Plumbers cost for small job!

[juliussee]

Plumbers cost for small job!


<HR style="COLOR: #d1d1e1" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->Hi People,


I had a small job done today which basically had to be done.
I am replacing my stormwater drainage system myself and only got the plumber to install a new plastic pipe from my front fenceline to the gutter of the street, which is about 3 metres.

The cost to me for this service is $1642.30.
I knew plumbers costs were high but was a bit shocked at this bill.
Do they all charge the use of their equipment separately?

Here is the breakdown:

Run stormwater line to street to council regulations.
Council to restore concrete.

Service call $90.00
Labour 6 hours $360.00
Wacker $48.00 (he put a little bit of bitumen in 1/2 sqm)
Concrete saw $150.00 !! (2 short cuts across the footpath)
Materials $208.00 (5kg sand/cement, 3.0m 100mm pvc, 1/2 sqm bitumen
Small Kanga $50.00
Council Fee $90.00
Council Restore $497.00

Sub Total $1493.00
GST $149.30

Total $1642.30


When the plumber originally came out (different worker) to inspect my stromwater he used a few pieces of equipment too, which would have been about an extra $450 for less than 1 hours use, but I am selling him something cheap so he wanted to keep me happy.

Does this look right to those with more experience with plumbers?
I think I'm going to check with the council how much they really charge.
Before I left for work, I saw the plumber digging under the path instead of cutting it, it would have saved me most of the bill to not cut the path, so I'm thinking he may have cut the path to make money by charging me for use of the equipment.

Thanks

Adrian

[juliussee]

Damn I'm steaming now, so I just rang the mofo to tell him what I think of his bill.

Straight away he went all soft and gave in and said he'll look it over and fix it up.

His excuse wats that he just used the rates straight out of the book.
I bet he tries to rip everyone off like that.


Adrian

[Dan_574]

My god that seems high, 6 hours is load of rubbish for running 3m of stormwater. Tell him to have a real good look at it. $208 in materials, rubbish. What is the $497 for council restore, never heard of it. What council fee if he's just replacing the stormwater. Did he have to hire all those tools or did he have them already.

[ozwinner]

6M of 100mm storm water would cost about $30 to purchase.
Sand cement, he prolly pinched it from some kind hearted brickie.:)
1/2 sqM biitch-u-men, prolly got it off his mate who works on the council.

I think I need to be a plumber.

Al :p

[MICKYG]

I dont think I would be paying that and if you have a problem get in touch with your dept of fair trading or similar goverment dept. The account seems to be very excessive for what you describe,

Regards Mike. :( :( :( :(

[Hybrid]

Since when does any kind of tradesman charge separetely for the use of tools?

Silly question: did you get a quote first?

[grinner]

Does seem a bit steep. I had all of my sewer replaced back to the main sewer and it was a few thousand dollars(probalby 40 m of trenching, over 6 foot deep at the connection to the main sewer). I was paying about $70 /hr for the plumber and $70 /hr for the use of his mini excavator, and it took two long days.

[juliussee]

Hi Guys,

2 cuts were made through the footpath, probably because there were tree roots under the path so he couldn't just dig under the path to place the pipe. So after the cuts were made, the slab to be removed would have been about 900mm x 500mm. So he tries to charge me $50 for the use of a Kanga to break this up !!!!
I told him a couple of smacks with a sledge hammer would have done it, only 75mm thick with no reo. $150 for the use of a concrete saw !!!!
The only other bit of work would have been to cut the kerb, place the pipe in and then patch it up with sand + cement.

I'm waiting to see what he comes back with.
I'll make sure he's not profiting with the council fees either.
$497 + gst to patch a 900mm x 500mm slab !!! I'll do it myself if they let me.


Adrian

[ian]

You may want to be discrete when you enquire of Council.
If I read my Council's web site correctly, just obtaining the Council permit would cost $300! The footpath restoration fee would be additional to this. However, if the work you're doing on the property is covered by a DA then you probably already have a permit and have paid the footpath restoration fee.
If the plumber did actually get a permit, you should check with Council whether GST applies.

As to the charge for using tools — what the plumber does will to some extent be driven by what he thinks he can get away with and for the rest by how his accountant has told him to treat the expense.
Some items will be his "tools of trade" – like his gas torch (needed on most jobs) – others will only be needed ocassionally. For these he might buy the tool outright and charge the first customer the full cost, from then on whenever he uses the tool it will be for free until he needs to replace it when the unlucky sod he's doing the job for at the time will be billed for a new tool. Alternatively, he may buy the tool but charge its use on the basis that he hired the tool from Kennards for a day (your $150 would appear to be in this category). Another option is he buys the tool and covers its cost within his business overhead — in effect every job pays a little towards the cost of buying and maintaining all the tools, however, if he was doing it this way, his rate of $60/hr would translate to something less than $20 in wages and something more than $40 in overhead. Lastly he might just pop off to Kennards to get the tool he needs, in which case I would have expected him to also charge you for the time required to pick the tool up from Kennards and return afterwards.

ian

PS I'm not trying to defend what you were charged

[ndru]

Have just done about 15m of stormwater myself, including 3m under the council pavement.

Council reinstate looks way too high. Reinstate of pavement is usually very easy and cheap. By comparison, my council quoted $160 to cut concrete pavement + curb AND reinstate.

Concrete saw price looks about right for a day's rental. I used one and it made the pavement break-up a LOT easier.

You definitely got taken on the materials. That PVC pipe price is a laughable. Even Bunnings is cheaper!

I guess it depends on the condition of the soil (eg roots, clay, rock), but 6hours of work does seem a lot for only 3m.

[JDarvall]

yeh, you've been taken. Sorry to say. I've had my fair share of these with tradesman. I just don't hire them anymore for anything. Do it all myself. Even if it means I loose a lot of time in gaining information on how to do it right.

I can understand the temptation to play on those out of the trade, but sometimes they definetly go too far. Car mechanics...as well.....same sort of thing. Of course not all are like that, but I reakon a great deal of them are like this....to easy for them to be.

Why was a Kanga needed for 3 metres ? Could have done it with a pick and shovel easy enough I would think....The pipe wasn't set that deep was it ?

[Pulpo]

Hmm expensive.

Stormwater pipe 90mm $18 6metre length.

Concrete, very cheap, 20kg bag $6

Bitumen no idea just always used concrete if needs be.

Concrete saw days hire about $130 [something needed for straight edges].

Council permission, never bothered, always replaced so no issues.

I have only help mates etc.

6 hours seems excessive check with neighbours whether he actually stuck around for the entire time.

Check he hired the equipment

Finally just remember that only licenced plumbers can do plumbing work, it takes 4 years to be a plumber, its extremely difficult, complicated, and technical, you must be trained for 4 years before you can attempt such tasks, the government have made it illegal to attempt this work unless licenced for they know what's best.

Pulpo

[Jacksin]

Irregardless of what price he comes back with, I would blow the whistle on this character. The Office of Fair Trading would love to hear about this as would the Master plumbers Assoc; if you have one over there.

Are all his accounts done in this fashion? are his customers expected to just pay-up and the lucky ones who question his charges get a reduction?
Jack ;)

[juliussee]

Hi guys,

He called me back at 7:30 this morning and said he'd take off the $50 for the Kanga and take off $100 from the concrete saw charge. So that's $150 off just for asking. The $50 charge for the kanga to break up a 500mm x 900mm 75mm thich slab really got to me!!! There is no way of really proving that work actually took place throughout the 6 hours of labour charge, what can you do....

I'm still checking the council restore footpath fee is right. Not sure if he should be adding gst to it though.

Regards

Adrian

[JamesD]

Is he listed with the Master Plumbers Association. If so, you can take some recourse with them and they will put him in his box. If he isn't however, as I learned (the hard way :( ), if you didn't get a quote beforehand, your stuffed.

I got about 30% off my bill in the end by continually asking him to justify his invoice costs and that I was going to get comparitive quotes from other plumbers. Eventually their greed and nonsense starts to buckle them.

Conversely, you can just do what my brother did, who got a bill way more extortionate than yours, and that is get a few quotes from other people and pay the top one. Still came in over $1800 cheaper. Told the criminal, I mean plumber, to like it or sue - ... he liked it.

[julianx]

Hmm expensive.

Stormwater pipe 90mm $18 6metre length.


It was 100mm pvc which is considerably more expensive than 90, about $60 last time I bought any.
probably an hour of the 6 hours would have been picking up materials and equipment, maybe even longer.
The thing I'd be checking is the council costs they sound a bit steep

[BrisBen]

Adrian

Another thing you need to consider when dealing with plumbers is that some think the only time the everyday Joe calls them, is when they are either literally or figuratively knee deep in *****. Some maintenance/emergency plumbers labour under the illusion that they can charge whatever they like/or can get away with; based on their argument of "Mate, if you didn't get it done when I did it you would have had real problems...flooding...raw sewerage..."

Offer him, in writing, a figure for payment you feel is fair, explaining those issues you feel are not necessary and why - eg hire of whacker, kanga etc.

Would you reduce the price of anything you did just because someone asked you or because they presented an argument that couldn't be rebutted?

[jaws]

When getting tradesmen to look at jobs you need to do two things, try to get recomended trades from others that have had good experiences and/or get detailed quotes where practical (not all jobs are easy and obvious to quote). Whilst not defending your plumbers price you don't just pay for what he does you also pay for what he knows. That applies to all contractors,mechanics lawyers etc. There are good people out there you just have to find and promote them and hopefully the sharks will find it harder to operate.
Oh and by the way I am a Builder.
Cheers,
John

[juliussee]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I shouldn't really complain too much, the job is done. I have never needed the services of a plumber before so don't have any references. I have worked in construction for about 6 years so basically know every aspect of building. Next time I'll spend a bit more time before I hire a plumber.

I have always got quotes for other work I have had done. At the moment I don't have time to go round chasing quotes, and this was a relatively small job. My time now is worth alot more financially than it used to be, so the savings I could have had if I chased up cheaper quotes for this particular job is really not worth my time.


Regards

Adrian

[Dan_574]

keep us updated with the final price