Antique Jewellers lathe

[Woodlee]

I picked this little gem up a couple of weeks ago .

Its a Taylor 6mm jewellers or watchmakers lathe .Made in Sydney Australia
Came in a nice wooden box ( cedar I think) with some collets and a carrier plate .
I'm going to power it with an old Singer sewing machine motor .

It has the cutest little ball handles on it I have ever seen.

Kev.

[wheelinround]

:worthless:

what took you so long Kev

Very nice I am not showing LOML she will want to swap sox for it

[Woodlee]

Hi Ray ,
I actually "lost" the draw bar for it , when I opened the box I took out the lathe and the base and put it together , I must have picked up the drawbar and placed it on the bench , Its been so hot here I have been leaving bits of rag around the shop at strategic places for wiping my sweaty head .I must have put a rag over the draw bar on the bench .
Ive been running around like a head less chook looking for a 5MMX .7 mm taps and die to make a draw bar.
And yesterday I was making some universal joints for my dial indicator thingy for my milling machine and was at the bench , I picked up the head rag to wipe the dripping perspiration from my head , and I heard this laughing drawbar .!#^&F@@K*#!.

Quick Email to the guy I bought it from apologising for having him running around looking for the "lost" bit.

Cute little ball handles ,, hey?

Heres the uni joints for my dial indicator

[Ashore]

what an absolute gem :2tsup:

[wheelinround]

:roll: So now you have it tethered to it Kev :U ...

The Uni joints look good might have to think about making a set.

[lightwood]

Kev,
I've only seen a couple of the AU made lathes, not common at all. Nice find!! ( including the draw bar!)
I sort of collect these....and use a couple of them occasionally.
A Lorch 6mm, and the fancy 6 jaw chuck, an 8mm Lorch, another Lorch with a milling attachment, and the one I use most often, another Lorch 8mm with a gold ring on which I'm cutting a bevel on the edge.
And an 8mm collet Bergeon drill, never seen another like it before. Got that one REAL CHEAP at the HTPAA sale in July.
Regards,
Peter

[AUSSIE]

I am turning into a hijacker now.I was a bounty hunter:D
This post has got me going abit.In a good way.
I am about to sell my little Toyo ML1 watchmakers lathe.
I have been told it is very rare
I have the orig receipt and manual from when I bought it(1984) some orig tooling,an unused face plate,some new belts,Live centre and a 6.4mm tailstock chuck.Very little use on whole lot.I am a bit attached to the little thing,but things chance and it must go.I have bought a C3 Seig chinese lathe.I know it isnt made as good as the little toy but it is the size I need now.I have very limited space plus can use the money.
Anyhow I will stop the carp,sorry.
I have been told by another forum member it could be worth more than I think.
Could some forum members please let me know how much I should sell it for or maybe a start price on ebay.I am not sure how to sell it.:B

[Woodlee]

All nice pieces Peter .Very nice collection .
I bought the one I got just because I liked the look of it .There was also a little press with a heap of punches in another box that came with the lathe It has a table on it that has different sized hole in it .The table can rotate .My limited knowledge of such tools tells me it's a staking press , I guess its for punching holes or something.I will get a picture of it and post .

I noticed in the inside of the main drive pulley on the lathe , a series of small holes in the face of the pulley and I see on one of those links you sent me , they have a Chinese watchmakers lathe that has an indexing pin set up which locates in the holes in the pulley .I also see them in the picture of your lathe with the 6 jaw chuck . I'm guessing these are for indexing the spindle for filing or making settings at regular intervals or cutting gears for clocks .
My knowledge of the use of these lathes is very limited , but I have seen a couple of vids on U tube of craftsmen using them.
I need to make up some gravers so I can try it out.
I will try to get a tap and die so I can make some more collets and other bits and pieces ,as I think the 6mm stuff is hard to get.


Aussie , I have no idea what your machine is worth , these machines are out of my realm ,maybe Peter will have a better idea. .
The new Chinese watchmakers lathe I saw on Ebay US was around $1500.00US IIRC

Kev.

[lightwood]

All nice pieces Peter .Very nice collection .
I bought the one I got just because I liked the look of it .There was also a little press with a heap of punches in another box that came with the lathe It has a table on it that has different sized hole in it .The table can rotate .My limited knowledge of such tools tells me it's a staking press , I guess its for punching holes or something.I will get a picture of it and post .

I noticed in the inside of the main drive pulley on the lathe , a series of small holes in the face of the pulley and I see on one of those links you sent me , they have a Chinese watchmakers lathe that has an indexing pin set up which locates in the holes in the pulley .I also see them in the picture of your lathe with the 6 jaw chuck . I'm guessing these are for indexing the spindle for filing or making settings at regular intervals or cutting gears for clocks .
My knowledge of the use of these lathes is very limited , but I have seen a couple of vids on U tube of craftsmen using them.
I need to make up some gravers so I can try it out.
I will try to get a tap and die so I can make some more collets and other bits and pieces ,as I think the 6mm stuff is hard to get.


Aussie , I have no idea what your machine is worth , these machines are out of my realm ,maybe Peter will have a better idea. .
The new Chinese watchmakers lathe I saw on Ebay US was around $1500.00US IIRC

Kev.
Kev,
the big brass disk on my larger Lorch lathe is also an indexing wheel. They are used for gear cutting etc.
Like you Kev, I have no idea about the Japanese lathe above. It looks like a great little lathe. I did a look around the www and it looks like it has change gears for screw cutting, that is nice!
The punch set is a probably a staking set, like a set of press tools to push wheels onto shafts, bushes into clock plates, and any other press type operation on a watch or clock movement.
I sold my largish collection of watch & clock tools about a year ago, but I kept the lathes.
Antique clock and watch tools (http://www.petermcbride.com/watchtools/)

Regards,
Peter

[Woodlee]

Peter , here are pics of the press and the tools that came with the lathe .
The press has no makers name on it so I'm not sure of it was made by the same maker as the lathe.
The tools have a bit of surface rust on them but other wise look to be in good condition.
I tried to get some info regarding the lathe and tools from the fellow I bought it from , he said it was from a deceased estate so I didn't push the issue.

Kev.

[wheelinround]

I was watching this whole sale on epay :doh: glad I wasn't biding against you Kev :;

[Woodlee]

Ray ,
I thought I paid a very low price for such a rarity .
Are you accusing me of blowing my dough ?:D

I've had a brain fart , I was going to try and get the 5mm x.7 taps and dies to make some more collets , but I just thought , why not make another draw bar with the standard 5mm x.8 thread for which I have taps and dies for and make collets as needed using this thread .
Simple really don't now why I didn't think of it before, some thing about trees and forests


Kev.

[wheelinround]

Ray ,
I thought I paid a very low price for such a rarity .
Are you accusing me of blowing my dough ?:D

I've had a brain fart , I was going to try and get the 5mm x.7 taps and dies to make some more collets , but I just thought , why not make another draw bar with the standard 5mm x.8 thread for which I have taps and dies for and make collets as needed using this thread .
Simple really don't now why I didn't think of it before, some thing about trees and forests


Kev.

No Kev I thought when I saw what it went for "Luck bastwerd" to find out it was you great score. :2tsup: you could always use it to turn miniatures on Kev.:roll:

Its nice to know I can put in an order for parts made by Kev from micro to mega with the lathes you have :U

[Grahame Collins]

Hi Kev.
Your lathe is a dead ringer for one my dad owned as a watchmaker jeweler.He also ran it from a Singer sewing machine motor with the electric foot treadle control.

The other tools are staking tools as already noted.

The gear these days has only a curiousity value as watchmaker s don't do much on mechanical watches.

Theres only a few old fellas around that can fix the mechanical ones. Consequently theres not much call other than curiousity value for the tools.

Seeing the gear brings back memories as as regulary got into strife for touching the old mans gear.

Grahame

[Woodlee]

Well curiosity certainly got me ,I hope to be able to use it for making smaller items and to do some hand turning .In all the years I have used lathes I have only turned nylon bar by hand ( in the same fashion as a wood lathe.)I ground up an old 12"file and used that to make concave nylon rollers for a rock drill .
Probably won't get much use , and I still have to figure out to make the gravers using HSS . Or what shapes to make.
I have the foot pedal controlled Singer motor ,which came from my Grandmother's treadle machine ,which she converted to motor power.
My Sister inherited the machine and had it restored ,but decided to leave the motor off it.

Kev

[wheelinround]

Kev sent an e-mail with OT cutter shapes maybe useful

[Chris Vesper]

Woodlee: Re the collets threads: They can be a bit of a nightmare of confusion. I have listed the official thread for a B6 collet like yours is 5mm by 36f with 55 Deg geometry.

Best to use the real thread rather than make your own standard of regular M5. This means when you get more collets and spindle trinkets they will all just fit without having to even change drawbars.

Just for some intersting reading: This week I have been neck deep in watchmaking collets and threads. I had some very small pins to turn in my lathe, smallest being 1.2mm dia from stainless steel. How to hold them when my regular 5C collets only go down to 2mm? However I do have a good collection of the B8 collets. So I made an adaptor plug like a fake 8mm spindle complete with key and all for my 25mm 5C collet, bought a length of seamless cold drawn tube for a drawbar. I screwcut the thread INSIDE the drawbar for the standard B8 thread which is...get this: 6.82 dia by 0.625 pitch, 55 Deg geometry. Thats what it says in the book, thats what was confirmed on an optical projector if no-one believes me. Lucky my lathe cuts that pitch...
It all worked beautifully. I now have an 8mm watchmakers lathe in the form of a Feeler toolroom lathe... Photos in my Museum>The collection>Engineering.

I have a PDF copy from Schaublin of collets, thread and spindle dimensions if you need it Woodlee.

Cheers
Chris

[Woodlee]

Hi Chris ,
I'm not sure ill be able to get any collets for this machine , all the stuff I've seen available is for the 8mm machines only .
Peter gave me a few links to Ebay sellers ,but I have not tried asking as yet .

I assume you mean the thread pitch you mentioned (36f )for the 6mm lathe is 5mm x 36tpi .I dont have any specialist thread measuring devices apart from a Moore and Wright thread gauge so hence the .7 pitch assumption.
I haven't had a chance to get into setting this little gem up as yet , another much larger project with 4 wheels has jumped the line ,and I have to get it finished first.

I would like and appreciate a copy of the pdf . It will help me out immensely , I'm sure my Myford will cut this pitch thread straight off the gearbox , if not I have a full set of change gears which I can use to get the correct pitch .

Kev.

[Chris Vesper]

Hi Woodlee,

Send me an email through my website and I will reply with the PDF.

It will be most important to get the pitch of the thread exactly right. If it is out bu a little bit the drawbar will go on by maybe one or two turns and then jam up. It needs to be a nice turning fit ALL the way.

I can only presume the 36f means 36 TPI. If you have any mates with an optical projector they will be able to give you an exact measurement off a collet.

Don't give me that crap about not finding collets for it...!! It will be hard in the NT but if you ever come to Sydney or Melb for a bit - go and visit sales, antique shops, tool sales and of course machinery dealers and they will turn up eventually.

[Woodlee]

Chris ,
E-mail sent.

Thanks
Kev.

[chippy 71]

Kev,
the big brass disk on my larger Lorch lathe is also an indexing wheel. They are used for gear cutting etc.
Like you Kev, I have no idea about the Japanese lathe above. It looks like a great little lathe. I did a look around the www and it looks like it has change gears for screw cutting, that is nice!
The punch set is a probably a staking set, like a set of press tools to push wheels onto shafts, bushes into clock plates, and any other press type operation on a watch or clock movement.
I sold my largish collection of watch & clock tools about a year ago, but I kept the lathes.
Antique clock and watch tools (http://www.petermcbride.com/watchtools/)

Regards,
Peter

Peter, you have solved a query for me with your Antique Clock and Watch Tools. I have had a clamp for 50 years and wondered what it was or used for.
It is a Stubbs hand clamp!

Thank you for that!

Colin.

[lightwood]

Hi Woodlee,

Send me an email through my website and I will reply with the PDF.

It will be most important to get the pitch of the thread exactly right. If it is out bu a little bit the drawbar will go on by maybe one or two turns and then jam up. It needs to be a nice turning fit ALL the way.

I can only presume the 36f means 36 TPI. If you have any mates with an optical projector they will be able to give you an exact measurement off a collet.

Don't give me that crap about not finding collets for it...!! It will be hard in the NT but if you ever come to Sydney or Melb for a bit - go and visit sales, antique shops, tool sales and of course machinery dealers and they will turn up eventually.
Chris,
Don't you have an Australian made watchmakers lathe and staking set in your collection of machines??
You must let me know where the stash of 6mm lathe collets are:?:?
I've had about 7 or 8 lots of watchmakers stuff go through my hands, and see the tools for sale (second hand) in the trade, at watch/clock materials suppliers...but I've only ever seen a few 6mm lathes for sale in 30 years, and collets separate from them...I think never. I must take a walk through every junk shop in and around Melbourne more than anyone I know....and never seen any there either...Perhaps I've been looking in all the wrong places:U:U

Regards,
Peter

[lightwood]

Peter, you have solved a query for me with your Antique Clock and Watch Tools. I have had a clamp for 50 years and wondered what it was or used for.
It is a Stubbs hand clamp!

Thank you for that!

Colin.
Good news Colin!
Regards,
Peter

[Grahame Collins]

I spoke to my watchmaker friend about the collets for the lathes.He says Smith and Smith of Sydney are the guys who will likely have what you want.They have a website as well.

Also he has got collets for 8mm lathe ( only) at Sherline.

Hope it helps

Grahame