opps impulsive buy

[azzrock]

looks like i just bought a lathe.
It was a very impulsive decision.
Really i think i should be a little dark on my self
for this one,
bought at auction unseen,untested.
when it comes down to it not even shore how to get
it home.
On the bright side what a beauty. hope its in ok nic.

not even real shore on the lathes details except of course its a Colchester
with 40mm bore top speed 1200 rpm and its green. here is a photo slightly edited

182199



.

[Stustoys]

Hi azzrock,
I'm all for impulse buying, Mine just aren't quite so large normally:rolleyes:. Still nice pick up assuming you can get it home. Does it have to move far? Might be a crane truck job.

Stuart

[azzrock]

hi stuart well not to far maybe 50km.
from Moorabbin to Laverton.
crane truck hay maybe a great idea. i work with cranes every day but
don't know any body with a crane truck.
im shore it will be right

[Stustoys]

The guy I used for my mill and shaper charges $95 an hour, minium 3 hours. Its depot to depot so it's good if you can find someone close to either end or along the route so you have minium extra travel time. He isn't to far from Moorabbin from memory. I can dig out his number if you like. You'd want to try and time it to get a good run in the traffic as well. Is it a "one day for collection" deal?
Stuart

[morrisman]

If you lift it with a chain block, it will test the roof truss in your shed LOL . I cannot imagine the Super crap auto engine hoist coping with that either :oo:

A guy just Nth. of me, offered me an old USA SEBASTIAN lathe , about the same size. Geared head and all . But what a beast to move

Good Luck

Mike

[Greg Q]

Looks like a Colchester Student or Master Mk 1 1/2. (I can't tell the size from the photo. There's a great chunk of information on these here:


Page Title (http://www.lathes.co.uk/colchester/page2.html)

Greg

[azzrock]

Greg thanks i was thinking it may of been a student. this wasn't based on any thing except a guess.
from what i can tell know its a Colchester Student & Master. maybe 13 inch.
the description says 750mm between centres, 320 Swing over bed, 440mm swing in gap, 40mm spindle bore, 54 R.P.M. to 1200 R.P.M. speed range, 190mm Dia. 3 jaw chuck, includes faceplate

[Dave J]

Looks like a good solid lathe,:2tsup:

Dave

[Bryan]

Impulse is how I bought my Graziano. Makes life interesting, taking a punt. I think I mostly got away with it. Hope yours is a good 'un. Don't know anything about Colchesters, except they seem to be regarded with respect. Let us know how you go.

[RayG]

....not even real shore on the lathes details except of course its a Colchester
with 40mm bore top speed 1200 rpm and its green. here is a photo slightly edited

.


Dont' worry about impulse buying, I think we've all done it, sometimes it works, sometimes not, you wouldn't want life to be too boring and predictable would you :rolleyes:.. well that's my excuse, you are welcome to borrow it if you need it. :)

Just on looks, I'd say you've done pretty well, I look forward to seeing how it all turns out.

Regards
Ray

[Greg Q]

I think that I have regretted more the ones that got away because I wasted time agonising over what was an obviously great deal. On the other hand it helps to do as much research as you can first so you can jump when jumping is called for-- not that you made a misstep here I reckon.

[azzrock]

thanks all.For the encouragement.i downloaded a manual last night and if i have the modal right the weight of the machine is around 700kg.. The price was good. Know i have to decide whether to keep my hurcus or not. Get it home and running on 240v find a 4 jaw chuck or at lease a backing plate.ectect

[azzrock]

there is a yellow sign or marking on the rear part of the bed. im hoping it mentions hardened ways.
any way friday is the day it will all become clearer

[Greg Q]

I just saw what you paid for that machine...that qualifies as a smoking deal, azzrock. Good on ya.

GQ

[Swarfmaker1]

I think you could manage that with a box trailer and an engine hoist (2 tonner). I did the Nuttall Herbert that way which is bigger than the Colchester. Strap it down real good and go slow. 50km isn't too far.


hi stuart well not to far maybe 50km.
from Moorabbin to Laverton.
crane truck hay maybe a great idea. i work with cranes every day but
don't know any body with a crane truck.
im shore it will be right

[wbleeker]

Hi Azzrock
Good buy, yes that sign says Hardened Bedways, at the right hand end of the bed the little draw swings out it may have a few bits and pieces in it. I last used one in 1977 and it was a great machine.
Will

[Col n Julia]

Azzrock

Looks just like a Colchester Student I used to own if it is, it weighs about 600 kg. There should be a tapped hole about 7/8" dia just in fron of the chuck in the bed and when I had mine there was a metal ring welded to a bolt that screwed into this hole and was the lifting point. Balanced using the saddle and tailstock to level it when suspended from this ring.

I used an engine crane to move it around my garage.

They are a brilliant machine, have fun with it.

Cheers

Col

[azzrock]

hi again
gq i think it was a good deal but wasn't sure. That's what really sold it for me the price. i was just having a look at a few other items. Really Ive been in the market for a mill and then bigger lathe.

thanks swarfmaker for the tip. did u buy the nuttle at auction as well.
do you have any colchester castings?

hi wbleeker that's great news. i used a few colchesters about 2o years ago.
i liked them then.

col and julia thanks for the tip and positive feed back on the lathe. i have a few lifting eyes hopefully they will fit. did you say there was only 1 lifting point.


Azzrock

Looks just like a Colchester Student I used to own if it is, it weighs about 600 kg. There should be a tapped hole about 7/8" dia just in fron of the chuck in the bed and when I had mine there was a metal ring welded to a bolt that screwed into this hole and was the lifting point. Balanced using the saddle and tailstock to level it when suspended from this ring.

I used an engine crane to move it around my garage.

They are a brilliant machine, have fun with it.

Cheers

Col

[Col n Julia]

Yes mine just had the one, The eye was contained in the little winging drawer under the tailstock end. From memory was about 75mm dia and solidly welded to a thread that fitted the hole I described. Used it twice, picked up the whole thing with no dramas.

Enjoy your new machine..

Cheers

Col

[Swarfmaker1]

Aaron, Only too happy to help. I bought the Nuttall locally, advertised here actually. The seller didn't have the room to keep it and I had plenty of room in the garage for it right next to a three phase outlet. I grabbed it as it had the capacity to turn the Bolton No 12 Flywheel casting (14" dia) after I made a 14" faceplate for it of course. I've had to make a few other parts for the lathe such as a new tailstock handwheel casting and the hi and low range gear box lever. A new top slide is coming as soon as I can get it on the mill. I have a QCTP to go on the Nuttall and decided to make a new topslide as I can't bring myself to butcher the orignal one designed for the 4 way post. It really is an amazing machine, tapered gibs on the slides. The spindle is still in good nick for a 70 YO lathe. I'm now toying with the idea of a bed regrind.

I don't have any colchester casting but what do you need?




thanks swarfmaker for the tip. did u buy the nuttle at auction as well.
do you have any colchester castings?

hi wbleeker that's great news. i used a few colchesters about 2o years ago.
i liked them then.

[azzrock]

i got the machine home. its a Colchester master. Im pretty happy with the new
lathe it all seems in good order. quick change gear box has both metric and English
threads. now i just have to fit a single phase motor and decide where to put it.

182497182498
the bloke in the photo is my best mate. he was a big help
i have given the lathe a quick clean but there is a lot of scrubbing to go.

182499182500

[azzrock]

Aaron, Only too happy to help. I bought the Nuttall locally, advertised here actually. The seller didn't have the room to keep it and I had plenty of room in the garage for it right next to a three phase outlet. I grabbed it as it had the capacity to turn the Bolton No 12 Flywheel casting (14" dia) after I made a 14" faceplate for it of course. I've had to make a few other parts for the lathe such as a new tailstock handwheel casting and the hi and low range gear box lever. A new top slide is coming as soon as I can get it on the mill. I have a QCTP to go on the Nuttall and decided to make a new topslide as I can't bring myself to butcher the orignal one designed for the 4 way post. It really is an amazing machine, tapered gibs on the slides. The spindle is still in good nick for a 70 YO lathe. I'm now toying with the idea of a bed regrind.

I don't have any colchester casting but what do you need?

hi again swarfmaker you said you made a face plate. just wondering how you cut the tapered key way? I will have to either make or buy a chuck baking plate. As there is no 4 jaw chuck.

[Bryan]

Looks great. I know cleaning is tedious, but it's also exciting, seeing what emerges from the grime, making little discoveries as you go. Have fun.

[Big Shed]

Nice looking machine, what hp is the existing 3phase motor?

[azzrock]

Hi Fred how are you. Im not shore for some reason i think 2hp.
ill check tomorrow .

[Big Shed]

Have you thought about keeping the 3ph motor and hooking it up to a VFD?

Plenty of good advice regarding this on the forum:2tsup:

[azzrock]

i have thought about it. i wasn't shore how that worked. can i just buy a vsd program the parameters of the motor and plug it in? You have Vsd on your machines do you loose much torque?

[Stustoys]

Hi azzrock,
Now if thats not a trailer it will do until we get one!
Looks great, taper turning and all.

As for VSDs, it depends whats there already as to how easy it is to do. But it would likely be as easy converting it to 240V.

Stuart

[azzrock]

hi Stuart not a bad trailer hay its not mine . i rent it for $50 a day.
im not shore if the taper turning attachment is all there.
ive never used one.

[Dave J]

Good to see it's home safe and congratulations.:2tsup::2tsup::2tsup:
The only part that looks to be missing off the taper attachment is the part that bolts to the bed (dead man arm)
You can look up the Grizzly manuals to give you a better idea, but it wont be hard to make one up.

Dave

[Dave J]

To save you some time so you can play with your new toy, oops I mean tool, here is the link to one of them to have a look at.
http://cdn0.grizzly.com/manuals/h7937_m.pdf

Dave

[Stustoys]

$50 a day, thats half what I was quoted when I was looking at moving mills about. Makes more sense to do it yourself at that price.
Thats a very solid looking tapper turner. I dont recall seeing one that is tied back to the carraige like that(maybe they all are?).

Stuart

[azzrock]

thanks Dave. saving time is great you know with work play, misses and sleep it hard to fit research in.

hi Stuart its a very solid machine in general. i think built in the 60's. i have to get back to more cleaning

[Ray39]

Hi
Looks like you have a Colchester Student Late 50's 60"s vintage
Very good machine as I operated one when new both at school and work. Hope you have a full complement of chucks etc. as they have a rather unique mounting where the spindle nose fits right into the chuck, very safe as they were aimed at tafe schools in the UK. They also have a strange starting lever, move too quick and it wont start, there is a reason however I have forgotten.
Have Fun
Ray

[Greg Q]

Azzrock I'll chime in here too with getting a VFD to power the existing thre phase motor. That's assuming that it has a 240v/440v data plate on the motor

If it does not, you might be able to bring out the winding or have a re-winder do it so that you can use it on a 240v VFD.

You won't lose any torque even with a simple VFD if you just want to use it for phase converting from single to three phase. If you want to use it for speed control too (and who doesn't?) you need to either confine yourself to maybe 25 Hz minimum speed or buy a better "sensorless vector*" VFD which provides constant torque right down to silly slow speeds.

*whatever the hell that means

Greg

[azzrock]

Hi Greg is there a vfd you could recommend? As is the lowest speed is i think 54rpm.
that seems slow enough. I don't understand except for the "speed control" why people prefer
the vfd to a cap start cap run 240v motor.
Thanks ray from what i can tell is a 1962 modal. there is no 4 jaw unfortunately. I think ive
found one on ebay for about $160 with backing plate.

[Greg Q]

I'd look around if I were you. There is a Chinese brand that sells for less than $200 for 3 h.p..(Starts with "H", but I'll be buggered if I can recall the full name. Huyangchung? Otherwise, buy new from the states. Teco (which is Westinghouse) is a popular brand, as is AC Tech. Marshall Wolfe Automation seems good to deal with-I've bought there before.

Also...the old wisdom was that you had to buy a unit 50% bigger tha your motor to use single phase input. That is no longer true universally- modern specs will show load current maximums which is what you want to know. No sense in buying a bigger unit than you really need-not as I see it anyway)

Greg

[Stustoys]

Hi azzrock,

I don't understand except for the "speed control" why people prefer
the vfd to a cap start cap run 240v motor.

Well there is laziness for one ;) I have a VSD on my mill but mostly change speeds to get close, but sometimes I'm just wind it back to 25Hz(drilling holes mostly when using a center or spot drill first)
You can also change speeds without stopping. Handy if you are turning and drilling a hole.
Its also said 3 phase runs smoother than single phase so doesn't leave patterns on the work piece(one of these days I plan to put a 3 phase motor on my lathe, I'll have to report back on that one).
Sometimes changing the motor isn't an option or would at least be painful.
Cost, what does a "good" 3hp 240V single phase motor cost?
Have you found out how many hp your lathe is yet?


VFD which provides constant torque right down to silly slow speeds.

Remembering that torque isn't power. (anyone seen a graph of standard V vector drive power/rpm?)

Stuart

[Greg Q]

That's right...torque X RPM = power. No getting around that, hence reduction gear boxes ( torque multipliers).

The other, not often mentioned advantage to three phase power is the reduction in torsional vibration mode patterns in the workpiece. Single phase motors give a rougher finish because of their inately unbalanced torque delivery characteristics

[Dave J]

Hare and Forbes have a 3hp on special for $209.
https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/E112

Dave

[pipeclay]

Lets draw the agony of this thread even more,would that be classed as a Good or Bad 3HP motor for the cost.

[Dave J]

Depending on the rpm you need the better quality Australian made motors are up around the $400-440.
https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/E098

https://www.machineryhouse.com.au/E097

Dave

[pipeclay]

Lets draw the agony of this thread even more,would that be classed as a Good or Bad 3HP motor for the cost.
Dave, the question was not asked as a (serious) question,but Im sure that by going by what I read lately someone will probably say that the motor is not GOOD and we can go on for another couple of replies stateing the Pros and Cons of numerous electric motor manufacturers and go way off topic.

[Stustoys]

Ok, remove the word good. (I really meant good in relation to the motor that is likely already fitted to his lathe)
If we assume Daves $209 is in the ballpark of the cheaper end of the market, it would be cheaper to go with a (cheaper end) VSD
Although I'd admit to going OT at the drop of a hat, I was answering a question put by the OP so didnt think we were to far off..... yet :)

Stuart

[RayG]

That's right...torque X RPM = power. No getting around that, hence reduction gear boxes ( torque multipliers).



Hi GQ,

Flux vector drives claim to provide full torque at zero rpm, don't ask me to explain it.... that would be going off-topic.... :)

Regards
Ray

[Dave J]

I have found some good bits of info come from a thread going off topic.
Anyway I don't really see how discussing a new 240v motor or a VFD is going off topic because he wants to get this new lathe running as he doesn't have 3 phase..

Dave

[Big Shed]

I have found some good bits of info come from a thread going off topic.
Anyway I don't really see how discussing a new 240v motor or a VFD is going off topic because he wants to get this new lathe running as he doesn't have 3 phase..

Dave

I agree Dave, answers have been relevant to the original posters' question and topic.

Anyway, the OP is not complaining about "off topic" so why should someone else?????

Beats me, but there you go.

Aaron, am away from home at the moment but will get back with some more info for you when I come back. Mind you they will only be from a "beginners" point of view.

[Big Shed]

Lets draw the agony of this thread even more,would that be classed as a Good or Bad 3HP motor for the cost.

Pipeclay, not a very constructive contribution is it?

[RayG]

I have found some good bits of info come from a thread going off topic.
Anyway I don't really see how discussing a new 240v motor or a VFD is going off topic because he wants to get this new lathe running as he doesn't have 3 phase..

Dave

Hi Dave,

A good vector drive is a way to get full torque at low revs, but that said, a gear box will still give you more torque than a drive, a 10:1 gear box will give 10x the torque.. can't do that with a vector drive, but a vector drive gives you the ability to use that 10:1 gearbox over a wider range of speeds.

Vector drives, seperate the magnetizing current and the torque current components in software to maintain a 90 degree phase angle. The actual motor current is the vector sum of the magnetizing current and the torque current. Hence the name vector drive.

The thing that changes the speed of an AC motor is frequency. The thing that determines torque is current.

For Arron's lathe, it would be cheaper to pick up a 2.2kw 3 phase motor and an ebay vector drive than to buy a good quality single phase motor. Even if you just run it at 50Hz all the time and never use the speed control. Just use the gearbox You still get the advantages of motor protection, smoother running, ramp starts and so on.. And you can slow it down when you want for threading and such.

Regards
Ray

[Dave J]

Thanks for the explanation Ray, I just posted up the motors as I saw Aaron might be interested in one, so it gave him some examples of prices new. I have seen people steer clear of the VFD's because they just want a simple set up.
I have a 3 phase motor here from Bryan I am yet to fit, and think it is the way to go myself.

Dave

[eskimo]

Hi Dave,

A good vector drive is a way to get full torque at low revs, but that said, a gear box will still give you more torque than a drive, a 10:1 gear box will give 10x the torque.. can't do that with a vector drive, but a vector drive gives you the ability to use that 10:1 gearbox over a wider range of speeds.

Vector drives, seperate the magnetizing current and the torque current components in software to maintain a 90 degree phase angle. The actual motor current is the vector sum of the magnetizing current and the torque current. Hence the name vector drive.

The thing that changes the speed of an AC motor is frequency. The thing that determines torque is current.

For Arron's lathe, it would be cheaper to pick up a 2.2kw 3 phase motor and an ebay vector drive than to buy a good quality single phase motor. Even if you just run it at 50Hz all the time and never use the speed control. Just use the gearbox You still get the advantages of motor protection, smoother running, ramp starts and so on.. And you can slow it down when you want for threading and such.

Regards
Ray

But you can get more torque also by increasing motor size...and hence a bigger Vector driven VFD to suit.

Number of poles also changes rpm ?

[Greg Q]

But you can get more torque also by increasing motor size...and hence a bigger Vector driven VFD to suit.

Number of poles also changes rpm ?

Yes, that's true. The equation doesn't change for a given rpm, but the increased torque gives more useful power at the tool. But costs do escalate rapidly once you go above the 3 hp range, and it gets harder to find a single phase input VFD.

Azzrock's Colchester motor may be suitable for a 240v VFD as fitted, in which case he gets going cheaply, with added features.

[azzrock]

Hi every one. I haven't had time to read all the posts. i will soon .i all ready have a 3 hp single phase motor. Its a old cap start cap run. i am real interested to hear the pros and cons of vfd. Thanks every one for taking the time to post about this.

[azzrock]

ps i was hoping to be able to run the machine in fwd and rev.

[Dave J]

I would check the motor on it first before thinking about a VFD. If you have a 3hp motor and it will fit I would just throw that on for now if you lathe motor is not star delta (6 terminals)
If it is star delta it will still take a week for the VFD to get here and a few days to fit it.

Dave

[Stustoys]

ps i was hoping to be able to run the machine in fwd and rev.
You can of course do that but it does make the wiring more involved. (single phase)
Have you looked at what control circuits you have now? pictures?

With a VSD it is of course easy.

Stuart

[Dave J]

Forgot to add you can still run forward reverse with a VFD.

Dave

[azzrock]

Hi GQ,

Flux vector drives claim to provide full torque at zero rpm, don't ask me to explain it.... that would be going off-topic.... :)

Regards
Ray

ok just a guess with a small amount of reference they can hold a load

[azzrock]

ive had a quick look.
there is a few to chose from.
like these 2 SAJ 2.2KW VSD VFD inverter 240V variable speed drive | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SAJ-2-2KW-VSD-VFD-inverter-240V-variable-speed-drive-/180729667656?pt=AU_B_I_Electrical_Test_Equipment&hash=item2a1453e048)

VARIABLE FREQUENCY DRIVE INVERTER VFD NEW 3HP 2.2KW 10A | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VARIABLE-FREQUENCY-DRIVE-INVERTER-VFD-NEW-3HP-2-2KW-10A-/120692668902?pt=AU_B_I_Electrical_Test_Equipment&hash=item1c19d7f9e6)

not shore if the first is worth the extra money.300 bucks sounds ok the second ones only

theres abb, siemens. all though from experance i think id stay away from the siemens.
can you attach a joy stick to your lathe for speed control.

[Bryan]

Someone recently bought a SAJ and was setting it up... Ironwood I think. I've got one of those cheap ones (whatever they're called this week) and it's fine. Lots of them around. Ray's got dozens. There's a long-running thread about them here: http://www.woodworkforums.com/f170/tips-newbie-huanyang-vfd-users-96380/... which will only be partly relevant to non CNC users. Still, plenty of knowledge about them is my point. A few threads about them here in metalwork too. PM has a forum dedicated (partly) to VFDs which makes good background reading: Transformers, Phase Converters and VFD - Practical Machinist (http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/transformers-phase-converters-vfd/)

A joystick? Speed control uses a potentiometer, which is usually operated by turning a knob. But if you can make it work with a joystick, sure, why not? A fader might be easier though.

If I were you I'd be looking at how easy it would be to fit your spare single phase motor. If it's a bolt on and the pulley fits, then it's a half hour job and you're up and running. If you have to dick around to make it work, I'd spend that time fitting a VFD instead. What are you like with electrics?

[azzrock]

hi Bryan thanks for the links. good advise about the 240v motor . the pulley swap shouldn't be to much trouble. im not quite ready to set the lath up yet. I'm not to bad with the electrics lets say sound.
some thing ive found with this machine that is a bit of a worry is parts of it are caked in what looks like grinding dust.
not really shore why. One of the draws had a tray of ground punches in it.
there is a bit of play in the cross slide. that hopefully can be adjusted out.
ill try and post some pics tomorrow.
183120
not a very exciting photo. ill have to pull the cover plate of to see what sort of motor it is

[Metalman]

Azzrock, I have a smaller Colchester which came with a taper turning attachment, I found that some of the cross slide play I had was associated with the mounting point of the cross slide feed screw in the taper turning attachment. It would be worth checking this before trying to adjust the screw.
Mm.

[azzrock]

thanks mm ill have a look now. what do you think of your machine?

[Stustoys]

azzrock,
Do you have a better picture of the motor plate? 196? 5 is it?
230/250/400/440 would seem to be a good sign(if you choose to go VSD).

By play do you mean backlash in the crossslide screw? It really doesnt matter(of course opinions may vary).

Stuart

[azzrock]

here is some photos of the crusty grinding dust I don't like.
plus a photo of the screw cutting gear box. it has a oil
sight glass. I think that means the lathe is a later model.
183177

183178183179
183180
also another photo of motor tally plate.

183181

[Metalman]

Azzrock, my Colchester came form Ajax Fasteners in Sydney and was well used. I have had the bed reground and have done other work on it as well. There is still a lot to do but I am happy with it. It has mechanically variable speed control (35 to 3000 rpm)which is very useful, If you can fit a VFD to yours you will have the same advantage but without the noise. I think you have a good machine, there are times I wish I had a larger machine but I have no space. Regards, Mm.

[azzrock]

Azzrock, I have a smaller Colchester which came with a taper turning attachment, I found that some of the cross slide play I had was associated with the mounting point of the cross slide feed screw in the taper turning attachment. It would be worth checking this before trying to adjust the screw.
Mm.


hi metal man i don't think the play is coming from the taper turning attachment. the lead screw doesn't move just the the tool post ect. where else did you find play? was it hard to fix

[Metalman]

Hello Azzrock, I had significant wear in the cross slide screw and nut. I was able to source a new Nuttal screw and nut for the right price and fitted these. The parts were slightly larger than the originals so I was able to modify them to fit. There was also wear on the sliding surfaces and I was able to regrind these at the Tech I was going to at the time.
I have not bought any genuine spare parts for the lathe but I am told they are very expensive.

[azzrock]

hi every one finally ive moved the lathe inside. with the help of my mate and his engine crane. I couldn't locate threaded hole for fitting a lifting lug. So strapped a sling threw the bed. the lathe is not running yet but should soon be.

184330184331

[Dave J]

It looks a lot bigger now it's in the shed.

Dave

[azzrock]

i think it does to Dave

[Stustoys]

Coming along. If your shed is anything like mine these things always take much longer than planned.
Have you worked out what you are going to do with the motor yet and can you still get to it? its in the base isnt it?
Stuart

[azzrock]

hi Stuart. how are you? i can still get to the motor. Just behind the lathe, that wall is a door that opens to the back yard. i pulled the 3 phase motor out with the idea of getting it running on the 3hp single phase motor i have. It only just fits and because of the increased center height id have to buy new v belts. Really i want to give the vfd a go. i think ill;l try this one...VARIABLE FREQUENCY DRIVE INVERTER VFD NEW 3HP 2.2KW 10A | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VARIABLE-FREQUENCY-DRIVE-INVERTER-VFD-NEW-3HP-2-2KW-10A-/120692668902?pt=AU_B_I_Electrical_Test_Equipment&hash=item1c19d7f9e6)...
the motor is in the base under the head stock. I think ill order the vfd tomorrow. I was thinking about getting rid of my hercus 9c but really don't want to and what's the harm in having 2 lathes.
its going to be great to have a machine with a decant size headstock bore that runs fast enough and has the power for tipped tools. not only that metric and English threads a quick change gear box. not to mention spindle brake hardened ways ect ect

[Stustoys]

Hi azzrock,
Going good thanks, yourself? Thats a great idea, you can open the door, sweep the swarf outside, close the door, job done lol
This one looks cheaper for (I think) the same thing, Havent bought off either of those guys. I do have to get some more VSDs one of these days
VARIABLE FREQUENCY DRIVE INVERTER VFD NEW 3HP 2.2KW g4 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/320672283926)

No harm at all in having two lathes as long as you dont run out of room for other large lumps of cast iron that may follow you home :). Could even be handy if you need to make something for the new lathe.

Stuart

[azzrock]

thanks Stuart i thought the postage would be higher from the us.there is more room for say a turret mill
maybe a surface grinder. the hercus didn't cost much and i like the look of it where it is. Plus the fact that i have a half made extended cross slide housing for it as well as heaps of additional qctp cutter holders to finish of. Time will tell.

[Dave J]

If it doesn't owe you much and you don't need the money, I would keep it. I am sorry I sold my little Hercus, but back then it helped fund the 12 x 36 and I got good money for it.
The difference is going to be night and day between using them.:o
If something jambs on your new one it will just snap the tool or whatever is in the way, so take it easy until you get used to the controls and layout of the new machine.
When you first start using it, you will probably find yourself going for controls that are not their, because your used to your Hercus.

Dave

[Stustoys]

Someone might dig up a cheaper one, my searches arent the best sometimes.
No hurry on the hercus, its not like its going to suddenly be worth less if you hold onto it for 6 months.

Stuart

[Dave J]

It will probably go up because it will be even more rare.:D
I wonder how many of them where made, as I see a lot getting split up and sold as parts, and there still seems to be plenty around. Same with the Douglas shapers, but they don't seem to get split and sold in parts.

Dave

[PDW]

Hi
Looks like you have a Colchester Student Late 50's 60"s vintage
Very good machine as I operated one when new both at school and work. Hope you have a full complement of chucks etc. as they have a rather unique mounting where the spindle nose fits right into the chuck, very safe as they were aimed at tafe schools in the UK. They also have a strange starting lever, move too quick and it wont start, there is a reason however I have forgotten.
Have Fun
Ray

I think you'll find the spindle taper is L-00 in size or maybe L-0. You can buy backplates etc from the USA.

If it's L-00 I have a Pratt Bernerd EC collet chuck that would fit that may be surplus to my needs. I was going to fit it to a D1-6 backplate but I think it's getting too much like hard work. The EC collets are available from Mick Moyle for about $60 each, FWIW.

PDW

[azzrock]

hi pdw im just going to pinch my self to make shore im not dreaming. ill send a pm. ok
im not shore of the taper size i know its a American safety taper. i saw another machine today with that taper. do many machines have it. do you know much about these colchester lathes.
aaron

[Bryan]

Azzrock, this page has details of american tapers: Lathe Spindle Nose Fittings (http://www.lathes.co.uk/latheparts/page9.html).

[azzrock]

thanks bryan you read my mind. how are you today?

[azzrock]

hi all ...Well im just about to start wiring up this lathe for a vfd. I have brought one its your basic cheap one. 2.2kw. I wanted to keep the price of getting this lathe running down.
Although I had a spare 3hp single phase motor. The fact that I could retain forward and reverse spindle direction with the vsd was a advantage of that method.

so ill show a few pics of what i had and what has to be done.

185848

here to is a pic of the motor wired as it was in star. plus a photo of the single phase motor..
185853185854

the control panel on the Colchester would need some changes two. there was a very solid motor start contactor with overload but unfortunately the auxiliary coil is 415V
415v185855 185856 185857185858
185871

so i have a very nice modern contactor for the motor with more contacts than ill ever need but no in built overload. i think the drive will take care of this function.
also behind the on switch is a motor reverse switch that controls motor direction.
now that the drive is looking after this. the reverse switch will just be a basic on off switch for the motor.
i think the wiring from this switch will go to the contactor auxiliary coil.
here is a picture of the reversing switch located at the back of the lathe.
plus the cavity where the motor is housed
.185859
185860185864

here is the front of the reversing switch. the motor "on off" of lever with smaller direction lever sitting on it. this is also the spindle brake lever.
185871

i suppose the first job is to change the 3 phase motor from star to delta.
its easier to do this with motor with 6 terminals you just relocate the jumpers.

185872185873

[Stustoys]

Hi azzrock,
Any idea what the transformer is for?
With the forward reverse swtich, you should be able to use that with the VSD. Would be better than having to mess about on the VSD.

Stuart

[azzrock]

hi Stuart. hows your week been?The transformer had been isolated on the secondary side. I think it was for low volt lighting. It to is wired up as a 415V, to i think 50 volt step down.
The lathe also has a 3 phase coolant system. I think for now that has to go on the back burner. The coolant Pp is controlled by the main switch witch is a 3 way type.
I was planing on using the vfd to control the spindle direction. Instead if using the lathes controls for reverse. Having not programmed a vfd yet I didn't think it would be a drama.Only time will tell.


Hi azzrock,
Any idea what the transformer is for?
With the forward reverse switch, you should be able to use that with the VSD. Would be better than having to mess about on the VSD.

Stuart

[Stustoys]

Hi azzrock,
It goes as well as can be expected in tax week lol.
Sorry I wasnt clear about the reverse switch. What I meant was, you should be able to use that switch to switch the VSD between fwd and rev. So you would be using the VSD to control spindle direction, just using the factory switch.(I'm not sure that much clearer). Still you can leave it for now and come back to it later.

Stuart

[azzrock]

i get and that's a great idea. thanks.
one thing is i really like the way the controls look on this machine.
so if i can use what's already there even better

[azzrock]

you beauty. i got this lathe turning over tonight with the vfd. Its by no means a finished job but the lathe runs nice and quite and a bit of round bar in the 3 jaw runs nice and true.


happy happy happy

[Stustoys]

Congrads :2tsup:

[azzrock]

thanks mate

[RayG]

happy happy happy

Nice work Aaron, always good to hear of a success..

Regards
Ray

[Big Shed]

you beauty. i got this lathe turning over tonight with the vfd. Its by no means a finished job but the lathe runs nice and quite and a bit of round bar in the 3 jaw runs nice and true.


happy happy happy

Beauty, you must be as happy as a pig in sh*t:D:2tsup::2tsup:

[azzrock]

nearly fred. its a feeling i have all most forgotten

[azzrock]

ok a quick update . i have the lathe running and am working on useing the lathe controls to control the lathe not the vsd panel. ie on for spindle fwd and the reverse for spindle rev ect ect. plus ill have to .find a suitable pot for speed control..
i really like the look and feel of the controls so might as well use them.
ive taken a few cuts and have to say im not happy. so i pulled down the cross slide and there is a lot of where in the cross slide screw and nut.
ive all ready managed to get a new nut from the uk for $70 aus..
the screw is another matter. The prises are quite unbelievable..
ill keep looking and if no luck will have a crack a making one.
aaron

[Metalman]

I have not tried them and have no connection but have you tried Robert Pringle Engineers in the UK?
Good luck, Mm.

[azzrock]

no mm but i will. thanks mate

[azzrock]

i haven't got as far as id like with the lathe.
i have used it a few times. ive atarted to level the machine but need to set 0 on my machine level. its hard to find any thing level enough.
there was a fair bit of chatter on the steel i was cutting. after paying a bit more attention to a sharp tool and correct center height cleared that up.
the auto feed only work's in the facing direction. I might have to pull the apron of to have a look.
i still havnt managed to get the vsd answering the lathe controls. ie i have to push run on the vsd instead of use use the lath controls and to stop the lathe press stop. which is very annoying.
besides all that. over 40mm it is cutting a taper bigger towards the chuck of 0.23mm.
so this is a worry and ill have to look if the taper turning attachment is causing this.

[Stustoys]

Hi azzrock,
You don't really need the level to be set to 0, just as long as you use it the same way around. (once you get the lathe pretty close you should be able to set the level off it)

What size material are you turning how far from the chuck?

What part of the VSD are you having problems with? the VSD settings? the vsd wiring? or the lathe switch wiring?
I have 4 of them somewhere between GUANGZHOU and here lol

Stuart

[pipeclay]

".010 taper over 40mm,not good would matter what hes cutting unless its a bit of hardened bar and the tool is wearing.

[Stustoys]

".010 taper over 40mm,not good would matter what hes cutting unless its a bit of hardened bar and the tool is wearing.
Well no, but it would be a lot worse if he was taking 0.1mm doc off 50mm bar close to the chuck then if he was taking 0.5mm doc of 10mm bar 100mm from the chuck.