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John Saxton
7th August 2000, 09:06 PM
Would there be out there amongst the worldwide woodturning folk a penchant for using a carving approach to their product?
I have seen some good work with bowls but was wondering whether there was a similar consideration in thought out there given to spindle turned product,and if so have these folk had the need to accomplish this thru a carving course.I have access to a mechanical means of router carving but it is with a defined pattern in application whereas I was thinking in terms of a small intricate profiles done by hand!
Cheers http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/smile.gif

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Johnno

[This message has been edited by John Saxton (edited 07 August 2000).]

RETIRED
8th August 2000, 12:09 AM
Gooday.

At the risk of offending some of the bowl turning fraternity, there is and should be more thought applied to spindle turning than bowls.

Spindles have to have a balance of design that the eye flows along and make the beholder want to run their fingers along to feel that balance. The "crispness" of a well turned spindle (hand turned) against a machine (auto) is easily discernable. You have to have the technique (ie cutting) right because sandpaper will destroy the crisp lines.

Granted, a bowl can have the same qualities but it is a "2 dimensional" feeling. You theoretically could sand a bowl without putting a chisel near it to achieve the same shape. This is evidenced (new word?) by a lot of carvers and some turners making bowls with an Arbortech.

You would be hard pushed to sand a spindle with crisp edges from a square blank.

Now to answer your question about carving as a pre-requisite to spindle turning. Most spindle turners that I know have very little interest in carving. Turning is the impatient mans hobby because it is fixed or stuffed in a nano second.

For design purposes you can't beat the classic shapes that are evident in staircases and verandah posts every where.


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Ian () Robertson
"We do good turns every day"

PS sorry for sounding like an artist. http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/wink.gif



[This message has been edited by (edited 07 August 2000).]

John Saxton
8th August 2000, 08:52 PM
I appreciate where you are coming from and there is no need for any artist to apologise.
I raised the question because I have to date not seen any application of the carving medium in spindle turning and thought that there might be someone who has done so.There are a lot of folk out there both in a professional or amateur capacity who may be looking for a fresh approach in their work as indeed I am, always in search of the need to experiment in my work and to look for new challenges.The consideration of employing the act of carving to spindle turning may give any given work a "NEW" feel if you will.
Perhaps starting with a few scallops around the plinthe of a pedestal!!
Cheers http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/wink.gif

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Johnno

ubeaut
8th August 2000, 09:13 PM
John

I don't know if it's or me that's got the wrong end of the stick here, but.

Carving on spindle turnings is as old as turning itself. Down through the centuries there has been as much carved spindle work as there has plain. It is only in the later part of the 20th century that carving gave way to clean lines and let the turning show through.

This of course is the opinion of a carver. The true turner will probably argue that at last the useless embellishments have gone from the true masterpiece (the turning). http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/tongue.gif

Look around you there are carvings everywhere. The best starting place is an antique furniture shop.

The graphic below should give you an idea of what I am talking about. They are small sections from 3 candle sticks.

I hope one of these posts makes sense to you John.

Cheers - Neil http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/wink.gif
http://www.ubeaut.com.au/cand.jpg

[This message has been edited by ubeaut (edited 08 August 2000).]

ubeaut
8th August 2000, 09:24 PM
You beat me to the post I started at around 7pm but had to find some graphics to illustrate. Ah well it's done now'

Are you calling an "Artist".

If so you are correct he is an artist...... BULL!! http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/wink.gif

RETIRED
9th August 2000, 12:19 AM
Gooday.

Neil, I agree that carving was added AFTER the piece was turned. The piece was not carved round first which is the way I interpret Johns posting.

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Ian () Robertson
"We do good turns every day"

John Saxton
10th August 2000, 01:00 AM
Thanks Neil,,yeah I was aware that carving had been used all that time ago,it was just that with depth of woodturning in Oz and all about I was wondering whether there was anything happening in the form of a renaissance along the lines of rejuvenating an older style of profile within this medium.Apparently there can't be much call for it otherwise it would be more overt in the community.I am considering at length approaching this aspect in my woodturning,as per my enquiries to test the waters so to speak!!We shall see what we shall see.
Cheers http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/smile.gif


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Johnno

ubeaut
12th August 2000, 09:01 AM
Johnno

Rather than carving the turned work maybe the application of colour or decorative finishes might be another more practicle way to go in this time of brightly coloured furniture and decorating ideas.

Have a look at TALC on the U-Beaut Polishes (http://www.ubeaut.com.au/ubhome.htm) page and also Water Dyes. Our book "A Polishers Handbook" also on the site contains lots of decorative finishing ideas.

You will find that carving will not help to sell turned work at the moment. It seems to be associated too much with Copper Art and other cheap import type furniture etc. and you will never recoupe the money for the time you have to put in on the carving.

e.g. A basic carving on a pedestal will take maybe 1 hour to do (probably 4-5 hrs for a novice and it will look like a novices work). It may take another hour to sand ready for finishing. At a minimum of $15 per hour an expeienced carver will have just added $30 to the finished item, A novice would add $75 at least. You can probably buy a carved, french polished, mahogany, import for around $40.

By the way if you are working for yourself at $15 per hour either give it away or come work for me. http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/eek.gif A good carver should be making well in excess of $40 per hour for top quality work. A good turner should be making at least that much per hour when he/she is working. http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/biggrin.gif

Hope this helps a little.

Cheers - Neil http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/smile.gif

John Saxton
13th August 2000, 02:32 PM
Yeah Thanks Neil, for those insiights and especially coming from a carvers perspective.
It is still with some interest that I think both mediums could be united if there a market or a call for it.
The one concern fo course would be the cost effectiveness in terms of labour for the product produced.
I will have some time available shortly so anticipate spending some of that time getting a handle on some carving experience(subject to the schools course access here).
Cheers

ubeaut
13th August 2000, 04:29 PM
Johnno

If it is of any help to you I will be in Perth next weekend for the woodworking show at Claremont Show Grounds. I will be on Timbecon's stand and won't be hard to find. I will be the eldest of the 3 handsom ones in the black U-Beaut Polishes shirts.

I will bring some decorative finished bits with me. (if I remember) http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/confused.gif

Cheere -Neil http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/smile.gif

John Saxton
15th August 2000, 09:15 PM
Righto Neil,now if I can just get her http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/wink.gif indoors to let loose the shackles and chains and part with a quid I'll get the opportunity to av a chat!
Cheers

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Johnno

John Saxton
18th August 2000, 11:33 PM
Neil,you were correct in one point in that you were the eldest of the three.Handsome! http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/tongue.gif no offence,I reserve my view.Helpful yes, along with my thanks in pointing me back to the MIK INTERNATIONAL stand where I had a long chat with the guy's there.Somehow those lads of yours have a knack for extracting my hard earned without any effort!! It is just as well that I managed to tot up the cost of your polishe's otherwise I would have been broke and you would have been having a night on the town in Perth at my expense http://ubb.ubeaut.com.au/ubb/rolleyes.gif
I mean if you want a beer or two no probs....I just can't extend the goodwill to the top shelf yet!
Cheers and I hope the show was good for you.

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Johnno