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eskimo
4th Dec 2012, 08:38 AM
as some of you are aware I am building a model Napoleon Civil War cannon

I have opted for a 1/6 scale which gives a barrel length of around 11.5 inches...I added a bit extra at the cascabel ...no one will notice

I ended up getting the trunnions tig welded to the barrel in lieu of silver soldering...I am now begining to think that that wasnt such a smart idea as I now have some extra ..no no no... a LOT of polishing to do now

any how here are some pics of where I'm at

I opted to do 8 felloes for each wheel in lieu of the seven as they are in the real world..why?...the drawing I was following mentioned that they actually had seven but gave the dimensions for an 8 folloes wheel...i didnt read it properly and hence followed the sizes and then realised (after I had cut 14 from the hunk of American Walnut that I had) that it wasnt going to reach at each end..DUH!!! read it properly next time...so not wanting to waste the timber I went for an 8 segment wheel. ...on this its supprising how far out ones so called ubeaut (Makita in this case) compound saw is out when cutting each piece at 22.5 degrees, place them all and the last piece want wont fit...slight error on the angle...mmm 22.5 was actually 22.8..is my guess

the elevation adjustment ooozeewhatsit in the drawing just didnt look right as it had a sharp cone where the barrel would rest..so I altered as per what I could see on most of the images that Google bought up.

the steel rings are the the bits for the end of the wheel hubs...some one will tell us what they are

I was going to chuck my home made wood lathe as I was running out of space...glad I didnt...i soon realised that if I had a chuck that I could fit to it it would be the ideal thing to use as a steel polishing with emery etc machine...so I bought a small chuck from CDCO...and it works a treat!!

the bore is 1/2 inch...the scale called for .77" but I erred on the side of caution as recommended in the drawing and knowing very well that I will most likely use a high BP charge oneday.to make it go Whooompa!

TKO
4th Dec 2012, 06:24 PM
Hi Eskimo,Not knocking what you are doing ,it is looking Good, but if you don't get all the felloes the

same size, when you put the spokes in you will have a different gap between the spokes on any small felloes, and it will make it dificult to get the spokes to line exacly oposite to each other,and seeing as how you have made such a good job with the gun's barrell it would be a shame to spoil the metal work with out of shape wheels ,Im pretty certain 8 felloes would cut at 67.5 degrees,and you can make a little jig
to make them all Identical ,the metal at the end of the knave is not only a finish touch but a some time used as afoot up, but is there to also protect the wheel nut, the iron rims on the knave back and front or each side of the spokes hold the timber together from the pressure that they would get from the road and the wieght that they have to carry. there are plans available for a Napoleon Canon, some forums who make these types of models also have places where you can get plans from,I hope this helps and look forward to some photos of your progress.

Cheers Eddie

eskimo
5th Dec 2012, 08:22 AM
Hi Eskimo,Not knocking what you are doing ,it is looking Good, but if you don't get all the felloes the

same size, when you put the spokes in you will have a different gap between the spokes on any small felloes, and it will make it dificult to get the spokes to line exacly oposite to each other,and seeing as how you have made such a good job with the gun's barrell it would be a shame to spoil the metal work with out of shape wheels ,Im pretty certain 8 felloes would cut at 67.5 degrees,and you can make a little jig
to make them all Identical ,the metal at the end of the knave is not only a finish touch but a some time used as afoot up, but is there to also protect the wheel nut, the iron rims on the knave back and front or each side of the spokes hold the timber together from the pressure that they would get from the road and the wieght that they have to carry. there are plans available for a Napoleon Canon, some forums who make these types of models also have places where you can get plans from,I hope this helps and look forward to some photos of your progress.

Cheers Eddie

Hi Eddie and thanks for the pointers
I recut the second lot of felloes late yesterday arvo, and now have them all meeting very well......allthough the universal protractor said i had cut them at 22.5 ( as best I could read it) something occurs when you put them all 8 felloes together to form the shape of the wheel...by the time you put the last one down it is obvious that the angle just isnt quite right...there is iether a gap or the last one wont fit in...anyhow some fine tuning and all look good ready for gluing to router out the wheel.

the plans I am copying are William Greens...and I picked up a mistake last night.... after I had cut the American Oak for the stock...he has a measurement of 1.25 wide for this ...but I was looking at the barrel ...trying to come up with an easy way to polish the welded on trunnions, when i said to my self ..the width at those trunnions shoulders are much wider than 1.25"..closer to 2.00" than 1.25"???..so hows the trunnions going to fit into the cheeks if the the stock is only 1.25"???? good thing I had extra Oak on hand.

eskimo
5th Dec 2012, 09:25 AM
the plans I am copying are William Greens...and I picked up a mistake last night....

no there isnt..me reading to fast again...not concentrating etc etc..the drawing is correct afterall

eskimo
19th Dec 2012, 07:45 AM
I changed my mind ...again...i know, i should have been female
I ended up making 7 segment (felloes) for the wheels.....now to glue it all together and router out the wheel to size
sorry about about having the compound saw support abscuring the pic but I am running out of bench space room..i have 3 enclosure aircons in bits at the moment

TKO
20th Dec 2012, 10:37 PM
Yes I can see the felloes you have cut out but are you sure they are all the same size because they don't all look the same to me,and it is important to have them the same sizeas the spoke will not line up properly as each spoke should be direct in line with it's opposite number,with equal gaps between each spoke and at the stage you are at it would be easy to make them equal ,if you have a lathe it would be much easier to cut a wheel out and have it perfectly round,in an earlier post I have an article on making wheels if you can look it up in the scale model section wood working, it might help you to finish the wheels without to much problems,

eskimo
21st Dec 2012, 08:20 AM
Yes I can see the felloes you have cut out but are you sure they are all the same size because they don't all look the same to me,and it is important to have them the same sizeas the spoke will not line up properly as each spoke should be direct in line with it's opposite number,with equal gaps between each spoke and at the stage you are at it would be easy to make them equal ,if you have a lathe it would be much easier to cut a wheel out and have it perfectly round,in an earlier post I have an article on making wheels if you can look it up in the scale model section wood working, it might help you to finish the wheels without to much problems,

they're all the same size Eddie....the compound saw with a stop a guide should have made sure of that in the first instance...but measuring them after they were cut proved it..no more than 2-3 thou between them all

..on that, i dont think the felloes being out a little would be the problem...drilling the holes to ensure they line up with opposite number is the challenge

the model is supposed to be a replica and as the full size has seven folloes per wheel then these should be to??..but yes I agree turning them on the lathe would have been the easy way, but I like the idea of being able to brag about my work:D...(if it works out that is)..and pst dont tell anyone but I am cheating when i can ...just hope I can hide them so they cant be frowned upon

eskimo
21st Dec 2012, 08:54 AM
I had a look at your thread Eddie
how do you make the tyre?...and great jigs by the way

dont you waste a lot of wood making the folloes that way?
i will be gluing mine to cardboard on top of a bit of waste ply and then cutting the wheel out rotating a router around an axis in the centre of the felloes

TKO
21st Dec 2012, 10:04 PM
It did look to me that they were different,But it's good that they are all the same ,There was also a jig for getting the hub spacings right ,as I have made a lot of wheels

I made a jig just for that job,which allows you to off set the spoke if it calls for it in a plan, If you look at the jig for getting the spokes to the right length, and use some

thing like that it will automatically get the spaces correct ,The steel rims I cut from a steel pipe if I have the pipe close to the size I want,and turn them on the lathe

the pipe is always thicker than the rim required,so that the corect size is cut out,

I find it much better than cutting a strip of metal and silver soldering the ends together, I am always on the look out for off cuts of very thick pipes,

To your thoughts on the wood wasted cutting the felloes you can usualy get two or more feloes one being smaller for a nother scale if a fine cut off tool is used it

would be close to a rear and front wheel size,I have bever tried cutting them out with a router, just keep at it.


Eddie

bsrlee
24th Dec 2012, 09:42 PM
Watch out for the Fun Police - that comes awfully close to being a 'pistol' or 'shortened firearm' under some state's definitions if it is capable of being fired. They could also probably get a case up for 'replica firearm' if they were looking to pad things out. There are a heap of other regulations in different states that may apply.

I have nearly 30 years with the NSW Police, and now I'm 'retired' I do casual work for one of the leading SPFX & Armouring companies in NSW, which again places me in opposition to the Firearms Registry & their 'advisers' (the Fun Police)

eskimo
25th Dec 2012, 09:48 AM
Watch out for the Fun Police - that comes awfully close to being a 'pistol' or 'shortened firearm' under some state's definitions if it is capable of being fired. They could also probably get a case up for 'replica firearm' if they were looking to pad things out. There are a heap of other regulations in different states that may apply.

I have nearly 30 years with the NSW Police, and now I'm 'retired' I do casual work for one of the leading SPFX & Armouring companies in NSW, which again places me in opposition to the Firearms Registry & their 'advisers' (the Fun Police)

I have checked with firearms branch and they say that it is OK...just watch out that you comply with the Summary Offences Act....that is.... dont scare anyone with it

provided it is a genuine model it is not a problem...take the barrel off the carriage and then its a different story of course

although the pistol club (of which I am the Secretary) is not licensed for them, SAPOL Firearms Branch do not have any problems with them being used for say on a bi-annual demonstration or major event opening act

eskimo
13th Jun 2013, 05:01 PM
Having become preoccupied with new mill, and generally being lazy I finally got around to making the spokes

now to finish off the fellows and put the wheels together

TKO
18th Jun 2013, 10:11 PM
Hi I had sort of got out of touch as there was a long way between post on your canon, good that you have got to working on it again look forward to seeing the progression . Eddie

eskimo
19th Jun 2013, 09:44 AM
Hi Eddie

yeah thats me slack

But I have manged to finish one wheel except for steel work

The timber fellows were glued to ardboard and onto a piece of MDF. They were then turned on the lathe for OD and ID.

The holes through the fellows and into the bub were drilled on the on the mill using a rotary table at 4.5 degree angle

The fellows were broken away from the MDF. The mdf was set up on a shaft in the lathe and then the fellows and hub and spokes were assembled etc

now for the second...its supposed to get easier ..isnt it?

the last pics shows one thing I forgot to do while assembling and glueing...missed knocking one spoke right down in to the hub...too late now...bit of beeswax will hide that

The wheel rim is offset to the hub if anyone is wondering. The plan calls for it.

TKO
8th Jul 2013, 10:09 PM
Hi Eskimo, I am sort of out of touch with the woodwork section at the moment.am involved with a car total restoration ,sorry I have not been paying attention to your wip,what I can see though is very good, love the wheel progress I recon you have got it down to a fine finish with the spokes and fellies ,don't know how far you have got now I will pay a bit more attion in future.:2tsup:

Eddie

eskimo
7th Aug 2013, 12:25 PM
I have made a little progress on the noise maker

I had the trunnions on the cannon welded...not sure I like it now. Maybe I should have silver soldered them on?

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now for some fiddley metal work stuff...such as tyres, trunnion plate, cap squares and all the other little bits n pieces

when all that is done its off to a friend for bluing (a gunsmith)

TKO
7th Aug 2013, 07:53 PM
That's a good job you have done so far, wish I could put a weld down like what you have done, its a really neat job, looking forward to the finished model.:2tsup::2tsup:

Eddie

eskimo
7th Aug 2013, 10:19 PM
That's a good job you have done so far, wish I could put a weld down like what you have done, its a really neat job, looking forward to the finished model.:2tsup::2tsup:

Eddie

thanks Eddie for all that praise...i need all i can get :D

pst..dont tell any one, but I didnt do that weld...someone else did it...i am hopeless at welding

TKO
9th Aug 2013, 09:44 PM
No I wont tell any one ,we will keep it very quiet, pity though you have spilt the beans:roflmao:,
but no matter you are doing a great job on the rest of the model :).

Eddie

col's dad
18th Aug 2013, 06:13 PM
crash hot job. loooove the wood work,those wheel are grouse:2tsup:CD.

eskimo
19th Aug 2013, 09:28 AM
crash hot job. loooove the wood work,those wheel are grouse:2tsup:CD.

thanks CD

eskimo
28th Oct 2013, 05:20 PM
Things have been progressing very slowly...been too busy playing with some other toys...

I have been searching for some hollow bar or something that I could make the tyres for the wheels from...but I bit the bullet and bought some

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Going to waste a bit of product for two 1/2" w x 0.060 x 9.4"dia tyres but figure its easier to do than trying to roll and weld to get right diameter

eskimo
23rd Dec 2013, 08:10 AM
finally finished the wheels

wonder if I have done the right thing using American Oak...all the steel...????

I have oiled the wheels very well so I will keep my fingers crossed the tannins dont react...if they do I will just have to paint them the dull grey they are supposed to be

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Another step closer to being able to fire it:yes:

Gavin Newman
27th Dec 2013, 07:38 AM
That's a beautiful job on the wheels, the brown steel comes up a treat:U

eskimo
27th Dec 2013, 08:37 AM
thanks Gavin

at least there out of the way....now for the other fiddly bits...
mostly lots of small stuff

the trunion plates and caps are done...

johno j
4th Feb 2014, 10:29 AM
Hi Eskimo, I found your project very interesting, I have been toying with the idea of making a model of the American brass civil war cannon, not to fire but just as a model. Iíve spent hours trying to research how to make the wheels what I think are the hardest parts. I have both wood and metal lathes along with a mill, Iím not a machinist just a hobbyist whoís made parts for old motorcycles that you canít buy anymore. Your project was very interesting and has inspired me, thanks for sharing it.

bwal74
4th Feb 2014, 12:59 PM
HI Eskimo,

I had some spare time today so was able to read your post. Awesome project. The cannon and wheels look great. Looking forward to the finished project.

Ben.

eskimo
11th Feb 2014, 08:35 AM
Hi Eskimo, I found your project very interesting, I have been toying with the idea of making a model of the American brass civil war cannon, not to fire but just as a model. Iíve spent hours trying to research how to make the wheels what I think are the hardest parts. I have both wood and metal lathes along with a mill, Iím not a machinist just a hobbyist whoís made parts for old motorcycles that you canít buy anymore. Your project was very interesting and has inspired me, thanks for sharing it.

Thanks Johno
actually the wheels were easier to make as compared to trunnion plates and caps...bending to suit the cheeks was a real pain


HI Eskimo,

I had some spare time today so was able to read your post. Awesome project. The cannon and wheels look great. Looking forward to the finished project.

Ben.

not far to go now Ben...a few fiddly things but mainly waiting on a mate to blue the barrel (gunsmith who expects to do some bluing in about 2 weeks or so..but that is what he said a month ago:no:)
...then need get to some 2f, some balls .... and kaboom!

This hot weather we have had in Adelaide has dried the timber and the metal hub rings are loose...I had to hit these on when I first fitting them ......the wheels had 2 heavy coats of polish before the hot weather, but still shrunk

I am not going to put any more polish on until winter. I am hoping the wheels will take up some moisture and expand back to where they were...if that happens I will then polish very well hoping to stop the rapid drying out and then take of moisture in subsequent years of intense weather changes. Also moving it into the house might help..if swmbo allows

If it doesnt happen (expand) I will resort to carefully just gluing them in place...even the tyres are also loose but not too bad:~

China
11th Feb 2014, 05:36 PM
Sounds like we have the same gunsmith

eskimo
11th Feb 2014, 05:45 PM
Sounds like we have the same gunsmith

:roflmao:...no names ....to protect the guilty

ah ah maybe..most likely...probably....maybe...you know him too?.....he is good though
have a new barrel coming for the sti...hope i dont have to wait long:roll:

Peda
13th Feb 2014, 09:31 PM
Hi Eskimo, I too have been following this impressive build with interest and as a result I have been doing a lot of reading and research into the Napoleon cannon and the American Civil War.


the metal hub rings are loose...

Those rings are called nave rings... I found that out from a very interesting and informative online document which is actually the ordinance manual for use of officers, printed in 1861, at the beginning of the war. In this 600 page manual are itemized diagrams of the various weapons of the time.. including the Napoleon.
http://archive.org/stream/cu31924031187887#page/n25/mode/2up

The real cannons had to be proof fired and if they failed proof, they were rejected.. duh!. As a matter of curiosity, will your model need to be proof fired and if so .. how would it be done?
Regards
Peter

eskimo
14th Feb 2014, 08:13 AM
Those rings are called nave rings...

http://archive.org/stream/cu31924031187887#page/n25/mode/2up

The real cannons had to be proof fired and if they failed proof, they were rejected.. duh!. As a matter of curiosity, will your model need to be proof fired and if so .. how would it be done?
Regards
Peter


Hi Peter...yes they do have a name...I just couldnt recall...getting old:oo:

Thanks for that link...book saved...I had one but with no plates.

Proof fired?....whats that...it will work ...or it wont work....50/50 chance

nah I will start with a light load and then work up to something that is more fitting...

eskimo
15th Feb 2014, 11:29 AM
Friday am after 24 hrs of rain the naves on the hubs were still loose...no sign of timber taking in the moisture

Saturday am....the naves are stuck fast in the spots the were last at ...thats because they were so loose they would move if knocked or the wheel being moved

Anyhow, its good to know the wheels and hubs have taken up moisture and expanded after the very hot spell...will give it another day or two (we are expecting more rain next week) before giving the wheels a darn good heavy polish to seal and hopefully prevent the naves from falling off during future intense seasonal changes??

eskimo
21st Apr 2014, 09:42 AM
it is almost finished....but I could'nt wait for the gunsmith to do the bluing on the barrel


http://youtu.be/rYKqB2QGXm4

eskimo
21st Apr 2014, 11:15 AM
and another


http://youtu.be/pHMFfLKvAq4