Asian Geared Head Lathes - Spindle Bearing Lubrication

[rickw72]

I'm in the process of putting back together a Mach Turn 325 by 1000 that I purchased as for parts / not working.

Something that occurred to me which might be useful for other owners of geared head Asian Lathes. The spindle bearings are supplied by oil splashed up into a gutter that runs around the inner perimeter of the headstock casting, this leads to two holes that allow this oil to then run down into the bearings.

I got a standard pipe cleaner, folded it in half and then in half again, I then held it halfway along and folded the free ends down to make a "T". I then put the leg of the T down the bearing oil hole, with the cross of the T lying in the gutter. I think this could help improve bearing life significantly for very little effort.

I used to own an old English Edgewick lathe that had a very similar oiling arrangement, it appeared to have had pipe cleaners shoved down all these gutter oil holes from new. I did a minor refurb on this lathe to address some wear and tear, there were however no issues with the spindle bearings, the amount of crud and metal shavings that the pipe cleaners had prevented from ultimately going through the spindle bearings and other bearings was significant.

As a side note, Okuma seems to have concluded that using gearbox oil for spindle bearing lubrication was fraught with problems. A number of their lathes had spindle bearing lubrication completely separated from the gearbox.

[simonl]

Hi Rick,

How does shoving a pipe cleaner down the hole fix any potential issues? I'm lost. I replaced my lathe spindle bearings (Chinese 12x36 lathe) and out of interest checked the oil supply to the bearings on even the slowest speed setting while the labrinth seals were off and oil still out over the bearings anyway. I doubt they would ever be starved of lubrication. Also, gear oil is no good for these lathes, hydraulic oil is the go. Hydraulic oil has no (or little) detergent and so any particles such as swarf etc will not be carried or suspended in the oil and should just fall straight to the bottom of the head and cause no further problems. As an insurance measure I also installed a couple of magnets below the labrinth seals (inside the head) of the bearings in an effort to capture any wayward swarf that got its way through the labrinth seal next to the chuck.

Cheers,

Simon

[pipeclay]

The amount of metal particles that come off the bearings or gears in the head may not really cause a problem to the life of the bearings as they are being lubricated, but to take the extra precaution of adding a secondary type filter/restrictor to reduce the ingress of these cant really hurt as long as what ever you use does not restrict the supply.

I my self don't use anything.

I think over time you would be surprised by the amount of small particles of metal that will collect in the lube channels on these machines.

Yes the hydraulic oil will not hold the particles as such but at the speeds the headstock does they will just be in the oil because they wont get a chance to settle until the lathe has been off for some time.

To check place a Perspex cover plate over the headstock and check.

[simonl]

The amount of metal particles that come off the bearings or gears in the head may not really cause a problem to the life of the bearings as they are being lubricated, but to take the extra precaution of adding a secondary type filter/restrictor to reduce the ingress of these cant really hurt as long as what ever you use does not restrict the supply.

I my self don't use anything.

I think over time you would be surprised by the amount of small particles of metal that will collect in the lube channels on these machines.

Yes the hydraulic oil will not hold the particles as such but at the speeds the headstock does they will just be in the oil because they wont get a chance to settle until the lathe has been off for some time.

To check place a Perspex cover plate over the headstock and check.

Fair point PC. I have had magnets at the base of these spindle bearing oil drain points for a couple of years now. I'll be interested to see how much it has collected in that time. BTW, I also have a couple of magnets in the lid just above these holes in an effort to prevent them going in the hole too. I figured this was the safest way to "filter" any lubricant for the bearings as it will never cause a restriction.

Simon

[Steamwhisperer]

Hi Simon
Rick is using them more as a filter than delivery system as pipeclay says.
The trimmings at work do three things
They wick, syphon and filter
A plug trimming does an extra by regulating the amount of oil.

Phil

[simonl]

I see. :D

[Grahame Collins]

When I first got my Steelmaster 12 x 36 in 2007 one of my first acts was to pull the lid off and drain the Tar(oil) out of it.Included with the new machine was a headstock gearbox filled with free swarf and casting sand.

The box was cleaned and flushing oil was used and refilled with Castrol Hyspin.

In doing so, I found that this machine employs splash lubrication to throw the oil onto the underside of the lid where it drips into a channel.This channel delivers lube by drilled holes to the spindle and outboard bearings.

Inspection of the holes revealed they were partially blocked with lumps of swarf which I managed to remove with some wire.I have seen three similar constructed lathes with these freebies included in my maintenance duties in the school workshops.

I left a very strong magnet in the base of my gearbox.



Its probably a good time to open it up again.

Grahame

[rickw72]

Rick is using them more as a filter than delivery system as pipeclay says.
The trimmings at work do three things
They wick, syphon and filter

Yes! Sorry if I wasn't clear on that. Whilst the strong magnets are a good idea, not everything that might be in the gearbox is ferrous: casting sand and grit, paint, pieces of bronze.

I'm planning to run it for a bit and then do an oil change. The oil that is currently in it is very heavy, presumably to make the gearbox run quieter than it would naturally. Possibly not a bad thing for a running in period anyway.

Where did people locate the magnets in the gearbox?

[simonl]

Rick is using them more as a filter than delivery system as pipeclay says.
The trimmings at work do three things
They wick, syphon and filter

Yes! Sorry if I wasn't clear on that. Whilst the strong magnets are a good idea, not everything that might be in the gearbox is ferrous: casting sand and grit, paint, pieces of bronze.

I'm planning to run it for a bit and then do an oil change. The oil that is currently in it is very heavy, presumably to make the gearbox run quieter than it would naturally. Possibly not a bad thing for a running in period anyway.

Where did people locate the magnets in the gearbox?

From memory, I got one sitting on the floor, just under the front spindle bearing and one in the lid just above where the drain hole is for the front spindle. My headstock was full of casting sand and grit, it chewed out the cheap Chinese "precision" spindle bearings in no time. I totally stripped the head casting, jet washed and then painted the inside with POR15. It's been about 3 years since I did that. It's got me curious as to how it now looks. I may take the lid off and have a captain cook.

Simon

[simonl]

Just had a look inside the headstock. All looks reasonable OK. A small amount of metal swarf has accumulated in the bottom and some sitting in the lip at the top. You can't see the magnet on the floor unless I empty the oil but the one in the lid just sticks there of it's own accord. I remember thinking I would screw it into the lid and then thought better of it. If the screw ever worked loose and fell into a gear it would not be pretty.

I tried picking up some of the swarf in the lip at the top but it turns out to be non magnetic. I'm thinking your pipe cleaner idea is not so bad after all!

Interestingly, the rear spindle bearing does not have a lubrication drain hole from the top. Not sure if it's meant to be that way or it's been an oversight. The rear bearing is not overly critical since it will still get direct splash lubrication whereas the front bearing cannot as it has a large gear hard up against the side preventing this.

Cheers,

Simon

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[jatt]

Ricks setup reminds me a bit of the wick setup the industrial sewing machines in the shop employ.

Sewing machine oil is pretty "thin" of course, so wicks quite easily.