Tractors ?

[auscab]

Im starting from scratch learning about tractors . Ive been looking at a few at a dealers yard . Some of the types I like the look of have been traded in with the Hours on the dial for these all around 3000 to 3500 .
Is that just a coincidence , or is that amount the recommended time you get rid of a tractor and upgrade ?

Rob

[Farmer Geoff]

A quality brand tractor that has been well cared for should be in its prime at 3000 hours. A cheaper brand could be getting pretty tired. A lot of people change tractors because they want something bigger or smaller or with different features so their old tractor could be a good buy. But there are lots of tractors which are not well cared for. Driven by mechanically unsympathetic people who don't look after machinery very well. As a guide, a car might take 2000 hours to reach 100 thousand km. But a lot of tractor hour meters break down and hours showing would be a minimum of hours actually running. A lot of hour meters show hours at a certain number of rpm, eg 2000. So a tractor used for 6000 hours at low revs might only show 3000 hours.

[gordo 350]

Personally I would steer away from less than 10 years old and made in (insert sub continent country here). Some contractors buy these yellow,blue or green tractors and run them till the warranty runs out. Parts are non existent and expensive. I run 15 to 20 yr old Massey Ferguson's coz parts are available and I love the sound of a three cylinder diesel 😊

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[auscab]

Thanks Geoff. In their prime at 3000 , that's good
I did see a Massey Ferguson 135 , probably from the early 1970s with a guess, and it only had 150 hrs on the dial , that was at a certain revs , but it must have been broken as well ? or gone round once . it looked extremely used and weather beaten .
Ive been looking at Fords . Massey Ferguson and John Deer . From 40 Hp to 65.
I will have to try and find out if there is such a thing as people in the know who can look at what Im thinking of buying maybe . That's probably good if was buying near the property it will live on say off another farm ? it could be given a run ? Not so sure what happens if its off a dealer though . Cant really give it a run when its in the city in a yard . All a guy can do there is listen to it run and look at the oil ? Is that right ?

Rob

[Bedford]

What do you want to do with the tractor?

[auscab]

We are selling up from the city and buying the Farm, 134 acres in sth Gippsland .
We have a plan to build some sheds , a workshop for woodwork, which is how I make a living, and farm work . A stable for a few horses , some paddocks to keep them in and rotate them . That takes up about 20 acres with the house yard. the rest is either bush or pasture that needs reviving and maintaining .
Im totally new to the idea of raising beef , apart from asking my Father in law what was going on when we visited over the last 25 years. He has passed on, ten years ago .
Its a small place compared to big farms . At the moment I just want to stop the pasture going backwards in condition , I would like to reverse that . And when we take possession we will collect some money from the agistment deal which is set up at the moment and watch and learn a bit from the cows that are grazing there now

What I need to do with a tractor is slash , dig plenty of post holes for fencing,smooth lumpy cow trodden surfaces.

Then when I know a bit more , plow, rip or hoe for some tree planting . cut hay and bail hay. I will have to use contractors for large plowing and re sowing or spraying , I am told.
But with a reasonable tractor and some second hand plows, rakes and bailer , Id like to see what I can do myself in smaller bites .If that's possible .

There is a large bracken fern build up in the two higher paddocks surrounded in Yellow.

I need to get rid of the Scottish Thistle in the two lower more fertile and moist lower paddocks in black at the bottom. when these are good we want to graze there and also cut hay . the condition of the ground down there is almost impossible to drive over in a car because the cows have stomped it all up when it was wet and its lumpy . it needs smoothing out .

The top paddock in Red needs sheds built in the black hatched section and dividing up for horse paddocks in purple.

A local friend told me to go bigger in size than the Ford 3000 I was telling him about that I had seen . He said you may as well go bigger because you will want bigger than that after you get used to it . so I started looking at 50 to 65 Hp models like I was talking of before.

What do you think would be a good size for doing this sort of work ? with cutting hay and bailing done with $2000 to $2500 second hand bailer and a similar vintage rake and cutter ? An older Plow , so I could plow and sow smaller sections of crops then plow them in to improve the soil condition . Im sort of thinking of doing ten acre sections and getting a feel for it over the years rather than spending thousands on a gamble with 60 acre sections and then getting no rain . That's what happened to an owner there on a roughly 35 acre paddock . The area is in a drought at the moment and the plowing was a waste of money and seed that was put in sprouted ,died off and that was it . bracken city now.

Rob

[KBs PensNmore]

Rob,
What I'd do, is to work out what equipment and size you want to use, and then find out what HP they require to run. Baler might require 50 HP, a 14' combine seeder 40 HP etc. Once you have these details, you can then look for a tractor in the maxpower range that suits your needs. Will try to get some information tomorrow from a farmer friend.
Once you have the property, a decent sales company will deliver it to the farm for you to try, if the property is sandy or hilly you may want to look at power assisted drive, basically a 4wd tractor.
Initially check the oils, major leaks, condition of tyres, (these can run into big bucks unless you can find some second hand), look for similar things as you would a motor vehicle.
In SA we have a farming paper"Stock Journal" that has a classified section that you could pick up farming equipment direct from farmers, there should be a similar type of paper over there.
Kryn

[Bedford]

A lot depends on how much you want to spend.

I would stick with "known" brands around the 50-60 Hp range.

I would try to find one with a front end loader as well.

Also check out that there is a dealer in the area that services the brand you choose.

Most "modernish" tractors will have power steering so make sure you get that as they can be vicious on broken ground etc.

[gordo 350]

I live a similar life at the moment that you have described Rob. Firstly, what a great life. Second, it can be a lot of work. I run two tractors . Ford 4610 which is 60 hp 4wd and has a cabin with a/c . You WILL need this. Slashing and hay production is a messy job. Hay mowers especially throw up a lot of debris. The second tractor is MF 251 also 4wd but has a loader. This you will also need. I struggled for years fencing without one and now that I have it I can't believe how stupid I was not having one. Being a smaller tractor it is the one I jump on all the time . Handy for a multitude of jobs. As for the condition of second hand gear look at clutches,pto wear,looseness in steering assembly. This can give you an indication of real hrs. It also should start easy. Run away from anything that needs aerostart to coax it to life.

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[code4pay]

My father a cow cocky on 110 acres had a smallish zetor tractor any thing large he needed doing he got contractors. Are you doing round bales or small squares? Small squares only need a small tractor. For years he had no tractor at all and did fine, just got contractors to do any hay so it's more than possible to not have one at all. Of course owning a tractor on a small farm is half the fun :).

[auscab]

Rob,
What I'd do, is to work out what equipment and size you want to use, and then find out what HP they require to run. Baler might require 50 HP, a 14' combine seeder 40 HP etc. Once you have these details, you can then look for a tractor in the maxpower range that suits your needs. Will try to get some information tomorrow from a farmer friend.
Once you have the property, a decent sales company will deliver it to the farm for you to try, if the property is sandy or hilly you may want to look at power assisted drive, basically a 4wd tractor.
Initially check the oils, major leaks, condition of tyres, (these can run into big bucks unless you can find some second hand), look for similar things as you would a motor vehicle.
In SA we have a farming paper"Stock Journal" that has a classified section that you could pick up farming equipment direct from farmers, there should be a similar type of paper over there.
Kryn

Thanks Kryn,
I didnt think of HP requirement of an implement , that's something to look into . the land is generally flat with sandy parts up top and boggy down the bottom .
Tyres ? I asked the dealer guy about this , just the back large tyres for a guide and he said about $300 to $400 ea , fitted I think ?

Rob

[auscab]

A lot depends on how much you want to spend.

I would stick with "known" brands around the 50-60 Hp range.

I would try to find one with a front end loader as well.

Also check out that there is a dealer in the area that services the brand you choose.

Most "modernish" tractors will have power steering so make sure you get that as they can be vicious on broken ground etc.

A Front end loader would be nice , it seems to push the price on them ?
And they look like they are in the way to me when not in use . ??
I have a few contacts for contractors in the area , I was thinking of talking to them as well , about what they do as well as mechanic contacts around

Rob

[auscab]

I live a similar life at the moment that you have described Rob. Firstly, what a great life. Second, it can be a lot of work. I run two tractors . Ford 4610 which is 60 hp 4wd and has a cabin with a/c . You WILL need this. Slashing and hay production is a messy job. Hay mowers especially throw up a lot of debris. The second tractor is MF 251 also 4wd but has a loader. This you will also need. I struggled for years fencing without one and now that I have it I can't believe how stupid I was not having one. Being a smaller tractor it is the one I jump on all the time . Handy for a multitude of jobs. As for the condition of second hand gear look at clutches,pto wear,looseness in steering assembly. This can give you an indication of real hrs. It also should start easy. Run away from anything that needs aerostart to coax it to life.

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I cant wait for the life style change from this city life Gordo , It sounds good!
Two tractors is a thought , Ill see about that down the track .

Air conditioning sounds nice too , Ill put up pics of what im looking at so far , my favorite has a cab and air con , It just looks like a big jump from nothing into such a beast . We are moving our gear to the property now and spending almost every weekend there.
The flies and heat and rain that I copped driving and walking about the farm over the last few visits did make me think about a cab , specially those flaming flies , every time id get back in the car there would be 15 get in with me :~

Rob

[auscab]

My father a cow cocky on 110 acres had a smallish zetor tractor any thing large he needed doing he got contractors. Are you doing round bales or small squares? Small squares only need a small tractor. For years he had no tractor at all and did fine, just got contractors to do any hay so it's more than possible to not have one at all. Of course owning a tractor on a small farm is half the fun :).

Thanks code4play, now this is the balancing point of view .
"What I can do and contractors , and money for contractors"
One thing I was speaking about with my Brother in law was the trouble in getting a contractor to get in and do the work some times .
he was trying to get them to do things from a four hour drive away , and he was having trouble with that . I think they had better bigger things to do and the size of his job , small made it difficult to get them at times . It wasn't until he agisted to a larger Farmer who had more clout that things would get done at times.
We may just contract cutting and bailing and stick to that ? Im thinking square bales . were used to dealing with those , paying for it for years with three horses . Bringing them in and stacking is a fair bit of work when the time comes . Ive done that a few times .
I see these new Holland bailers around for sale at roughly $2500 that do the square bails , Ive no idea what goes on inside a bailer , and what work one of these may need to keep it going , ill have to look into that.
Ive watched my FIL get by with minimal tools and equipment on this farm , the place seemed to get by on a few buckets of rusty gear and contractors . That used to amaze me .
The tractor that was sitting in a corner and was totally rusted out has been sold off which is a pity . Looking back on old pictures the other day its amazing how good the place looked back then under his care . Green and lush with half the farm used, with 25 cows and between 10 and 15 calves born each year I think ? and a hay shed stacked full .
Since his sad passing, things have changed and the place has been a bit dry and is in a drought , although its not a severe one I don't think , there is water in that spring filled dam all the time . The paddocks need feeding and water though .

Rob

[auscab]

Here is the sort of thing Ive looked at so far.

The first two the MF 135 and the John Deer are 60s to 70s vintage they have the 3 point linkage and I think one set of hydralics at the back ? pretty sure they are around the 40 to 45 HP

The second two , the Ford and the John Deere are a step up , being later and a bit more powerful 50 and 55 Hp ,3 point linkage and single hydraulics at back . Im not sure and will have to re check if any of these are 4wd

The MF 2225 with the cab and air con is about 65 HP ? and two sets of hydraulics at back and is 4wd

Rob

[Bedford]

The John Deere in the 4th pic is 4x4.

[auscab]

The John Deere in the 4th pic is 4x4.
Can you tell that from the picture ? And how ?

[Bedford]

By the front tyres and drive hubs in the wheel centers.

[Bedford]

Here's an 1140 2 wheel drive.

No differential in the front axle.

368789

[Farmer Geoff]

The MF is 4wd as well judging by wheel size and tyre type.

All other things being equal, the JD 1140 could be a good chice. 55hp with 4wd is as good a pulling tractor as 70hp with 2wd. Plus, most people end up wishing they had a front end loader and 4wd is very handy under that though it is much cheaper to buy a tractor with FEL than to try and find one and add it on later. A tractor with FEL is much easier to sell later on.

The MF is probably similar to the JD but you'd probably want lugged tyres rather than those turf ones which don't grip well.

Unless you expect to need to do a lot of work in cold weather, you might be better off without a cabin. Aircon is essential in summer and it's sometimes costly to keep an old one going well.

You will want to build a good relationship with a local dealer or mobile mechanic so it might pay to find one now and pay for them to check likely options on sale locally. Also keep eye on Weekly Times and local agent websites to see if there are farm clearing sales with handy tractors. A lot of tractors on sale in city without front end loader have been used for slashing or road work and likely driven by employees rather than the owner so may not have been operated lovingly.

It is very satisfying to make own hay but getting set up is expensive on a per bale basis for small areas and hay making can be stressful with patchy success until one is experienced so getting it done by a contractor or neighbour can be worthwhile. But the tractor required for hay will be the same one that will serve you well for all your other plans anyway. .

[gordo 350]

Yeah that jd looks a good set up. The Massey will be ex council tractor or golf course for sure. 3000 hrs and all of them running a slasher.!! As farmer Geoff says a loader is happiness and I rekon 4wd is essential with a loader as once you load up with whatever the back wheels have a tendency to loose traction. As for balers , there is a lot of mystery involved. I've contracted with my new Holland 317 for the last 15 yrs and have had a lot of good luck with it but if it dosent work for any reason you need a talented mechanic who knows them to get you out of trouble! !

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[auscab]

All good points there thanks .

Once air conditioners go in cars they seem to keep going from experience so far. so that would be a pain with a tractor, no air con in one means its just like any other tractor I suppose .

The MF looks to be golf course or council , Its in a yard surrounded by many golf courses in the sand belt area south east of Melbourne.
Slashing is hard on a tractor , I take it .

Good point on the resale with an FEL

I better work out how to get rid of weeds and get the grass growing well first , then pay a contractor and see if I can learn a bit , Ive got to much to to do any way .
I spent a bit of time watching youtube on baler's , I suppose the last thing you'd want when you've grown it and raked it is to find you have to now sort out problems with a second hand bailer that isn't working . And Yeah its a pricey set up ! just looking at second hand I saw a baler $2750, a disc Cutter $3000 I don't know what a rake would cost , and I read about a conditioner , don't know if that's a must either, wouldn't a rake do the same ?

I did like the cab idea but forgetting that,and its tyres and the price, the JD was my next choice followed by the Ford , The ford is a one owner before traded apparently. I just liked the look of the JD though .

[KBs PensNmore]

Hi Rob,
The one in pic 52 is 4wd. As others have stated try to get one with a cab, and FEL, it may cost a bit more, but will certainly be worth the extra.
A FEL is not really in the way as usually the bucket/forks are lifted up out of the way. A cab will be beneficial in winter as well as summer, keeps the rain and sun off you, and no flies. I worked a small 10 acre paddock with a MF 35 hooked up to a rotary hoe for 3 days, no protection came in as filthy as anything each time, the shower water was mud, do you want to upset SWMBO.??? Plus sunburnt!!!
3PL is also a very handy thing to have, as is a carryall, which allow you to take fencing gear with you to repair fences, there will be plenty of that, DAMHIKT. Feeding a few bales to the horses, plus dry feed etc and carrying the odd thing or two.
Post hole diggers, but could do a bit of conta on that, with a local who has one unless you like hard work. Find out if there are others in the area with small holdings like yours and find out who can do what/ or got, invite them over for a BBQ and pick their brains, plus you get to know some of the locals then also, as nowadays it pays to keep in good with them as with a lot of thefts going on, they keep an eye on each others properties, similar to a Neighbourhood Watch. Around here fuel trailers and tanks are a bit of a target, one local lost his full fuel trailer overnight as he was getting ready to sow, the cheeky blighters came back the next night and drained his 1,000l overhead tank!!!
Hope this doesn't put you off :D
Kryn

[auscab]

Thanks Kryn, One good thing , which is why we are moving to this property is Ive been going there for 25 years and its surrounded by SWMBO'S family. Id still better keep on her good with keeping the shower clean , lol.:D
They aren't to close , all within 6 KM of the place though. Not any farmers between them though. So I will need to get in with the people in the know.
Thieves , Its a pity a few more people don't just shoot them in the act, wing them with a shot gun blast or two . if there was a bit more of that , there may be less stealing :).
Coming from the city means I'm in the habit of locking every thing down . I like big dogs as well so that may help ?
I had a new 450 dirt Bike a few years ago , when I'd take it to the farm I was so worried if I had to leave it for a night that it would get taken. I had some heavy chains and locks and still knew they wouldn't do much if someone really wanted it .

The problem with a FEL and a cab on a decent brand and with decent HP is of course the price for second hand starts getting above what I want to pay . That MF is $18 G and then Ive got to buy at least a slasher and a post hole digger for starters .
From what Ive seen , all the good features and FEL starts looking like $25 and higher, $35 to $45 G and it just keeps going from there. I sort of like the idea of what gordo 350 has with two tractors , maybe one like the JD 1140 for good pulling , slashing and the rest and maybe a smaller one with a FEL later , even if its just an older smaller one like a MF 35 or a Kubota ? maybe ??

Rob

[KBs PensNmore]

Hi Rob,
Thanks for reminding me, a farming friend I spoke to last night said Kubota was a good small tractor. A lot of fence posts are now put in by driving rather than using a post hole digger, which would be for strainer posts. A job like that could be farmed out initially, I'm certain that there would be a local farmer with one looking for a bit of side work. Actually for the smaller posts a small auger is used to drill a hole, then the post is driven in. If it's an urgent priority, a small post hole digger could be bought from the big green shed for about $400. Would it be possible to borrow a family members tractor, till you get one, at least it would allow you to get some work done around the place.
Kryn

[auscab]

What am I talking about !! there is a relative only one and a half KM from me who is a farmer with two tractors, I forgot about him .

As for borrowing though , I don't really like doing it , if something is going to go wrong with it, it'll be when Ive borrowed it . If it was an emergency maybe .
Unless, he was asking to borrow my things , which is a possibility because I will have a lot of woodwork machinery and gear that he could use, then I wouldn't mind asking as much.

Rob