Straightening an Allen-Key

[Fret Less]

That's right. An Allen-Key. Bare with me here. This is actually a question for the instrument forum I suppose, not sure where to put it really.

The concept is for freltess bass - other people have a made a 'slap plate' that sits on the bridge end of the neck and catches the strings before they hit the fingerboard, so you can get the kind of slap sound one gets from a normal fretted bass.

I have been mucking about and found I love the sound of a tiny Allen-Key for this job. I have some limited jewellery-making experience and I did some hands-on engineering a long time ago. Just looking for the easiest, safest way to bend this Allen-Key into shape, or a way to find out the metal composition and find a good replacement.

Cold-working would be preferable, bit I don't even have a vice. And I don't own a blowtorch either. Any ideas?

[Machtool]

What is it about the allen key that you find attractive? The Hex shape, or just the composition?

I doubt you are going to be able to bend a key with out hot working it. A small key would get hot enough over the flame of a gas cooktop. You want cherry red, and dont quench it. It will go brittle.

If you could live with a round shape. Silver steel has some of the same properties, being tough, but not necessarily hard. There a thread just down a few from this one, where to but it in small quantities. I think you can cold word silver steel as supplied, if the bends aren't too sharp. Its still tough stuff.

Music wire has potential. Hard to find in this country, I'd imagine you are in the 1.5 - 2 mm thick range? You can wind music wire into springs, so it does cold work.

Regards Phil.

On Edit. It just occurred to me that you wanted to straighten an allen key. It that just because its not long enough. I'd doubt you could get that bend out with out it looking like crap. However, there are long series allen keys available. They might be suitable just to cut the length you need out.

[Fret Less]

Thanks, that's given me a lot to look into. Yeah, I just wanted to know if I could easily work this particular one, not because of looks, but the sound is perfect. It's like finding the right bit of wood, some things just have that magic tone. But I will definitely look into all those options you mentioned. Thanks again.

[dabbler]

Won't the allen key's sound properties change if the shape changes ?

[Machtool]

but the sound is perfect. It's like finding the right bit of wood, some things just have that magic tone.
I'll apologise straight up front for being a heritic and heathen. I had this discussion with a good mate of mine over lunch a few weeks back. That was mostly to do with oxygen free copper cable for speakers.

I have trouble understanding how an allen key is any better. Thats why I asked about the shape. With a hex you could make the argument that the string hits on one of the 60 degree edges. But even with a cylindrical shape, it still contacts at one point. On or about top dead center.

I'm of the school that any metal with proporties over and above that of murcury, would have enough resistance to restrain a string at that point? Its not like the string has much energy to disipate.

Lead wire would have the best potential for that. And extremely easy to work.

Regards Phil.

[dabbler]

I have been mucking about and found I love the sound of a tiny Allen-Key for this job.

Now I get it. You like the IDEA of using an allen key.

[Michael G]

While the oxygen free copper stuff can be a bit of a mind over matter thing, using particular metals for specific acoustic properties can make a difference - although there is also a lot of tradition/ perception tied up in that too. I have a shed with part of a pipe organ in it, and traditionally pipes have been made from a tin/ lead mixture but also from wood, bamboo, paper, cardboard and in my case PVC water pipe too. There have been scientific papers written on the differences.
Shape may make a difference but you start talking complex maths to show it. It's all about elasticity, density and vibration modes.

Michael

[Master Splinter]

Over-length allen keys can be found in some of the various oriental kits or the tee-handled sets - buy one of those and cut down to the length you require.

[Ueee]

For the record, the oxygen free copper cable has nothing to do with the quality of conductance, zero oxygen means no degradation of the copper through oxidization.....

I like the idea of the allen key, have you tried other items to get other sounds?

[bollie7]

For the record, the oxygen free copper cable has nothing to do with the quality of conductance, zero oxygen means no degradation of the copper through oxidization.....
Geez, you learn someting new everyday. There I was thinking it was for transfering money. From the pockets of the -aah - easily persuaded shall we say, into the pockets of the audio, particularly car audio, retailers. :D


bollie7

[Fret Less]

I knew this would generate some heated debate. It's fairly simple really. I was building a short-scale bass and testing a lot of different materials for the bridge and nut and noticing how they affect the sound. I noted down all my findings. Then I decided to just a buy a fretless and realised I'd never tried allen keys on all my prior experiments. So I started by slapping the string with it. That had enough potential to be interesting, but too transient and trebly. So I theorised it might sound nice with a little wood in it and placed it on the fingerboard as a 'slap plate'. That worked so well I decided I must make this mod.

What I've done today is pop down to the hobby shop and get some K&S brass and stainless rod stock. The brass I cold-worked over my spare neck and I'm about to start experimenting with placement and acoustics after lunch. I'm giving this a shot because they don't sell silver-steel and I want to see what I can do without resorting to internet shopping.

I hadn't actually considered that the shape of the allen key might contribute to the magic. I assumed it was solely the material. Well, soon I'll see if round is any different and if creating a flat or an angle for the string to fall on makes any appreciable difference.

Here are some examples:

slap plate bass - Bing Images (http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=slap+plate+bass&qpvt=slap+plate+bass&FORM=IGRE&&id=6C5C20648B4C5BE4E2B8C469672314357CEF8BB3&selectedIndex=3#view=detail&id=6C5C20648B4C5BE4E2B8C469672314357CEF8BB3&selectedIndex=0)

slap plate bass - Bing Images (http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=slap+plate+bass&qpvt=slap+plate+bass&FORM=IGRE&&id=39B1A1CBFBEDA0057B7DE9B0F7C3A1523D98E1DE&selectedIndex=24#view=detail&id=39B1A1CBFBEDA0057B7DE9B0F7C3A1523D98E1DE&selectedIndex=0)

slap plate bass - Bing Images (http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=slap+plate+bass&qpvt=slap+plate+bass&FORM=IGRE&&id=6C5C20648B4C5BE4E2B8EB50432A0AEEBA264CB8&selectedIndex=102#view=detail&id=6C5C20648B4C5BE4E2B8EB50432A0AEEBA264CB8&selectedIndex=0)

TalkBass Forums (http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/anyone-made-slap-plate-protect-their-fretless-board-81180/)

My approach was completely different and comes from trying to inject metal tonality into synthetic gut strings - on my short-scale project. But it amounts to the same thing on a metal-strung bass like the one I'm talking about in this thread.

[Machtool]

Do you know what sized allen key you need? I've got a drawer full of lost / broken up sets. Normally in the long series Yanky Bondus. Happy to post you a few if I have them.

** I solved my problem of loosing allen keys. I buy really expensive Swiss one's now. At $120 - 130 a set, I'll spend an hour finding a dropped key.

Regards Phil.

[Fret Less]

Do you know what sized allen key you need? I've got a drawer full of lost / broken up sets. Normally in the long series Yanky Bondus. Happy to post you a few if I have them.

** I solved my problem of loosing allen keys. I buy really expensive Swiss one's now. At $120 - 130 a set, I'll spend an hour finding a dropped key.

Regards Phil.

Thanks, that's really kind. I actually have moved on to a bent brass rod and I'm testing that to see how it goes. But thanks very much for the offer and I'll let you know.