Aside from carpenters saws and large carving tools, I'd rather make my tools from here on out.

[D.W.]

We've seen a bit of compare and contrast between the SP and a rebate plane, I am curious to see if anyone else shares this sentiment...

I use a fenced rabbet/rebate plane to cut a lot of shoulders and rebates. It's a LV Skew Rabbet.

I find, however, that I use this in tandem with my shoulder plane(s) pretty much every time it's out. Even when I'm really careful and I take my time, I still find that the SP gets at least a bit of use cleaning up tearout or fine tuning the width of shoulders after the rebate plane has bottomed out. While I may reach for the shoulder plane without the rebate plane, I don't ever really reach for the rebate plane without the shoulder plane. Given this fact - and I'm only speaking from my own experience here - I feel that the shoulder plane is a more versatile tool than the dedicated, fenced rebate plane.

Thoughts?

What you're describing for the shoulder plane is work better done by a rabbet plane. The trouble with rabbet planes is the most ideal is probably a single iron skewed 55 degree rabbet, and old means a little refurbishing and new means a whole lot of money. If one can be found in good condition older, that's my choice (I've got a couple and haven't had to make one).

I take a bigger shaving with a rabbet plane than a shoulder plane, but do always clean up a cut rebate. A fenced plane that's basically a fillister and a non-fenced rabbet plane are definitely two very different things.

(and a rabbet plane can do shoulder work, too, but it takes maybe a little more experience in setting a wedged plane and using it when it (the wedged plane) doesn't have much weight and relies on momentum from us to work).

[IanW]

...... but unless I was trying to smash out ten boxes I just love those thick, curly-Q shavings from the SRP....

True, it's easy to enjoy shavings - thick as, or ultra-thin, it's very satisfying to see wood coming off in a properly controlled way. I gt the same satisfaction seeing those great gouged chips that come out of a scrub plane. When it comes to plane shavings, I think I get maximum pleasure from those wispy shavings off the smoother. The beautiful surface that starts to appear is an added pleasure, and it also means the job is getting to thr advanced stages...

But rebates is another matter. It's mostly 'cos I didn't own a working rebate plane until about 15 years ago, so I got into the habit of doing them on the tablesaw - it's so quick, accurate & relatively quiet. In some situations, I will even stoop to using a routah (the screaming, dust-spewing, instant-destroyers-of-wood kind ), but I do my best to avoid that!

Cheers,

[IanW]

.....I'm with you on the 1/4 kit. I could go there pretty easily and would love if a newbie beginner showed up with cash in hand wanting to "Try a lot of tools". I always think I'll miss something if I sell it and have trouble letting go of anything I don't have two of, but once I let go of such things, no sentimentality. The bigger issue now is listing and mailing - that's a pain. Aside from carpenters saws and large carving tools, I'd rather make my tools from here on out....

We musta been born under the same star, DW......

[planemaker]

For rebates and grooves; my personal preference.

Plough Plane (Record 043 & 044); Rebate Plane (Stanley 78); Router Plane ( Veritas mid & Stanley large size).

Stewie;

[derekcohen]

One of the joys of handtools is when you do this ...



... and it comes out like this ...



No much effort, no dust or noise, and just some music in the background and the swish of the plane cutting.

Regards from Perth

Derek