Timber ID ? Is it King Billy ?????

[snapper1]

G'day
I bought this timber unseen but advertised as Huon Pine
Now I am certain it is not huon

I got it at a good price so whatever it is I am not complaining
I wet some areas in some photos
its 50mm thick
I have a second bit bought at same time its very different and will post photos of that in a day or 3

Any Ideas ? could it be King Billy ?377090377093377095377096

[nine fingers]

If it smells like Huon Pine, thats what it is , otherwise it Celery Top Pine. Not King Billy. NF.

[MikeJ]

Yeah. It looks like Celery Top Pine to me.

Cheers

[snapper1]

I know you cannot tell from photos but I have some celery top and it seems lighter both in weight and colour and is much softer ( less hard )
also the rot on the ends

If it were to help I can take photos of it beside the celery top I have

[Toymaker Len]

What about the smell? Certainly looks like very old huon pine.

[snapper1]

No ,the distinct huon smell is not there when sanded

If anyone knows of someone on Gold Coast who can identify it I will take it for a drive

[yvan]

No smell no Huon :)

yvan

[snapper1]

I will add a couple more photos of the bark and of some rot on end 377252377253

[snapper1]

Here are photos of the other piece
Same species or different ?

377258377259

[John.G]

Anything to rule out Kauri?

I'd have said the first piece was bull kauri, Agathis robusta, or perhaps Vanikoro kauri , A. macrophylla....but the other piece looks more like NZ kauri (can't recall the species name )

[snapper1]

Thanks I certainly had not looked at that possibility

makes me even more keen to find out for sure

[Ravvin71]

Here's something to consider. Bootle's "Wood in Australia" lists Celery Pine as 1050kg/m3 green and 650kg/m3 dry. Huon is 960kg/m3 green and 520kg/m3 dry and I have never come across any that didn't have that characteristic smell, no matter how old and dry it was.
King Billy is much lighter at 620kg/m3 green and 400kg/m3 dry. That is actually lighter than common old Radiata Pine and it is softer too. Common Victorian radiata is around 3.3 on the Jenka scale and King Billy is only 2. I don't have a listing for the hardness of Huon but Celery Pine is 4.5.
The growth rings in your pics are wider than I would expect to see in a piece of celery or Huon. I think I have a slab of King Billy in the shed so I'll sand a bit back and get a pic for comparison on the weekend.

Greg.

[Durham Lad]

Hi Snapper, I have used Huon for the last 11/12 years including a number of pieces just like yours and my bet is on Huon. Regarding the hardness I have found that Huon varies a great deal, I do Chip Carving and have had some that is very soft and have had other pieces that I have not ben able to get a knife into. Cheers Brian.

[Tim Creeper]

I think I'll just put it my 5 cents. I reckon it's Huon. As soon as I looked at the picks it said "I'm huon!"

[Mobyturns]

Anything to rule out Kauri?

I'd have said the first piece was bull kauri, Agathis robusta, or perhaps Vanikoro kauri , A. macrophylla....but the other piece looks more like NZ kauri (can't recall the species name )

Agathis australis - is NZ Kauri - I know because Aust customs gave me the grill when I came back from NZ with some in 2012 & 2014. Could be NZ Macrocarpa - it has similar properties to the image.

[snapper1]

Thanks to all those who helped with a reply

I have showed them to 2 people with some timber knowledge

and the opinion there is that the smaller piece is in fact Huon , I cannot smell it when sanding however but someone else said he can detect a slight smell

The larger one they both say don't know

I read an article somewhere about huon salvaged from under water has different characteristics

As I mentioned I have sanded it but I wonder if I were to saw it would I smell It.?

One of those blokes said it is definately not kauri

It proberly doesn't help that one is a burl or root ball piece and the other from main part of tree

also worth noting that there is NO sign whatsoever of any birds eye

I am sure they are not celery top but am thinking that the burl one may be huon but the other is either huon or king billy? the softness , and colour / grain pattern have me leaning to being KB.
but am far from certain so any more advice appreciated

[sleepy1963]

The grain in one of those pictures looks like Celery top. If it was Huon pine it would have the distinctive smell. It could be Macrocarpa but i would expect pieces like that to have more splits and cracks if it were macrocarpa. My father a few years back replaced the wooden window frames in his house with aluminium ones and was showing me his pile of firewood and low and behold i picked up a piece of window frame 250mm long sniffed it and it was huon pine i was not happy. I did cart back a Blackwood ring and a few split bits. Last time i used King Billy was in high school and from memory it was quite soft where as Celery top is quite hard. I made an outdoor bench with some and it took ages to sand all the saw marks out from the mill.

[Mobyturns]

The grain in one of those pictures looks like Celery top. If it was Huon pine it would have the distinctive smell. It could be Macrocarpa but i would expect pieces like that to have more splits and cracks if it were macrocarpa. My father a few years back replaced the wooden window frames in his house with aluminium ones and was showing me his pile of firewood and low and behold i picked up a piece of window frame 250mm long sniffed it and it was huon pine i was not happy. I did cart back a Blackwood ring and a few split bits. Last time i used King Billy was in high school and from memory it was quite soft where as Celery top is quite hard. I made an outdoor bench with some and it took ages to sand all the saw marks out from the mill.

I have a fair bit of King Billy purchased as off cuts from another forum member. It is quite soft, light and has its own distinctive smell which is very different to the very unique smell of Huon. King Billy works & turns very well when you understand how to machine it.

Your story about the firewood from home reno's is much the same with older homes and buildings in North Queensland. Quite common to find high quality old growth Northern Silky Oak (NSO) or Red Cedar joinery, architectural fimish mouldings, door jambs etc. I still have some shorts of 8 x 2 " Red Cedar door jamb that came from a QLD Gov't building and very high quality NSO that were tressels for portable tressel tables that came from the old Townsville Hospital site.

[snapper1]

The timber is quiet soft I can mark it with my thumbnail

whereas the celery top I have is much harder and heavier

thats what prompted the initiial question

does anyone have a photo of bark surface on a known bit of King Billy ?
then we could compare it with earlier photo

[Mobyturns]

try

Blackwood, Pine, Burlwood, King Billy, Plantation & Rainforest Timber | Tasmania, Australia (http://www.tasmaniantimbers.com/tas-timbers.html)

Athrotaxis selaginoides (King Billy pine) description (http://www.conifers.org/cu/Athrotaxis_selaginoides.php)