Ideas for how to make a matchbox compartment automatically slide up out of chest

[denno020]

Hey all,

I've just bought this pretty sweet wooden chest (see images), and I want to personalise it a bit.. It's going to be for my nephew for Christmas, and I want to incorporate a matchbox cars storage compartment that will automatically slide up as the lid of the chest is opened.

I'm not sure if it's possible with the way the lid opens, but I thought I would post up here, see if anyone has any ideas for how I could accomplish it..

Below are a couple of photos of the chest
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And this is the kind of compartment I'd like to have in it.. Obviously not a wall size one like this image, but I want each car to have their own little section, and stored vertically like this.
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I'm thinking the compartment would be at the back of the chest, so there will be room at the front for him to throw his other toys.

Also, it's not a necessity that the sliding up and down is directly connected to the lid.. It can be made so that he will have to lower the cars first before closing the lid, but it would be nice if they would automatically slide up when the lid opens.

After any ideas or criticisms of my idea!

Thanks,
Luke

[TermiMonster]

Perhaps you could store them in the lid, which looks like its got a bit of depth?
You'll need a way to lock them in though, when the lid goes down.
TM

[denno020]

Thanks for the reply TM,

I have definitely thought about story in the lid of the box, which is the perfect depth for a mathbox car.. However, as you pointed out, making something that will hold the cars when the lid closes, that is the problem..

The only thing I can really think of is to add a lid for the matchbox compartment itself.. Which I suppose could be cool, because it would be like a secret compartment...

[Sir Stinkalot]

Why not do the same thing as the wall cabinet. Use the lid as the storage area, a perspex front would stop the cars falling out when the lid is closed and will allow them to be viewed when the lid is open. Given you have three compartments on the underside of the lid it would be cool to make three storage bays, like three smaller wall cabinets, that can be removed from the lid. The individual boxes could have a slide on perspex lid (like an old pencil box) and having them removable would make access much easier than if it were permanently attached to the lid.

[denno020]

I think my only reservation about using perspex/acrylic for a lid is the fact I've not worked with it before, so I'd probably end up with really messy edges where I've made cuts.. But I guess you've gotta start somewhere don't you!

As the lid is only just deep enough for the width of a matchbox car, if I were to go with the lid storage idea, I'd probably just make some 'walls and floors', therefore making it permanently attached.. This would also make sure he cleans up his cars (well hopefully).

But for the perspex, I think if I add a channels for them to slide in, separated into 3 sections, that could work well.

I can just image his face lighting up when he opens it for the first time, to see all these places for his cars to go (as well as a few new cars taking up a few of those spots of course)

[doug3030]

I think my only reservation about using perspex/acrylic for a lid is the fact I've not worked with it before, so I'd probably end up with really messy edges where I've made cuts.. But I guess you've gotta start somewhere don't you!

You can get special tablesaw blades for cutting perspex but it will cut ok with a decent timber blade. the edges clean up ok with a flame and a bit of practice.

DOug

[denno020]

My biggest worry is pushing the perspex into the blade a bit too hard/fast, and causing a big crack.. Obviously the course of action there is to take my time! lol.

I really do think this is the best solution though.. Having them behind a perspex sheet..

Thanks for the advice guys, pushed me to try something new.. At least I've got a couple of months to stuff it up, and then fix it :).

[Sir Stinkalot]

I like the idea of the perspex as it would be good to see the cars on display when the lid is open ..... also a little safer than glass :U.

I am sure that you could get it cut to size at a minimal additional cost, most likely to be cheaper than buying a dedicated blade. Perhaps you could get a few off cuts to test out first. If you are finding you are getting a poor edge it would be possible to create a rebate to house the rough edge of the perspex and then separate the lid of the display cabinet as you would for a standard box construction and use some hinges or a piano hinge.

If the display boxes are going to be permanently fixed to the box it may be easier to have a hinged display cabinet front rather than trying to slide the perspex out of a rebate.

I am looking forward to seeing the results.

[denno020]

So you're thinking one large piece of perspex, that would hinge down after the lid is opened.. That would obviously take less work on my part.. And that means less to mess up lol, so that may very well be a solution!

As for getting it cut, I've sent a couple of emails to places, but I'm not sure if they do small jobs like this.. Guess I'll find out when they get back to me.

As much as I love the chain that stops the lid from opening too far, I think it will have to come out, in favour of something that won't get in the way of the perspex lid..
I saw a youtube video the other day, where a guy used the things I recon I need, but searching the Bunnings website for the terms he referred to them as didn't turn up any results..
Here's the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4yMa3LQKQ0. He refers to them as lid support and as hinge support..

Is this the kind of thing that would be able to replace the chain? Therefore stopping the lid from opening too far?

Thanks,
Luke

[ian]

Matchbox cars are made of steel?
or at least some feromagnetic alloy?

if so you could use mid sized rare earth magnets to hold the cars in the lid "garage"

[Chief Tiff]

What you're after are a pair of soft closing stays, Bunnings sell them (http://www.bunnings.com.au/prestige-220mm-right-hand-soft-close-lid-stay_p4021030). They are very good and the tension is adjustable. I built an outdoor furniture cushion storage chest with a panelled lid made from jarrah; it must weigh around 5kg or so but these hold the lid up happily and a nudge lets it drop nice and gentle. They're not hinges though; they are stays. Oh, unfortunately they are L & R handed... and $42. EACH!

As for the cars they are die-cast zinc alloy and plastic, only steel is in the wire axles and the two rivets that stick the body onto the base so Ian's idea won't work.

[Sir Stinkalot]

So you're thinking one large piece of perspex, that would hinge down after the lid is opened.

Personally I would still be looking at three smaller individual display boxes, with a hinged Perspex lid that could be removed from the toy box lid.

The problem I see with having the display box permanently attached is that the toy box lid would need to be fixed open at a touch over 90 degrees so that the cars don't fall out when the Perspex lid is open (ie they sit towards the back of the compartment to avoid them all falling out into the toy box). Depending on the age/size of the child it may be difficult it may be necessary to reach over the toy box to open the display, and with one large hinged display box lid it may get difficult. It would also be a problem if somebody knocks the main lid closed while the Perspex display is open.

The three smaller display boxes would be easier to make, can be recessed deeper in the box lid (as they go between the bracing), and would make opening easier. If the were removable it would be possible to take the display cases into another room for play, or even load one up with the best cars to take to a friends house.

If you Google Matchbox display case I am sure there will be something already made in plastic which will give you all the information you need to make a better one fit for purpose. I know as a kid I had one shaped like a steering wheel which had individual compartments, Perspex front and a hinged lid with a catch.

It might also be worth checking EBay for the Perspex. I was looking for some once and it's possible to find smaller pieces precut (provided the sizes suit your project).

[Wrongwayfirst]

What about a hidden tray in the lid compartments the same style as the wall display without Perspex. So open lid of toy box and you will see no cars only the underside of the car tray, undo the catch and the inner lid swings down to reveal the cars. So piano hinge across the hinge side of the lid. This way to play with normal toys just lift the lid as usual (cars may clunk a little as the lid lifts) but this is the only indication of something hidden. Then slide a timber catch to let the toy tray rest onto the open box area.
cheers

[denno020]

Thanks for the replies guys, this is great stuff.

As for those soft closing stays, ouch! $42 is quite steep.. However thinking about it, and the possible weight that will be added to the lid if it's full of cars and the extra structure I add to hold the cars, they might be required.. I'm assuming they'd stop the lid from slamming down?

The lid, as it opens now, rests back at just over 90 degrees (you can see in the image below), so that would naturally hold the cars in place, if I added 'shelving' for the cars at 90 degrees to the lid..

Also, you can see in the photos there are grooves already cut into the panels, which are perfectly spaces for the height for a matchbox car, so I was just going to get some 3mm ply, and glue that into those slots..
I do understand what you're saying about the advantage of it being removable, but that means I would have to build a backing, which would mean the cars wouldn't be flush in line with the bottom of the lid lining..
Here's a couple of photos illustrating (really roughly) how I would go about getting it done:
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You can see that I'm holding the green car in the correct angle it would be, after I add the shelving to hold the cars, and in the photo on the left, that shows how flush it lines up with the base of the lid lining. So adding a 3mm piece of perspex over that would only increase the depth of the lid by that 3mm amount..

As for the secret compartment, I do like that idea, and that's the initial thought I had when someone suggested using the lid to store them in one of the first replies.. I'll see what the price of the perspex is, and if it seems a bit too much, then I will go with a single sheet of 3mm ply as a cover to 'hide' the cars when closed.
And also, to make sure it's not just a piece of wood covering the cars, I'll draw a racetrack on the top, so that when the chest lid is open, and the cars are on show (the hidden compartment is open), there will be a racetrack sitting on top of the chest.. I'm sure my nephew would like that.

Oh, and he's 5 and a half, so he's big enough to reach over the chest to grab the cars.

To be honest, I'm getting a little jealous that he'll have this lol.. I might have to build myself something too (such a big kid, I know)..

Thanks for the feedback so far!
Luke

[Opelblues2]

this is at the other end of the thinking "or the bottom" why not build a riser for the bottom of the toy box, that way your not changing the structure of the box and not adding more indirect weight to the lid. Make this a kicker board with a hidden draw inside, you will be able to make it deeper with smaller trays on the inside. ad small push in dowels to the outer edge of the small trays and presto you may had a hi-rise car park. with the added depth to the draw a car transporter can be placed in there.


my two bob worth

[denno020]

Storing underneath would be a neat idea.. However then it relies on my nephew keeping the floor in front of the chest clear so that he can slide the drawer out, which is very unlikely haha..
Plus, finishing it so that the colour matches would be quite difficult I'd imagine.. (this is a store bought chest, so I don't know the wood used to make it - and I'm in no way experienced enough with wood able to guess at what type was used).

Thanks for the suggestion though,
Luke

[Chief Tiff]

Yes, those stays stop the lid from slamming down. Once I'd got them set up you could really slap the lid down hard but it would still gracefully come down at a measured pace. As I said the lid weighs about 5kg, it would easily break fingers if it fell down without them. At the time of the build my daughter was only about 7 so the stays were essential. They cost me $70, which was $20 MORE than I paid for the actual timber! Still very much worth it though.

[denno020]

Well at least I have a month and a half or so to save up and get them.. I really think they'll be required, just to keep Blake from accidentally smashing his fingers.. Plus, it will remove the chain from being in the way of the perspex cover.

Thanks everyone for the feedback and suggestions.

I'll post back in a few weeks with some progress photos, or just a completed photo if I get too carried away building and forget to stop and take progress snaps.

Luke

[Pac man]

For your nephews safety please consider the stays. Google toy box head and neck injuries if you need convincing.
its also a good idea to think about how he may get out if he emptied out the box and climbed in it with a heavy lid.

[denno020]

Ok guys, I need some more advice please!

I've got the acrylic lid cut to size, as you can see in the images, it spans from one edge of the lid to the other. This edge sits just inside the 'walls' of the chest.

Now my problem will be when it comes to attaching the soft close lid stays.. I'm assuming that the edge of the lid that I'm about to cover with the acrylic lid is where I need to attach the bracket..

Am I going to have to cut the corners off of the acrylic lid? Have to remember that this lid will hinge down, so I can just cut out the section so that 'foot' of the bracket can screw to the lid..
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Thanks,
Luke

[Chief Tiff]

Am I going to have to cut the corners off of the acrylic lid? Have to remember that this lid will hinge down, so I can just cut out the section so that 'foot' of the bracket can screw to the lid..

Unfortunately the problem is going to be the arms of the stays, yes cutting out a rectangle to fit the foot is fine but the perspex will move in an arc as it opens and will require the rectangular cut out to become much longer. It can be done but just might look a bit messier. An alternative would be to insert the lid within the swing of the stay arms.

[denno020]

Hey guys,

I have a follow up question, so I thought while I asked that, it would be nice to provide a progress photo.

First, the question: With the soft close lid stays, has anyone used them? I need to know if the lid will open to a greater than 90 degree angle. The packaging says 70-105 degrees, but I'm not sure how I'm supposed to read that.. Does that mean the lid can open up to 105 degrees from when it is closed?

Maybe a picture will help..

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Is that the angle that the packaging is referring to?

As for a progress image, I have so far cut all the shelving to length, and painted them in a brown, which no where near matched the lid colour, but I guess I was never going to get it perfect when trying to colour match mdf..
Anyway, this morning I glued the shelving into place, here it is drying, with scrap pieces used as spacers so the shelving didn't fall over whilst drying:

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Not much of an update really, but an update none the less :).

I'm heading into Bunnings tomorrow, so hopefully someone reads this and can get back to me before then, as they're rather expensive to take a gamble on!

Thanks,
Denno

[Chief Tiff]

As I stated in a previous post I have used these stays which is why I recommended them to you originally. You are correct about the angle, from closed you can get a 105° opening as per your sketch, you just have to line them up pretty carefully. I used a couple of pieces of scrap to test the final fitting position because my box lid overhung the frame by about an inch in all directions meaning that if the lid went beyond 90° it would perform an act of violent fornication on the hinges!:oo:

[denno020]

Fantastic, thanks Chief!

$84 was going to be a very expensive gamble not knowing if they would work exactly how I need them to, but glad to know they will.

Do you happen to have any photos of your lid stays in operation, with the lid opened as far as it can?

Thanks,
Luke

[Chief Tiff]

Unfortunately not, I'm at work with no access to my pictures until I get home again on the 10th of next month. I have one on my phone but no way to transfer it to my tablet.

[denno020]

Ahk no worries mate, thanks anyway.

[denno020]

So Christmas is a couple of days away, and I've now finished the present for my nephew.

I've attached an image so you can all see what I came up with.

I'm very happy with it personally, despite how much it cost me in the end (I'm afraid to tally up the numbers..)

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You can see the placement of the soft close lid stays.. Not exactly the best position, in fact probably the worst.. But for me to be able to place it where it would be beneficial, I would have had to cut the trim around the lid, but I was getting pretty frustrated, so I placed them there, and have decided that Blake is old enough that I can tell him not to be silly with it, and he won't.

Holding the perspex up are some earth magnets, which as you may know, are darn strong. To allow Blake to pull down the perspex, I added a leather strap (fancy way of me saying I cut up a dog collar) as a handle, so that he has leverage and doesn't have to use his fingertips.

The last notable thing would be how I attached the perspex to the piano hinge.. I wanted to drill and mount with nuts and bolts, but quite frankly, I was too scared that I would split the plastic, being so close to the edge. So I used heavy duty double sided tape.. I know it doesn't look fantastic, but it gets the job done.

So yeah, this is it. Feel free to let me know what you think.

Thanks to everyone for your help along the way.

[Christos]

I like what you have done it has potential for quite a number of cars. I do have some concern about the double sided tape but I have known mirrors being hung with this stuff. Maybe in the future you could use a U bracket or flat aluminum to add mechanical fastening if this looks like coming apart.

[Handyjack]

:2tsup:
Looks great. I think the perspex would be strong enough to be drilled for bolts and nuts.
My concern, and I am not in a position to test, is that when opening the perspex that the magnets hold it shut and the lid closes instead.

I think you are on a winner. :2tsup:

[denno020]

My concern, and I am not in a position to test, is that when opening the perspex that the magnets hold it shut and the lid closes instead.


I know exactly what you mean, and that's the very reason that I only put one strap on there. If I had put two, then that just encourages both of them to be pulled to separate the metal from the magnet, which just results in the chest lid being pulled down. With one, I can show Blake that one hand holds the chest lid, whilst the other pulls on the strap, so hopefully that problem doesn't come up :).