Jarrah T&G flooring as kitchen benchtop

[Wildman]

Is this a good or bad idea?

We have decided that we would like a deep red timber benchtop in the kitchen and would like it to last a long time. The plan is to laminate solid 19mm Jarrah tongue and groove floorboards to some 16mm form ply then route a nice small radius curve into the front edge. Are there any issues with using floorboards as a benchtop? The tongue and grooves would be fully glued with something like Weldbond or some other high quality glue then sanded flat and sealed with a single pack polyurethane. I can then make the benches in any size or shape that I want and it is cheaper than the equivalent laminex benchtop (in 700mm wide anyway) and can be sanded and sealed again in the future.

Cheers
Wildman

[vsquizz]

Wildman, My first concern would be to use really well seasoned Jarrah, 20 years would be a good starting point but you don't want it like dry as chips. Some moisture will get into the timber and it will move a little. Try and get a meter onto it. Is it recycled T&G?. Don't know about the poly finish but Wellbond or Titebond are good glue choices just so long as the type you use has good moisture resistance.

Sounds like a great project. Some will be very skeptical about your plan but it can be done.

Cheers

[seriph1]

depends on what "look" you are trying to achieve - the edge will only be 19mm thick or will expose the plywood, unless you edge it with more Jarrah...... then you have an added join in the project, which can allow ingress of moisture.

I feel it might be better to rip the boards down to 40-50mm or so and remove the tongues and grooves - then butt glue them - reason being: flooring used as benches always looks like flooring used as benches - if you’re happy with that and the image in your mind is that, then great - but "made" bench tops are not like this. Also, flooring isn’t designed to be glued along the T+G’s - it is a very loose fit, so the glue surface will be minimal….. not so important when supported well underneath, though still a factor to be taken into account.

Also, if the bench is going to have direct sunlight on it through the day, being Jarrah it will fade substantially and rapidly…..adding a outdoor UV stain/lacquer at the outset can be a help, but I have personal experience with jarrah fading in a day from deep red to brown and to honey in a week.

Hope these ravings are of some help …… am as vague as all get-out today due to the mother of all colds

Cheers

[nt900]

Wildman, I am about to do the same, using old (may be up to 100 years old) recycled and re-milled jarrah T&G flooring. I plan to edge it to get a thicker look. 19mm is a bit insubstantial appearing edge, but about 40mm looks better and gives the impression the whole thing is 40mm thick. I am not planning on laminating it to ply, but screwing it down to the melamine carcasses.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>

If you are interested I got my flooring from Shiver Me Timbers in Williamstown.<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

I am going to finish my bench top in Tung Oil. I prefer to be able to sand and finish smaller sections if required, than sand off an entire surface of polyurethane. Just my preference.<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

Anthony

[nt900]

Wildman,

I am about to do the same, using old (may be up to 100 years old) recycled and re-milled jarrah T&G flooring. I plan to edge it to get a thicker look. 19mm is a bit insubstantial appearing edge, but about 40mm looks better and gives the impression the whole thing is 40mm thick. I am not planning on laminating it to ply, but screwing it down to the melamine carcasses.<O:p</O:p

If you are interested I got my flooring from Shiver Me Timbers in Williamstown.<O:p</O:p

I am going to finish my bench top in Tung Oil. I prefer to be able to sand and finish smaller sections if required, than sand off an entire surface of polyurethane. Just my preference.

<O:p</O:pAnthony

[arms]

ITS A NO NO .the board needs room to move and the screw down points should be within a 12 mm hole and the screws should be fitted with washers to allow for movement

[bitingmidge]

OK Arms is correct of course, but that won't stop us having a go eh fellas?? ;)

I am considering doing a similar thing for one of my daughters, but my version goes like this:

Existing benches are old lime green 450 wide and the cupboards a bit low, but in good condition. The sink is an old-style raised about 8mm above the surface of the bench, and no bench where the sink is (if that makes sense). Rather than replace the top, I'm going to use timber with and edge strip that covers the face of the existing bench.

I will mill whatever timber we end up with (probably Tas Oak) to about 10-12 mm thick, with a 35mm edge strip approximately 40 mm deep.

Bench top will be glued with epoxy, and sealed all over with epoxy before fixing. The epoxy encapsulation will prevent movement due to moisture, and will also give substantial UV protection (with inhibitors in the hardener). I'll glue it down with epoxy bog, and it won't move and water won't be a problem.

I haven't decided on the final finish, but am playing with Danish Oil over epoxy at the moment. Most of my boats have normal spa varnish over epoxy, and that works fine, and a previous kitchen top has had Danish Oil (many coats, steel wool, more coats each year). Although it seems like a nonsense, the oil may just polymerise to take a way the plastic look of the epoxy. If not I'll use a satin polyurethene, or even a flat, waterbased one.

Epoxy isn't particularly poisonous after it's gone off, so will be food safe. (I've also used it often in the past for lining water tanks in boats.)

If all that doesn't work, I'll just start again I guess, and tell you lot!!

(Just so you can keep me to my word. It's supposed to happen over Christmas - New Year ... maybe I'll get this one finished!)

Cheers,

P

:D

[Wildman]

I was planning on having a second piece along the front to give the impression of 40mm thick, but the cost of having jarrah substrate as well kind of negates the cost benefit of the project.

I will definitely look at UV protection for the surface, the kitchen is north facing with a lot of glass.

I am definitely still open to suggestions regarding the surface coat and glue. Would a thicker epoxy mixture fill the T&G voids better? I was considering a butt joint that was biscuited or dowelled but thought that a T&G should be a stronger joint when glued and less likely to crack which I am hoping to avoid.

Shiver me timbers sounds like I should definitely check them out, I was planning on using some flooring that is new/never used that I know has been stored inside for about 10-12 years but might not be able to get enough of it, especially if my old man decides that he doesn't want to give it to me! I have been trying to get some Oregon beams from him for ages, old 14"x8"x12' but he didnt want them ripped down so he left them so long they rotted due to poor storage. Hopefully his extremely substantial collection of Redgum, yellow box and iron bark bridge timbers holds up for a bit longer, I have got plans for them too. They are outside in the weather though. At least his slabs of oak are inside and properly stacked. I have a dining table planned for them.

Point noted about movement in relation to carcasses, the 12mm hole with a washer would not be difficult and if it saves work long term then I will definitely do it.

Cheers
Wildman

[bitingmidge]

Epoxy will fill the t&g OK, but you'll have an awful mess when you do it, and you'll have to be very diligent with cleaning up the timber later, The last thing you want to have grain filled with epoxy bog!

Can be done, needs patience and care. Don't forget to wear gloves, disposable overalls, and don't breath the stuff. (No one said working with epoxy was pleasant! :D).

The purpose of encapsulating the timber is to prevent movement, but making allowance for it won't hurt.

Cheers,

P

[seriph1]

FWIW (for what it's worth) 12 yrs ago I used some new 250X35 Oregon beams to make kitchen bench tops..... stained them using Cabot's dark oak and aged them with a range of tools ..... then used a cheap satin flooring grade polyurethane and applied 4 coats.....after 12 yrs it is all still in good though worn condition.... will post a pic if I can find one

[bitingmidge]

Steve,

Would love to see the pics. I have all this oregon you see.... although I will probably have to rip it to get a quarter-sawn effect.

More info needed!!

Cheers,

P :D

[seriph1]

as promised ..... apologies for the bad pics - bad lighting conditions and an average photographer (me)

[seriph1]

Looking back I would’ve done things differently, but then most of us can say that - I basically knew nothing when I built this kitchen, though it served us well over the years until we sold the place .... and it is still in service as you see it ..... BTW I made the taps from bits n pieces, as I had always loved the ones I would see in the English magazines, but baulked at the $750 for a set (1991 price) ended up making two sets which still cost $400 inc. professional mods and gold plating, but felt it was worth it...... have learned much about design, patination, fittings, materials and finishing etc and am looking forward to building our new kitchen…… am still wondering if I will put the second set of taps into it…..

Finally, this entire kitchen cost under $4000 including $2200 for the stove.

[nt900]

Arms and co.,

The expansion issue was sort of bugging me. I was planning on fixing the front board to the carcasses, and screw in slot fixing the middle and back boards to the carcasses to deal with expansion. The question I have though is: where I will have a corner with the long edge of the board and short ends of the other top joining together, what should I do about expansion of the short ends against the long board? Should I glue them together or not?

Also, I was thinking of running the edging around one side as well, your thoughts on how this would interfere with expansion and contraction across the boards?

I was planning on using Titebond III for the glue. Not that I have used it before on any projects, but it should apply as easy as PVA but provide a strong waterproof joint.

Speaking of kitchen costs, I was planning to spend about $1200 on the kitchen, melamine, timber, sink and tap, hinges and handles: Currently I have spent $770 timber, $210 tap and sink, about $350 in melamine. That’s $1330, including hinges and handles I am yet to buy should take me to about $1500.

[ozwinner]

Most of my boats have normal spa varnish over epoxy, and that works fine,
Cheers,

P

:D
Most of my boats!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Most of my boats!!, are you some sort of tycoon???

Al, the pauper :(

[bitingmidge]

Most of my boats!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Most of my boats!!, are you some sort of tycoon???

Al, the pauper :(

Yep!

:cool: :cool: :cool:


P

[Rodgera]

Is this a good or bad idea?

Cheers
Wildman
Hi, eight years ago I made my kitchen benchtops from Messmate T&G flooring boards applied to a base of 19mm flooring sheets.
The finished product was fabulous and still looks great today.
We had some work done in the TV room by a chippy who was in awe of the work I had done.
Give it a go, it is well worth the effort.

Regards,

Rodger

[tong]

I did a kitchen last year on the gold coast... benchtops needed replacing...
After picking myself up from floor after getting quotes from kitchen place for laminated tops, I used Indo Brace Ply, about 6mm, $16 for an 8x4 sheet. This is hardwood faced. Gave it 4 coats of gloss estapol, each side, sealed edges, glued down to roughened laminex existing tops with liquid nails and fitted tas oak mouldings ... looks great... seems to be lasting fine. Being ply, there is no probs with expansion or contraction...
So successful I am planning to do it here in the "new" place, but this time I may use several coats of bond crete as sealer before the estapol, but open to suggestions

[ljb]

TONG - YOU SAID " I used Indo Brace Ply, about 6mm, $16 for an 8x4 sheet. This is hardwood faced"
Where do you buy this ply as I have never heard of it.
I am in the same position of wanting to glue somekind of wood over my old laminex benches and this sounds ideal.

[seriph1]

LJB - I think it is Indonesian bracing ply - available from most hardware stores and has meranti facing.

[Rocker]

Al,

Didn't you know? Bitingmidge is part of the Sunshine Coast's white-shoe brigade :)

Rocker

[Dan_574]

My dad did exactly that with left over flooring Karri. Made a benchtop, and out of jarrah a vanity. Both look fantastic. If I knew how to add photos I would show you. Both species are Boral natural grade. No problems yet.

[seriph1]

hi Dan - when you hit the "REPLY" button, scroll down below where you typoe and you will see a thing that says "MANAGE ATTACHMENTS" - click this and upload the images - they will not be accepted unless they are the correct filetype like .jpg, .bmp, gif etc. and less than 100K in total per post .....but get those two bits right and away you go -just like I did here

:D

[nt900]

Wildman,

How did your Jarrah floorboard kitchen bench top go?

I am about to glue mine up soon.

[conwood]

Hi Wildman,
Recently made bench top from very old jarah. Wasn't T&G. We used biscuits and epoxy glue with fanatastic results.

Used a penetrating oil as we didn't want to have to scape a layer of in the future. Can't remember the product used, but now have reverted to cooking oils on regualr basis.

If you want more info I can get for you. Just contact me.

Reagrds,
Conwood