shaper price advice

[welder]

i am looking at getting a metal sharper a found one that a guy has in the local paper it's an atlas i think it's a 7 inch from the photo it's up for offer what would be a good price and what do you think a machine like that would weigh would i need a trailer or would it go in the back of a lancer wagon thanks Andre

[Dave J]

Around 310 pounds going by the links below.
I bought my Douglas for $450 with spares and that was a good price. I have seen them go anywhere up to $1500
http://neme-s.org/Shaper%20Books/Michael_Moore/Atlas%201937-Shaper.pdf

Page Title (http://www.lathes.co.uk/atlasshaper/)
Dave

[bollie7]

would it go in the back of a lancer wagon thanks Andre Not if you want to keep driving it.:C Probably not a good idea to lift it using the ram either, as tempting as that is. Dave J's the current guru on shaper shifting.
bollie7

[welder]

well i bought it cost $180 it's an atlas 7b it needs a new belt so i wont be shaping till Monday also does any one have instruction on how to sharpen the cutters thanks Andre.

[Dave J]

You cant complain at that price.
Shaper tools are ground like lathe tools, rounded nose gives a nice finish on a flat piece.
Did you bring it home in the car?
Dave

[welder]

hi guys yeah we did bring it home in the car it was alright but it needs a tune up and a new belt but other than that it's great.

[Plushy]

You luck son of gun i am very jealous :2tsup:

now where`s the photos ?

[welder]

hi guys i need help i put a belt on tonight and it just wont cut the machine works but what's happening is it startes to cut and makes a v shaped grove then lifts up then on the second stroke the tool snapes and the vice gets pushed out of the tee slots. i think its the tool post as it's not the original american tool post just a bar with a 1/4 hole for tools.

[Dave J]

Can you take a picture of the tool post and and tool holder, it sounds like a boring bar.
Dave

[pipeclay]

I take it that this is a machine that you have never used before.

If the tool you are useing is attached to the clacker box as you seem to describe I dont think you have a problem with the tool post.

Have you adjusted the cross feed rate,if not you may be feeding to much and putting to much load on your tool.

How much of the HSS is sticking out of the tool holder.

What depth of cut are you useing.

How much clearance are you allowing the tool at the end of its stroke.

How much over run are you allowing on the cutting stroke.

What Strokes/min are you running.

Do you have auto down feed on the tool post.

[welder]

i cant get pics till Monday.the machine has manual down feed.it dosent have tool holer just a hole on the toll post for 1/4 tool steel so the tool has to stick out a fare ways to clear the ram. it is feeding at the slowest rate but i dont think thats the problem as it wont cut on the first stoke entering the work.and i am running it it 45 strokes a minute. i decided to make a tool post and tool holders so i will see how that works.

[welder]

well i got the tool post and holder installed and it kept on snapping tools so on my last piece of hss i aneled it and low and behold it worked and cut really well all the best Andre.

[bollie7]

Andre
Still sounds like somethings not quite right though. You shouldn't have to anneal the HSS to use it in a shaper.

bollie7

[welder]

well i made up another tool holder for thicker tool steel and it works better than the annealed 1/4 inch steel

[welder]

the pics

[Dave J]

Hi Andre,
Those drill press vice's are better suited to a drill as there not real strong, it could be a part of your problem getting lift in the job. A milling vice would be better if you can get hold of one.
Dave

[welder]

its been a while but i think i found the reason foe my bad surface finish. the nut that raised the clapper box is worn out and you can almost pull the nut through the thread.

[Dave J]

The only thing it would allow is to cut deeper and deeper.
If your gibs are tight when cutting this shouldn't be a problem, other than adjustment.
To use it for now on basic surfacing cuts, you could lock it up by tightening the gibs right up and use the knee.
Not sure where you would buy one, I think it will need to be made.

Dave

[welder]

i dont think making a nut will be to difficult to make if i can find out what the thread is. the gib is badly scored and is bent so i might need to replace it.

[Dave J]

Don't forget pictures, we all love them.

Dave

[Woodlee]

You make me sick with envy .:D
Wish I could find some thing like that never see any thing like that up here .
Kev.

[Dave J]

the pics

Not sure how I missed this, good job on the holders.:2tsup:

Dave

[welder]

well i dont have any pictures of the nut as i left my camera at home and wont be in the shed for 3 weeks. thanks for the complements guys.

[steran50]

well i bought it cost $180 it's an atlas 7b it needs a new belt so i wont be shaping till Monday also does any one have instruction on how to sharpen the cutters thanks Andre.

HI,Here is a Link that I have come across in the Past about Sharpening Lathe and Shaper Tool Bits Metal Shaper Column 41 (http://www.neme-s.org/shapers/columns/shaper_column_41.html) . It would be good to have a Shaper, but My Workshop is Full enough now.Happy Shaping.

[Bryan]

well i bought it cost $180 it's an atlas 7b it needs a new belt so i wont be shaping till Monday also does any one have instruction on how to sharpen the cutters thanks Andre.

I know you asked the question a year ago, but I've only recently been looking for the same info. Many texts are disappointing on this subject; these are the 2 most detailed sources I've found:

Google Books: Moltrecht's Machine Shop Practice Vol 2 (http://books.google.com/books?id=dhX93Mxkxn4C&printsec=frontcover&dq=moltrecht&hl=en&ei=GnyBTeubNI22vQONytzoBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCgQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false). The part on cutting tools starts on page 12.

Index of /Shaper Books/Shaper Work (http://www.neme-s.org/Shaper%20Books/Shaper%20Work/). You want section 8.

[welder]

thanks for those links Bryan they are really descriptive. i was at the shaper yesterday and i cant tell yet but the down feed screw seems to be stuffed as well i cant tel till i clean it though. also how can i determine the thread i am assuming it's acme

[pipeclay]

Best way would be to measure it once you have it apart.

[welder]

well the thread is a standard 1/2" x 13 tpi unc thread although the thread that holds the vernier scale is 23/64" by 24 tpi so it is a job for the lathe as for a new nut what material would you recommend.

[pipeclay]

Not sure what you are measuring or using to give you your selection of Thread type.
It would appear unless you have made an error in your measurements or the thread type that Atlas have made there own custom threads.
In regards to the Speacial nut you may have to make why not go with what Atlas used originally or if no longer available the next best substitue.

[welder]

well i know that the thread that holds the vernier is custom but i may have miscounted i will get an imperial thread gauge . the original nut seems to be bronze is there any particular type that would be well suited to the job

[pipeclay]

To put it simple you wont find a 13 tpi 1/2" UNF thread.
You will find a 13 tpi 1/2" UNC thread.
Not doubting your measurement but it would not make much sence for a machine tool manufacturer to put a thread of 23/64" 24 tpi UNF in place of somewhere you could use a 3/8" 24 tpi UNF thread.
Unless you were going to be using this shaper to make a daily income and be running it at 8 to 12 hrs a day 5 to 7 days a week just use a piece of bronze which is the cheapest to buy.

[welder]

opps i realized i wrote 1/2 unf i meant to write unc i have now changed it. i measured again and came to 9.25 mm or 0.3641"

[4-6-4]

Dear Welder, The photo you posted of the shaper looks to have a piece missing on the front of the clapper box. I have access to a monster shaper so I will post photos. I know this will create screams and shouts, but just about every thing you can do on a shaper can be don on a Mill with the right attachments. Although it is mesmerizing and relaxing to watch a shaper work. Usually you can set the beast to go and then work on something else while waiting for a cut to finish. When I was an apprentice I worked one that had two heads both working at once. 4-6-4

[Dave J]

I agree about the mill to some extent, but what about internal key ways. Also with a shaper it has cheap tooling compared to a mill which is perfect for the home shop as we don't usually have a lot of money but plenty of time.
Cutting dovetails in a shaper costs cents from a piece of HSS, but doing them on a mill will cost at least $30 for the cutter and if you don't get the speed and feed right you will destroy it in minutes and have to buy another.

Dave