Costs of Importing Machinery from China - REPORT

[markjaffa]

Having just imported a HM-52G mill, and about 800kg of other mill/lathe accessories, I thought I might let everyone know what the result was in regards to duty, freight, and GST. I posted this info elsewhere, but thought it deserved its own thread.

There were over 100 accessories that appeared on my invoice, all of which had to be classified according to Customs tariff classification scheme.

This was done by a Customs Broker that was employed by the Freight Forwarder that I used to bring in my goods from Qingdao. I am glad that I paid them (AU$175+GST) to do the job - I would have classified the items differently. This fee is regardless of the shipment size. If I classified the items, some would have attracted Import Duty - they classified all items as Duty Free! Very happy with that! :2tsup:

Sea Freight was very cheap. It was charged at the actual cubic volume of the shipment to three decimal places - 4.491m cubed, at US$45 a cubic metre. Came to AU$219.57 - no GST. I have seen 20' containers being shipped from ports in China to OZ for US$300 - short notice shipping to fill up a vessel.

Unloading charges at Fremantle added much more to the cost than the freight. Cost twice as much to get it off the ship to a warehouse 2km away than it cost to get it from China to Australia. ?!:? These charges are charged at a rate of AU$110+GST per cubic metre. Came to AU$543.41 - inc GST. These charges are related to having a Less than a Container Load shipment - I believe this is where the Freight Forwarders make their money. A full container would still cost more dollars, but it would add less to each cubic metre.

Australian Quarantine charges were low - they accepted all the documents provided by my suppliers attesting to the treatment of the timber, and that the machinery was all new and had not been field tested/used. If these documents had not been in order, there would have been AQIS inspection and possibly treatment charges. But in my case the charges were AU$164 - no GST on this lot. There were two other charges as well - relating to Cargo Automation Fee and a Delivery Fee - came to AU$121 - inc GST. These charges are all on a per shipment basis - larger orders would attract the same costs.

Total invoice value from my suppliers was US$7660 - split between two suppliers at US$745 and US$6915. As one of these invoices is under AU$1000, no GST was charged. The other invoice was converted to AU$7513.47 - excluding GST. Freight was added to this value, and then 10% GST was applied. GST came out as AU$783.91 - obviously no GST is added to the GST!

So - totals. Invoice values of AU$8322.47. Total import/freight/Customs/Quarantine costs of AU$2024.40. This gives an import cost of less than 25% of the Invoice value. And this is for a small order - if you bring in a FCL (Full Container Load) it would be a lot cheaper per cubic metre/item.

IMPORT charges DON'T explain the large discrepancy between the cost from the manufacturer and the retail price in Australia - local suppliers seem to have a very, very healthy profit margin, obviously at our expense
So Import costs DON'T explain why we get ripped off by local suppliers:~ - which is why I will continue to shop overseas. Don't be restricted by local pricing - look overseas for your goods. As we all know - they are made in the same factory anyway.

[K_S]

Interesting reading, ta

[Com_VC]

So have you worked out how much all this would have cost if you purchased from Australia?

[derekcohen]

So have you worked out how much all this would have cost if you purchased from Australia?

And I am also curious to know what you will do if you need to return a part or have something serviced or repaired? What backup do you have? - that's essentially - supposedly (:C) - what you pay your dealer for.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Dave J]

Interesting,
I have no problems with importing tooling, but when it gets to machine I think a bit different.
As we all know I had problems with 2 HM52's mills, they were picked up both times at there expense and returned to the store and was replaced with a better one.
If there is a problem with an imported one, it's a long way and expensive to send it back, and who is going to have to pay?
I have read and looked at a photo were a US fellow imported a lathe that had a hole in the main way. I am not sure how it's turned out, but thats the risk you run importing your own machinery.

Dave

[.RC.]

One advantage of importing a machine is you get to choose what you want...

Don't be fooled into thinking what you see in the shops is all that is produced...Importers only import what they think they can sell.. There are a lot of various machines made in China and elsewhere that you will never see imported here as they would never sell them...

Large manual milling machines that for all intents and purposes are obsolete because of CNC are still made new in other countries, planers, shapers are still made new in other countries...

Even Takisawa still list a manual lathe on their Japanese website...Cost would be prohibitive but they still list it.... Even Monarch still list the 10EE as being available new for an ~US$80 000 sum of course..

Have a browse on this site to see what is available http://www.machinery-china.com/web/index.asp

Takisawa lathe http://www.takisawa.co.jp/products/index-02.htm

[Dave J]

Hi RC,
I saw your posting on PM about other types of Chinese machines. The only thing with a 1 off machine in the country is parts. If you buy something that is also sold here you have a better chance of getting parts for them, especially if the company ever folds in the future.
Dave

[RayG]

Hi Mark,

Congratulations :2tsup: on successfully importing the HM52, I would have been a bundle of nerves waiting to see if it arrived. I'm still waiting on my HM52 from H&F.

That said, I buy most stuff (electronic components) direct from US distributors, and I get my PCB's from a company in China, but importing a whole container load, wow, that is a whole other ball game.

Thanks for the details on the shipping charges, very interesting.

Regards
Ray

[markjaffa]

The value of the goods I have imported, when added up from H&F's catalog is over AU$24000. :U

The terms of the warranty agreement I negotiated with the company owner while I visited him in China was 12 months parts, all shipping at their expense via Courier/Air Mail. Items would not need to be returned for repair - just replaced, or the parts to repair would be sent if possible.

I didnt go into this like a lot of people would - they see the prices and dont consider the medium/long term picture. I did my research, I sent hundreds of emails, I requested photos, I went to China, I visited the factory, I meet the companies owner, I dined with the factories manager. The company has been making tools for 20 years, and they export all over the world, including to H&F.

A saving of AU$14000 is worth risking some hassles over IMHO - if someone was to think it isnt then they should buy from Australia and shouldnt whinge about being overcharged. Join the "global village" and buy where you get good service and prices, regardless of the location. This isnt for everyone - but my situation/needs allowed this approach.

[Graziano]

Thanks for the report!, I'd been tempted to import direct based on the obvious price differences I'd paid for identical dial gauges and micrometers at CDCO in the USA vs H&F in Australia. If I recall correctly the one inch to three inch micrometer set was US$39 vs AU$121 for exactly the same item (Measumax) so I bought a heap of stuff that fit into a US$40 prepaid box and it arrived in nine days.

[.RC.]

Wow, that must have been a lot of accessories.. 800kg worth...

[Vernonv]

Did you include in your costings your trip to China and the amount of actual time you spent setting up this import?

[eskimo]

Did you include in your costings your trip to China and the amount of actual time you spent setting up this import?

Probably not but how revelant is it anyway...
going overseas is as good as a holiday<
one own time is your own...you aint forking out hard earned cash for someone to do what one can do himself,
and can/would it really all add up to what the retailers want anyway?

[markjaffa]

Did you include in your costings your trip to China and the amount of actual time you spent setting up this import?


eskimo - Probably not but how revelant is it anyway...
going overseas is as good as a holiday<
one own time is your own...you aint forking out hard earned cash for someone to do what one can do himself,
and can/would it really all add up to what the retailers want anyway?

Pretty much what eskimo said! :2tsup:

2 days of meetings out of a ten day trip was not a great sacrifice - every meal during those two days was at their expense too. I went to China because of the machines and made a small holiday out of it. Visited Hong Kong for some duty free, visited the Industrial Autonation trade show in Shanghai to collect some VSDs and check out some DROs and tooling(imported two DROs and 6 scales from EASSON direct for about AU$800 - the same ones that H&F will sell to you for AU$3454 according to their catalogue), got to meet lots of the locals, travelled on some fast trains(380km/h), climbed the Great Wall in 6" of snow, and walked Tianamen Square in Beijing. Not that much of an imposition is it?

As for my time - it isnt factored in. At the minimum wage(which I am NOT on) it would be about 6 months full time work to equal the savings I made of AU$14000 - apart from the China Trip it wouldnt have taken more than 5 days of my time - after work, surfing the web, looking at catalogues and sending emails. I dont get paid AU$2800 a day, so it saved me money! :2tsup:

Given the number of PMs I have received in relation to this story, it has given lots of people options about where to buy their gear.

I was considering posting up photos of all the gear I purchased, some results after I have tested them - TIR, photos of finished work, etc, and prices for the gear - but only if people are interested. It would take a while - I am off for 2 weeks at the end of April - but I will be getting stuck in to everything when I get back. Lots of cleaning to do to get rid of packing grease, and then take the photos.

Interested or not? Let me know.

[Vernonv]

The notion that Aussie suppliers are ripping us off was brought up in this thread and it was justified by comparing your costs to what the suppliers charge retail. Now that is really not fair, when you don't include ALL of your costs and also don't factor in additional costs the suppliers have, that you don't (overheads, employees, warehousing, warranty costs, etc) and a reasonable profit margin.

It's all fine and good to extol the virtues of buying direct from a manufacturer/supplier overseas (and I do it often myself), but to then use that as ammunition against local retailers without the proper analysis, is in my book, poor form.

[Dave J]

Hi Vernon,
I agree with what your saying above and will add a bit more.

I have had troubles with H&F as every body knows, so there is no need for me to stick up for them but, you say there DRO's are $3454? I have the 3 day special catalog in front of me stating $1089 each for the latest model 3 axis Eassons which is $2178 for 2, and if you were buying as much as you have it would probably be cheaper.
You cannot compare single catalog prices with your group buy, the only fair way would be to have a quote from H&F for the lot, which I am sure would be discounted a lot compared to the catalogs prices. My purchase was when I purchased around $7000 in tools and machinery from them.

Don't get me wrong I think it's great that you have saved a bunch of money by buying bulk from over their, I buy the cheaper tooling overseas myself. But if your naming and running a company down on the internet do a fair comparison, bulk buy to bulk buy or single item to single item.

Dave

[markjaffa]

Vernonv - What would you have me compare it to? The price of tools in the US? Or perhaps the UK? I make no apologies for comparing what I paid for gear from the manufacturer to the other option, which is buying from an Australian retailer. The obvious retailer to compare to is H&F - they are in most states, and have readily available pricing. Everyone understands that a business must charge for their services, overheads, expenses, etc - I am informing people of what they can do, if they have the time and motivation. How could I possibly do a "proper analysis" to compare their costs for "overheads, employees, warehousing, warranty costs, etc) and a reasonable profit margin" to what I paid/spent? And how can stating my experiences and opinion be construed as "ammunition against local retailers"? There are other threads that include complaints about being ripped off by retailers - at least I have provided the numbers for people to make up their own minds, rather than just bagging the retailer.

Dave J - I dont have that catalogue, and I confess to being surprised with the price you list. Would you please confirm that the prices you quote - AU$1089 each for a 3-axis DRO - includes the following scales in that price, and the necessary mounting hardward for the DRO and scales?

1 x Digital Readout for Lathe - 3 axis
1 x RS30-150mm 5um
1 x RS30-250mm 5um
1 x RS10-1300mm 5um

1 x Digital Readout for Mill - 3 axis
1 x RS10-250mm 5um
1 x RS10-500mm 5um
1 x RS10-650mm 5um

Just wanted to confirm you are comparing apples to apples.

I accept your point about bulk buys compared to singles - however I am not going to waste my time to get a quote to list a bulk price - it is conceivable that you could pay the full list price for the DROs and scales if you ordered over the web. Unlikely, but possible.

Since when has listing prices become "running down"? I dont accept that I was running down H&F - when I used the words "ripped off" I did NOT mention H&F, when I did mention H&F I mentioned their list price for comparable items - just stating the facts. If people are linking the two together in this thread, it just goes to show that people should not ass-u-me anything. I actually had another supplier in mind when I typed "ripped off" - and I didnt name them.

[Dave J]

Here is a scan of the brochure. There would be an extra couple of hundred charge for the 1300mm scale, but if you were buying 2 that price would probably come down.
Dave

[markjaffa]

Thank you Dave for scanning that flyer:2tsup:. I am surprised! In regards to my purchase I saved roughly 50% over their pricing. It was still worth it. :wink:

It makes you wonder though - if they normally sell these items for over $3400, and they have dropped them to just over $2300(adding extra for the 1300mm scale) - does anyone believe they are selling them at a loss now?

If they arent - I dont think they would be - it means they could knock over $1100 off the prices and still make a profit. That sort of profit margin is pretty bloody big - I know lots of retailers who would like a 50%+ profit margin on their products!

[Dave J]

It is a big saving buying DRO's from overseas instead of here.The US have come down in price's for them, but we haven't.
That price of the package should be the standard price of the Easson's then discounted off that price at sale times.
I paid around $2100 posted for my 2 Miester 3 axis's and 7 scales 3-4 years ago when the Aussie dollar was down around 67c and these had just become available at a reasonable price.
If I was to do it over again now I would buy 2 Sino's 3 axis for around $565 each posted.
SINO 3-axis digital readout (complete DRO kit) - eBay, Inspection, Measurement, Metalworking, Industrial. (end time 30-Apr-10 00:22:03 AEST) (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/SINO-3-axis-digital-readout-complete-DRO-kit-/220503375808?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3357067fc0)
Dave

[bollie7]

Markjaffa
What sort of difficulties (if any) did you experience with the language/culture differences? Or do you speak one of the chinese languages?

bollie7

[eskimo]

It is a big saving buying DRO's from overseas instead of here.The US have come down in price's for them, but we haven't.
That price of the package should be the standard price of the Easson's then discounted off that price at sale times.
I paid around $2100 posted for my 2 Miester 3 axis's and 7 scales 3-4 years ago when the Aussie dollar was down around 67c and these had just become available at a reasonable price.
If I was to do it over again now I would buy 2 Sino's 3 axis for around $565 each posted.
SINO 3-axis digital readout (complete DRO kit) - eBay, Inspection, Measurement, Metalworking, Industrial. (end time 30-Apr-10 00:22:03 AEST) (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/SINO-3-axis-digital-readout-complete-DRO-kit-/220503375808?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3357067fc0)
Dave
Thats what I got Dave

Re: H&F eason dro's...wonder if they are the current model as when I was looking the same people I got my sino from had the earlier model eason for a lot lot less $$$....( still a little dearer than the sino tho), and it did everything the latest eason did....so I wonder if H&F have been able to get some of the earlier version stuff? as they are cheap

[metester]

I don't think anyone is intending to 'have-a-go' at the local retailers. The reality is that the cost of retailing in Aust compared to the volume of sales forces the prices to be what they are. It is true also, that we miss out on product variety. This is why I include the global market when I go shopping too. Sometimes it pays off handsomely.sometimes not. I think it is good to be aware of the option and then make up your own mind.

[Vernonv]

How could I possibly do a "proper analysis" to compare their costs for "overheads, employees, warehousing, warranty costs, etc) and a reasonable profit margin" to what I paid/spent?You probably can't, which is why statements like this in your original post are inaccurate, baseless and worse meant to be inflammatory
So Import costs DON'T explain why we get ripped off by local suppliers So unless you can substantiate ALL of the suppliers costs and compare them accurately to yours, how can you make such a claim (that we are in fact being ripped off)?

And how can stating my experiences and opinion be construed as "ammunition against local retailers"?Because you used your experiences to try and substantiate the above claim.

Like I said earlier, I often buy from overseas (for many reasons, but primarily price and choice), but I don't assume to know the local suppliers cost structure and hesitate to compare my costs to theirs, because the outcome is bound to be inaccurate.

[markjaffa]

Vernonv - I am glad you definitively know what I was thinking when I wrote my post. Can I borrow your crystal ball? :wink:


inaccurate, baseless and worse meant to be inflammatory
For what possible reason would I want to inflame the situation? What do I get out of it? Apart from you having a go at me? I am basing my comments on my experiences - hardly baseless.

I specified that "Import costs" dont explain the discrepancy between local prices and the manufacturers prices. Import. Freight, Customs, Quarantine, wharf charges, unloading, etc. I meant it as it is written. Of course a retailer has other overheads. Readers of this thread know this. Most of them wouldnt expect that I could even guess at what these overheads are. Completely unreasonable in my book - and inaccurate if I did.


hesitate to compare my costs to theirs, because the outcome is bound to be inaccurate
My other option was to purchase the gear I wanted from Australia. So that is the obvious thing to compare my overseas prices to. Anyone reading this thread can see that the main purpose of my post is to let you know what you can save direct from the manufacturer. Thats it. When you have two options - overseas and local - that is the only comparison that can be made.

If it makes you feel better I retract the comment that we are being "ripped off by local suppliers".

Instead I replace it with - local suppliers seem to have a very, very healthy profit margin, obviously at our expense. I would edit my original post, but I cant.


ADMINISTRATORS
If an administrator would like to edit my original post for me, I would be happy to have the change made. Please remove "So Import costs DON'T explain why we get ripped off by local suppliers", and substitute "IMPORT charges DON'T explain the large discrepancy between the cost from the manufacturer and the retail price in Australia - local suppliers seem to have a very, very healthy profit margin, obviously at our expense".

[Big Shed]

I have added your amended text as requested, and crossed out the original text.

Could we now get back to the original topic of how and why to import direct, I found it very interesting and thank you for taking the trouble to inform us of your experiences.

Just my 2c worth, local suppliers are free to charge whatever they want, we live in a (nominally) free country, they don't need people to spring to their defense

Because we live in this (nominally) free country we are also free to purchase where we want and from whom we want, and I for one exercise that freedom at times, usually at considerable savings to myself.

[Vernonv]

I'm sorry if you feel I was attacking you Mark - that was not my intention. I was merely trying to bring some balance to the discussion and was attacking the notion that we are actually being ripped off.


I am basing my comments on my experiences - hardly baseless.I agree that you are commenting from your own experiences (and that's very informative in it own right:2tsup:), but what is baseless is the comparison (yours or anyone else's) to a suppliers retail cost, when the underlying costs are unknown.

[Vernonv]

Just my 2c worth, local suppliers are free to charge whatever they want, we live in a (nominally) free country, they don't need people to spring to their defense.Does that also apply to attacking them without all the relevant information?

[Dave J]

Big shed,
It all seems to be sorted now, but I was not defending them in any way, I just think it should be a fair comparison, if your going to compare.
Vernon
Looking forward to see the tooling you bought and the prices. I am thinking of a bulk buy from over there for some tooling myself. I read recently that a fellow in the US got CTC tools to send it by boat instead of air and it was a lot cheaper. I think that would be a better way for a large amount, but I would be worried about Paypal as you only have so long to claim if something goes wrong.
Dave

[Big Shed]

Does that also apply to attacking them without all the relevant information?

Vernon, at the risk of continuing the OT posts, you realise of course that you are doing the same thing that you are accusing Mark of, you are defending them without all the relevant information. If you do have all the relevant information, ie how the local suppliers arrive at their retail cost, then I am sure we would all be most interested in you sharing that information with us, just like Mark did.

As for comparing Mark's landed costs with local retail prices, they are of course very relevant (to Mark), after all that is what he would have paid if he hadn't gone the direct import route.

[Vernonv]

Vernon
Looking forward to see the tooling you bought and the prices.I've mostly purchased electronics, hunting accessories and the occasional woodworking tool/accessory from OS (no metalwork tooling as yet as I'm still looking for a metal lathe :rolleyes:).

I research quite heavily before purchasing, so that I know I am getting a comparable product and that the cost savings are significant enough to offset the possible warranty/support difficulties.

[Big Shed]

Big shed,
It all seems to be sorted now, but I was not defending them in any way, I just think it should be a fair comparison, if your going to compare.

Dave

Dave, see my comment above. Marks' comparison is valid (to Mark) as the local retail prices are what he would have paid if he hadn't imported direct. How those local retail prices are arrived at is a separate issue.

As I said before, any company is free to set their prices at whatever level they want (or need), just as we are free to buy at those prices or not.

Personally, I don't wonder how a local company arrives at a retail price for a QCTP of, say, $300. If I can buy the same thing ex the US for less than $100 than that is what I will do. Does the thought that the local company is "ripping me off" come in to my decision making? No, I respect their decision to want to sell at that price, I just won't buy at that price if I can get it at a third of that price elsewhere. Their loss, my gain.

[Vernonv]

Vernon, at the risk of continuing the OT posts, you realise of course that you are doing the same thing that you are accusing Mark of, you are defending them without all the relevant information.Fred, I'm not defending the suppliers, I'm saying that the judgment (that we are being ripped off) can't be made because we don't have all the information. Just because I don't agree with the assertion doesn't mean I automatically believe the opposite, or that the assertion is in fact incorrect ... maybe we are being ripped off ... it's just that we don't have enough information to make that call.

[19brendan81]

Thanks heaps for starting this thread Mark. The savings you can make by importing something yourself seem very significant and I appreciate you pointing out all the hidden charges that cutsoms etc charge to import things.

I recently bought a set of forks and wheels for my motorbike from the US. Cost me $1180 AU to get them to my door, same stuff here was $1960 AU plus freight, so I saved a lot of money (money that I can now spend on a mill!).

Id love to see some updates of your machine in action when you get the time.

Brendan

[Dave J]

I've mostly purchased electronics, hunting accessories and the occasional woodworking tool/accessory from OS (no metalwork tooling as yet as I'm still looking for a metal lathe :rolleyes:).

I research quite heavily before purchasing, so that I know I am getting a comparable product and that the cost savings are significant enough to offset the possible warranty/support difficulties.

Vernon,
I am sorry about that I got mixed up and put the wrong name, that's what I get for reading to many posts at one time.
It should have read
Mark
Looking forward to see the tooling you bought and the prices. I am thinking of a bulk buy from over there for some tooling myself. I read recently that a fellow in the US got CTC tools to send it by boat instead of air and it was a lot cheaper. I think that would be a better way for a large amount, but I would be worried about Paypal as you only have so long to claim if something goes wrong.

Bigshed

Dave, see my comment above. Marks' comparison is valid (to Mark) as the local retail prices are what he would have paid if he hadn't imported direct. How those local retail prices are arrived at is a separate issue.


I agree Marks comparison is valid to Mark, but like I said to him, to be fair if your going to compare prices on a public forum, compare a single item for a single item or a bulk buy to bulk buy. You always get a discount on the list prices for buying bulk.
Dave

[markjaffa]

Thanks to everyone for the interest in this thread. I hope there are no hard feelings anywhere - I certainly have none. I am glad to get back to the main topic - the cost of importing machinery/tools direct from a manufacturer in China.

I am happy to document the gear I purchased. It will be a few weeks before I can do so(on holidays in 4 days). I imagine that I should post the photos on this thread? Or would it be better to start a new one? Looking for some advice on this, please.

[Dave J]

I think you should post it here, that way anybody reading it in the future will see the Q"s & A's already asked and wont ask them again.
Dave

[Sterob]

Well done on getting all your gear at a huge cost saving. I am jealous....lol
Sterob

[Pete F]

Mark, good job mate, I am VERY keen to see precisely what you picked up there and as much information as you can provide in terms of the logistics of getting from Hong Kong to the manufacturer etc. Again thanks for posting this information.

[.RC.]

If you are going to do any buying from overseas the AU$ is dropping fast...

I bought some stuff of CTC tools this morning and Pay Pal exchange rate was $0.82.

[eskimo]

If you are going to do any buying from overseas the AU$ is dropping fast...

I bought some stuff of CTC tools this morning and Pay Pal exchange rate was $0.82.

rudd...y hell ...its dropping quick....did rudd say anything about a Banana Republic yesterday....:))))

[19brendan81]

Im to blame for this. Everytime I look at importing something substantial from overseas, the ##### falls out of the aussie peso.

[eskimo]

Im to blame for this. Everytime I look at importing something substantial from overseas, the ##### falls out of the aussie peso.

i agree..its all your fault

[.RC.]

Wow down to $0.83 now.....Paying for overseas items through Pay Pal would put it at $0.80 or less...

[markjaffa]

I would like to apologise to anyone waiting to see the photos I have FINALLY got around to doing today. Life gets in the way sometimes - as do holidays, rush jobs, important projects, and other stuff. :wink:

Anyhow, I have taken photos of the main stuff as I see it. Notable omissions are the 2 3-axis DRO and the 6 scales I purchased to install on my machines, the two 2.2kW VFDs, the 14" timber bandsaw, and a reasonable number of smaller parts. And my mill of course! :) That is in the "Show us your mill thread"

The images titles pretty well describe what you will see in the photo. Feel free to ask questions - most I should be able to answer off the top of my head, but not all. These will take a little longer to answer.

[.RC.]

Nice, and the stuff looks of a higher quality then the usual chinese stuff we see...

[Big Shed]

Great selection of tooling there, some of it looks very familiar, could have come straight out of the CDCO catalogue:D

[19brendan81]

What a haul....it would have been like all your christmas's came at once opening that up! Your ER collets seem to be the same ones that I have.

[eskimo]

Mark
Its just too much for one man!

Interestingly I was looking at their (Cater) catalogue this morning, and noted the precision modular Vices are identical to these at Vertex milling,grinding,tooling,cnc,lathe machinie cat.:: (http://www.vertex-tw.com.tw/products/products_list.php?language=_eng&cid=36) ....

wonder if either or make them....H & F call them Toolmaster I think or was that General Tools here in Adelaide (H & F Agent)....

Makes you wonder who actually makes what

[Dave J]

You have some good useful tooling there Mark, thanks for posting them up.
As you probably already found out, it wont stop there and it seems to become an addiction.lol

Dave

[.RC.]

Interestingly I was looking at their (Cater) catalogue this morning,

Lots of stuff in that catalogue...

[DoctorWu]

Used Machinery.bz (http://usedmachinery.bz/scripts/NK/vb_bridge3.dll?VBPROG=ShowPics&PG=showpics.xsl&IF=PIC&YM=201006&ID=00017349061820_YMACK)

While we're talking importing, how about used machines? For some time now I've desired a Japanese lathe.

[markjaffa]

When I imported my gear, the supplier had to certify, via documentation, that the machines had not been used before, in any setting. I think this would have only affected Quarantine procedures - there definitely would have been an inspection, and probably charges to clean the machine to their satisfaction. Other than that, import tax might be calculated differently too - possibly the machine would be viewed differently because it is used. You can apply to Customs to give you a binding determination on these sorts of issues before you go any further. Takes a while though.

[DoctorWu]

Yes, all of that to consider. I would also have to do a careful inspection prior to purchasing and this is probably even more important with the used gear. It'll be interesting though to see what the prices are like on these machines.

[.RC.]

Customs are more concerned about dirt and vegetation on imported machines then oil and grease..

[19brendan81]

Yeah I agree RC. Greasy old cars are imported into the country every day...I cant see grease on an old lathe being of concern to customs. It would be a double standard really.

[markjaffa]

Customs couldnt care less - its Quarantine you have to worry about! :wink: But I think .RC. is right - dirt and vegetation would be more of an issue - bacteria and bugs could be brought in by that sort of contamination. But Government bureaucracies dont always make sense do they? :? It would be worth a phone call to Quarantine to check the issues before purchasing a machine and then getting hit with a cleaning bill - especially at the rates they charge!

[.RC.]

I should ask the AQIS inspectors when I see them... I might see some tonight but I never get a chance to speak to them...

[Dave J]

Here is a link with info on importing cleaning etc, that might help.
Importing Machinery into Australia - DAFF (http://www.daff.gov.au/aqis/import/vehicles-machinery/regulations)

Dave

[19brendan81]

From the looks of this link they are obviously mainly concerned with earth moving equipment, and fair enough too...the dirt they could hold would easily harbour seeds etc that could run amok here.

However I still reckon that if you got pinged for a greasy lathe , you would have to be very unlucky.

[Dave J]

Hi Brendan,
Yes I don't think they would bother with grease or oil. On lathes and mills I think it would be more concern for spiders etc and would need fumigating if they found cobwebs or eggs etc.

Dave

[DoctorWu]

I can appreciate why some used equipment could be a problem but what's to stop insect livestock hopping aboard the new stuff.

[Dave J]

Or the container they come in, thats been sitting on the ground for loading.

There is a TV show called boarder security NZ, I think its called.
There was one episode were someone found a lizard on some new mesh in a container, they brought in the works, customs pest control etc. Fumigated the container come back in 24 hours to find the lizard 125mm long dead.
I have seen them go through the V8 super cars as well, picking on the grass under the car, truck mud guards etc. All customer charged of course, I wounder if their on a quoter like the police to cover wages.
I presume Aus is the same.

Dave