seb001
2nd October 2009, 12:42 PM
I have been lurking on the forum for a little while, as part of a drawn out process to purchase a new cordless drill for DIY stuff around the home. I am not a particularly handy handyman but I wanted to buy something that I could be confident would last a few years and I didn't want to buy Ozito or cheap Ryobi.
My initial budget was $200-$300, which I then stretched to $300-$400, which then ...
After several weeks this was my shortlist:
In the Li-Ion camp:
Hitachi DS18DFL. (45Nm, 1.6kg)... $274 kit with 2x 1.5Ah batteries, ...... v8tools, sydneytools ($295), ..... Made in japan?
Makita BDF452 .. .(50Nm, 1.6kg).. $299 kit with 2x 1.5Ah batteries, ....... totaltools, sydneytools .............Made in China
Metabo BS18Li ...(48Nm, 1.4kg)....$329 2x1.3Ah .................................. on special $329 unitedtools, $378 at vektools .... Made in PRC
Bosch GSR18V-LI (56Nm, 1.6kg).. $340 2x 1.3Ah batteries ................... ebay, justtools ($369) ...............Made in Malaysia
Milwaukee C18DD (38Nm, 1.8kg).. $398 kit with 2x 1.5Ah batteries ......... vektools
Makita BHP452 .. .(50Nm, 1.9kg).. $418 kit with 2x 3.0Ah batteries ......... vektools
Makita BDF452 ... (50Nm, 1.6kg).. $459 kit, 2x 1.5Ah batts, impact driver 1.3kg 145Nm ... totaltools, $499 sydneytools, $469 unitedtools
Bosch GSR18V-LI (56Nm, 1.6kg)... $499 Kit, 3x batteries, impact driver 1.7kg 160Nm ...... fktools price on special ($574-599 elsewhere)
In the non-Li-I camp:
Metabo BSZ18 ..............(62Nm, 2.2kg).......... $209 3yrs warranty. 2x 2.0Ah Ni-Cd ... vektools, justtools ($220) ..Made in Germany? felt a bit too heavy
Bosch GSR 14.4VE2 .......(72Nm, 2.5kg)........ $269 2x 2.6Ah NiMH ........................ Bunnings special EOL. .....Made in Switzerland
Panasonic EY6432 GQKW (44Nm, 2.0kg)........ $395 2x 3.5Ah NIMH 15.6V ............. norwest tools ...................Made in Japan?
In the end I decided I would stretch the budget to get a kit with the impact driver. I didn't know much about impact drivers but they are the bees knees for driving screws.
There is a video presentation here that explains how they work, including a cut-out casing showing the internal mechanism:
EDIT: (linked to the wrong page - with this link the video should start after a few seconds) http://www.finehomebuilding.com/videos/index.aspx?id=97546&c=3
The first day I brought the drills home my FIL was attempting to attach two thin bits of ply with some weedy timber screws and kept rounding the heads. I tried the impact driver and it worked like a charm - even pushing in one of the screws that he'd rounded the head on!
Of course, the other trick I have found to make it easier to put screws in is to rub the thread over a cake of soap - it adds just enough lubrication to help ease the thread into the timber.
My FIL was so impressed he was rather speechless for a bit. I did this without pre-drilling holes either - he was rounding the heads even WITH pre-drilled holes.
I suppose I got ahead of myself there.
Note that there is only one Milwaukee in the shortlist. In my price range the 5 years warranty was an appealing bonus but the comparatively weaker drills put me off (38Nm). No DeWalt either. And the AEG were heavier than I wanted.
In the end I visited a few shops and decided to go sub-2kg. This meant Lithium-Ion.
The Makita BHP452 hammer is about 0.1kg heavier than the BDF542 non-hammer. Also note that 3Ah batteries are about 0.2kg heavier than 1.5Ah units. Hence the BHP452 is listed as 1.9kg with battery compared to 1.6kg for the BHP452. I didn't think I would generally want a cordless hammer drill (apparently the hammer action is not as forceful as the ones on corded drills, naturally). Both drills have the same 300W motor. No other manufacturer seems to quote the motor power, just torque figures.
Note that "stall torque" is not often quoted is probably the true measure of motor torque - however, for comparison purposes the soft-joint/hard-joint torque figures may be useful as a first look. When CHOICE tested drills it tested the stall torque. Results from that article won't be quoted here as the actual model no. is not quoted for each case in the CHOICE article and it is a bit laborious to compare photos, weights etc to get the actual model. Suffice to say CHOICE found that Bosch Blue, Makita, AEG DeWalt performed well but didn't test Hilti, Panasonic, Milwaukee, Metabo. CHOICE found the Hitachi I listed above a bit down on torque. The Ryobi scored well overall because of its good battery score but was also down on torque compared to the top scorers.
In the end I decided to splash out and get a kit with the impact driver - in the past I have been annoyed at having only a single drill and having to switch tools (pre-drill, then screw, then repeat, at least for the first few screws in a project until the pieces are held together and then pre-drill the lot in one go). I was also intrigued by the idea that the impact drill provides rotational impacts to increase the instantaneous torque applied to a screw head and minimise head-rounding (apparently, it can happen that the screw head gets twisted off before the screw head gets rounded...)
So then it came down to the Makita kit or the Bosch blue kit. Aparently for Queenslanders tradeltoolsdirect stores had a great in-store special on the Bosch kit earlier in the year but I live Sydney way and they may not have any left. (I found the PDF of the May and August catalogues still in Google).
I decided to plump for the Makita. Visiting a few worksites recently in the course of my job (I am an Acoustic Consultant) I noticed Makitas and Panasonics in the main, with a few Bosch Blue - this helped me form the shortlist but not the final decision.
The main reason I opted for the Makita was the fact I could pick it up local to me (not have to order online or make a trip over towards the city) and because the Makita impact driver was only 1.3kg compared to the Bosch 1.7kg (145Nm only a bit down on the 160Nm of the heavier unit).
Two things I noticed AFTER I bought it - it comes with a belt hook but NOT with a bit holder! I went to totaltools (not where I initially bought it) who ordered me one for the princely sum of $3. Seriously, for $3 as the aftermarket price Makita left it OUT?!
The other thing is that Makita advertises the batteries as "1.5Ah" but the User Manual states they are only 1.3Ah according to EU test Standards. A bit misleading. (The 3Ah IS 3Ah according to EU Standards though).
Anyway, Lithium-Ion charge pretty quickly, keep their charge on the shelf pretty well, and if I ever do a big job in the future then I can always order a spare 3Ah battery off ebay for $120.
Also note that the Makita kit case is ONLY for one drill at a time... Doh. Didn't check the Bosch case.
So far quite happy with both drills. They have an LED light to help illuminate the workspace. The light stays on 15 seconds after the drill stops. The chuck is quite good to use - much better than my old Ryobi which needed two hands. The Manual shows that the motor carbon brushes can be replaced when they wear down.
Also note that when comparing drills the conversion between American inch-pounds and metric Nm is very close to 9 (i.e. 450in-lbs = 50Nm).
Some people advocate getting a $50 Ozito or similar cheap drill and just replacing it every year. I don't like that approach. I am disappointed in the 1 year warranty (6 months trade warranty) but I trust that Makita's QA procedures in the Chinese factory work well and that the drill will last 5-10 years.
edit: fixed the link to the video. I thought it was a great video, actually shows the insides of an impact driver with th ecasing cut away.
My initial budget was $200-$300, which I then stretched to $300-$400, which then ...
After several weeks this was my shortlist:
In the Li-Ion camp:
Hitachi DS18DFL. (45Nm, 1.6kg)... $274 kit with 2x 1.5Ah batteries, ...... v8tools, sydneytools ($295), ..... Made in japan?
Makita BDF452 .. .(50Nm, 1.6kg).. $299 kit with 2x 1.5Ah batteries, ....... totaltools, sydneytools .............Made in China
Metabo BS18Li ...(48Nm, 1.4kg)....$329 2x1.3Ah .................................. on special $329 unitedtools, $378 at vektools .... Made in PRC
Bosch GSR18V-LI (56Nm, 1.6kg).. $340 2x 1.3Ah batteries ................... ebay, justtools ($369) ...............Made in Malaysia
Milwaukee C18DD (38Nm, 1.8kg).. $398 kit with 2x 1.5Ah batteries ......... vektools
Makita BHP452 .. .(50Nm, 1.9kg).. $418 kit with 2x 3.0Ah batteries ......... vektools
Makita BDF452 ... (50Nm, 1.6kg).. $459 kit, 2x 1.5Ah batts, impact driver 1.3kg 145Nm ... totaltools, $499 sydneytools, $469 unitedtools
Bosch GSR18V-LI (56Nm, 1.6kg)... $499 Kit, 3x batteries, impact driver 1.7kg 160Nm ...... fktools price on special ($574-599 elsewhere)
In the non-Li-I camp:
Metabo BSZ18 ..............(62Nm, 2.2kg).......... $209 3yrs warranty. 2x 2.0Ah Ni-Cd ... vektools, justtools ($220) ..Made in Germany? felt a bit too heavy
Bosch GSR 14.4VE2 .......(72Nm, 2.5kg)........ $269 2x 2.6Ah NiMH ........................ Bunnings special EOL. .....Made in Switzerland
Panasonic EY6432 GQKW (44Nm, 2.0kg)........ $395 2x 3.5Ah NIMH 15.6V ............. norwest tools ...................Made in Japan?
In the end I decided I would stretch the budget to get a kit with the impact driver. I didn't know much about impact drivers but they are the bees knees for driving screws.
There is a video presentation here that explains how they work, including a cut-out casing showing the internal mechanism:
EDIT: (linked to the wrong page - with this link the video should start after a few seconds) http://www.finehomebuilding.com/videos/index.aspx?id=97546&c=3
The first day I brought the drills home my FIL was attempting to attach two thin bits of ply with some weedy timber screws and kept rounding the heads. I tried the impact driver and it worked like a charm - even pushing in one of the screws that he'd rounded the head on!
Of course, the other trick I have found to make it easier to put screws in is to rub the thread over a cake of soap - it adds just enough lubrication to help ease the thread into the timber.
My FIL was so impressed he was rather speechless for a bit. I did this without pre-drilling holes either - he was rounding the heads even WITH pre-drilled holes.
I suppose I got ahead of myself there.
Note that there is only one Milwaukee in the shortlist. In my price range the 5 years warranty was an appealing bonus but the comparatively weaker drills put me off (38Nm). No DeWalt either. And the AEG were heavier than I wanted.
In the end I visited a few shops and decided to go sub-2kg. This meant Lithium-Ion.
The Makita BHP452 hammer is about 0.1kg heavier than the BDF542 non-hammer. Also note that 3Ah batteries are about 0.2kg heavier than 1.5Ah units. Hence the BHP452 is listed as 1.9kg with battery compared to 1.6kg for the BHP452. I didn't think I would generally want a cordless hammer drill (apparently the hammer action is not as forceful as the ones on corded drills, naturally). Both drills have the same 300W motor. No other manufacturer seems to quote the motor power, just torque figures.
Note that "stall torque" is not often quoted is probably the true measure of motor torque - however, for comparison purposes the soft-joint/hard-joint torque figures may be useful as a first look. When CHOICE tested drills it tested the stall torque. Results from that article won't be quoted here as the actual model no. is not quoted for each case in the CHOICE article and it is a bit laborious to compare photos, weights etc to get the actual model. Suffice to say CHOICE found that Bosch Blue, Makita, AEG DeWalt performed well but didn't test Hilti, Panasonic, Milwaukee, Metabo. CHOICE found the Hitachi I listed above a bit down on torque. The Ryobi scored well overall because of its good battery score but was also down on torque compared to the top scorers.
In the end I decided to splash out and get a kit with the impact driver - in the past I have been annoyed at having only a single drill and having to switch tools (pre-drill, then screw, then repeat, at least for the first few screws in a project until the pieces are held together and then pre-drill the lot in one go). I was also intrigued by the idea that the impact drill provides rotational impacts to increase the instantaneous torque applied to a screw head and minimise head-rounding (apparently, it can happen that the screw head gets twisted off before the screw head gets rounded...)
So then it came down to the Makita kit or the Bosch blue kit. Aparently for Queenslanders tradeltoolsdirect stores had a great in-store special on the Bosch kit earlier in the year but I live Sydney way and they may not have any left. (I found the PDF of the May and August catalogues still in Google).
I decided to plump for the Makita. Visiting a few worksites recently in the course of my job (I am an Acoustic Consultant) I noticed Makitas and Panasonics in the main, with a few Bosch Blue - this helped me form the shortlist but not the final decision.
The main reason I opted for the Makita was the fact I could pick it up local to me (not have to order online or make a trip over towards the city) and because the Makita impact driver was only 1.3kg compared to the Bosch 1.7kg (145Nm only a bit down on the 160Nm of the heavier unit).
Two things I noticed AFTER I bought it - it comes with a belt hook but NOT with a bit holder! I went to totaltools (not where I initially bought it) who ordered me one for the princely sum of $3. Seriously, for $3 as the aftermarket price Makita left it OUT?!
The other thing is that Makita advertises the batteries as "1.5Ah" but the User Manual states they are only 1.3Ah according to EU test Standards. A bit misleading. (The 3Ah IS 3Ah according to EU Standards though).
Anyway, Lithium-Ion charge pretty quickly, keep their charge on the shelf pretty well, and if I ever do a big job in the future then I can always order a spare 3Ah battery off ebay for $120.
Also note that the Makita kit case is ONLY for one drill at a time... Doh. Didn't check the Bosch case.
So far quite happy with both drills. They have an LED light to help illuminate the workspace. The light stays on 15 seconds after the drill stops. The chuck is quite good to use - much better than my old Ryobi which needed two hands. The Manual shows that the motor carbon brushes can be replaced when they wear down.
Also note that when comparing drills the conversion between American inch-pounds and metric Nm is very close to 9 (i.e. 450in-lbs = 50Nm).
Some people advocate getting a $50 Ozito or similar cheap drill and just replacing it every year. I don't like that approach. I am disappointed in the 1 year warranty (6 months trade warranty) but I trust that Makita's QA procedures in the Chinese factory work well and that the drill will last 5-10 years.
edit: fixed the link to the video. I thought it was a great video, actually shows the insides of an impact driver with th ecasing cut away.