Sourcing wood

[XanderLin]

Hi everyone,

I'm a woodworking student currently working on a batch-product project. For the prototype I used a chunk of pine from Bunnings !00x100 by 2 meters approx.

Without going into too much detail the design involves turning a shape out of the 100x100 x about 300mm.

I've done the prototype and now want to move on to a 'nicer' wood. This is becoming a much bigger problem than I predicted! I went down to Monaro yesterday and bought some excellent wood, but they had nothing for this project (except a perfect piece of Blackwood that was over $600!!) . Today i went to as 'builders' mill and still nothing.

I'm in the Southern Highlands and incredibly no one seems to have anything....I'd be really happy with Karri, even Tas Oak, it's for a toy so I don't need anything spectacular, needs to be ok on a lathe. I hear good things about Anagote so maybe I'll head up there, but i'd rather a reliable source online.

Open to ideas or will pay real money for the right thing! Keep in mind broke student but have genuine interest in my product....

Maybe I should just stick with the Bunning's pine and stain it...everyone who's looked at my prototype has mistaken it for something else...

Thanks

Alex

[smiife]

Hi alex,
Welcome to the forum , have you looked at the market place
here on the w.w.forum, e.bay has some timber sometimes ,
check around canberra i think there is a place in bungadore
Good luck with it , tune your ears in to the sound of a distant
chainsaw:U

[dai sensei]

Any old timber mills left around Bowral, they may be a good source. Otherwise send Phily a PM, he had some spectacular large hunks of blackwood at one stage

[XanderLin]

Thanks for the replies, I will check out the market place but really need a reliable ongoing source. I would potentially buy up a bunch of the right thing.

Bungers has the amazing wood gallery, well worth a visit. As i mentioned I bought a bunch of timber at Monaro Timber yesterday but all a bit 'fine' for this project. I've considered laminating but would much rather work with solid and avoid the dreaded PVA. Gotta keep costs down too.

Bowral / Southern Highlands has the Woodage and All Class Timber, and Ogden for the construction side, but I'm just not finding what I need, should be easy! Shame it's not, bit of a worry really.

Blackwood is probably a bit too fine for this project, but I do love it so any contacts are appreciated!

Alex

[dusteater]

Would you be interested in some WA Sheoak ?

[XanderLin]

Would you be interested in some WA Sheoak ?

For sure, might be a wee bit pricey for delivery? Feel free to PM with info, I'd be happy to have lengths around 1m, dry and around 100x100.

Thanks,

Alex

[nalmo]

If you're looking for dry timber you might find it extremely difficult. Not many mills are prepared to wait many years for the inside to dry properly. The best alternative would be to laminate2 pieces of 100x50 - it is more readily available and will be significantly cheaper.

[turnerted]

I suggest you contact a local Men's shed . The chances are that someone there will have a timber stash and maybe prepared to part with a bit . Also there is a branch of Sydney Wood Turners near
you .Google them for a contact and they may be able to help.
Ted

[Goggomobile]

Alex
I remember having the same problem years ago. This is what I did ... Built some sheds and make one a drying type. I prayed to the Greek God of Timber and they were full in no time. Nothing worse than paying good money for timber.

I keep an eye on the local tree clearers and after storms. Most of the blokes love to throw you as much timber as you need when cutting up before throwing into the truck. Most wood turning clubs have band saws to cut to size.

Also try anyone who slabs for tables. Always plenty of off cuts .. Most are 40-50 mm thick. Laminates is a good option with this since to get your 100mm to. The timber is often dry and reasonably good lookin.

I find mango and champhor in plentiful supply in my part of the world. You will find something similar in your part of the world.

Champhor is great to machine and finish. With large sizes I often wet turn and let dry for awhile. The aroma is awesome.

Randal

[XanderLin]

Thanks for all the replies, been crook over the weekend (whole town is down with the same thing, this year'a flu i guess) but looking at PMs now....

I have some Sapele which I can laminate If I'm desperate....oh and Anagote have some TasOak in my size but JUST over what I wanted to pay...but doable....

I just had my heart set on Karri or Jarrah....but anyway will check the pms...

[XanderLin]

I suggest you contact a local Men's shed . The chances are that someone there will have a timber stash and maybe prepared to part with a bit . Also there is a branch of Sydney Wood Turners near
you .Google them for a contact and they may be able to help.
Ted

Thanks Ted,

Yes we do have a local Mens Shed, I'll say hello...

[XanderLin]

For sure, might be a wee bit pricey for delivery? Feel free to PM with info, I'd be happy to have lengths around 1m, dry and around 100x100.

Thanks,

Alex

Have read your PM and replied but not sure if it sent, let me know....

[Mr Brush]

I'm in the highlands too, and can't believe that The Woodage don't have anything - they sell quite a lot of large section square posts in species like Taun and other similar imported (sustainable) stuff. In the past I've picked up quite a few decent-sized freebies from their scrap bin. Are you sure you spoke to the right person there?

The only other remotely local suppliers I use are Yates just up the freeway at Ingleburn, and Phil Gould in Nowra. Phil actually keeps quite a few species (although I bet he picks out all the fiddleback stuff from a pack for his own use...:rolleyes:) - both keep good quality timber, and know how to store and look after if properly.

[XanderLin]

I'm in the highlands too, and can't believe that The Woodage don't have anything - they sell quite a lot of large section square posts in species like Taun and other similar imported (sustainable) stuff. In the past I've picked up quite a few decent-sized freebies from their scrap bin. Are you sure you spoke to the right person there?

The only other remotely local suppliers I use are Yates just up the freeway at Ingleburn, and Phil Gould in Nowra. Phil actually keeps quite a few species (although I bet he picks out all the fiddleback stuff from a pack for his own use...:rolleyes:) - both keep good quality timber, and know how to store and look after if properly.



The Woodage are moving more and more into custom kitchens / flooring etc, letting the old racks of interesting stuff go I'm afraid....not their fault, there isn't a market or supply for it, and they still treat Sturt students well and have the occasional gem.

Yates don't like anyone opening up their packs, aren't real student-friendly.

If you're talking about the Nowra supplier I think you are, they are also undergoing a big change as new ownership comes in....not good now but they promise to be really good in the near future, and opening up workshop space to new graduates.

Anagote are pretty much the best allrounders we've come across, Monaro are great for special quality wood and service. It's just a shame that these measurements are becoming impossible to get, for companies and families with plenty of money it represents a great longterm investment.

[John.G]

It's just a shame that these measurements are becoming impossible to get, for companies and families with plenty of money it represents a great longterm investment.

Based on my experience I'd actually say that as investments go it's pretty poor. You buy the log, you saw it and throw 60 or so percent of it away, then you hold the resultant timber for years and years for intermittent small sales. It's not at all liquid: you can't necessarily turn it into cash even at a significant discount because it's not in sizes that move in any kind of volume so no-one else wants it.

About the only positive is that provided you've got some length in it you can resaw it back into 25/38/50mm stock when you run short in that.

[Mr Brush]

The Woodage is for sure mainly interested in floorboards, etc., but they do still have some large section stuff - I saw a couple of monster dressed square posts at 200 x 200 section not that long ago. I tend not to buy there any more, only because I'm not impressed with the way they store their timbers.

Yates has been fine for me, and I often pick up stuff from them on the way out of Sydney. You can't just turn up and go rummaging through their stock, but phone them first, tell them what you are after (in your case, size first, and they'd tell you what they have in that dimension), tell them when you'll be there, and they'll have stuff accessible for you to look at. Also my supplier of choice for any veneered board or furniture grade birch ply, etc.

Monaro are also great, but I agree that they might not keep much in those kind of sections. Bit far away for me most of the time unfortunately.

I knew that Phil Gould was letting out some workshop space to spread his costs (that was a few years ago), but haven't heard any more about developments there. In the past his timber stocks were purchased with an eye to his own furniture-making needs, with the remainder of packs being for sale. Had some very nice Huon Pine last time I visited.

Anagote are very hobbyist-friendly (reflected in probably the highest prices), but I've always found it almost impossible to find parking spot in that street. Tend not to bother with them anymore.

[dusteater]

Have read your PM and replied but not sure if it sent, let me know....

I got yours OK but you`ll have to clear some messages on your in box ,it doesn`t accept my PM`s

[XanderLin]

It's a tricky shorterm investment, excellent multigenerational investment, i agree most people don't have the time to reap the benefits, but i guess what i'm saying is it's a shame those in a position to make investments beyond 100-200 years don't do so.... the Packers used to care about Media and News, now they only care about bleeding people dry in huge palaces of pokies.

Those prepared to make a longterm investment in trees will make an absolute fortune in the future. The original 'Mahogany' that, after it's discovery lasted less than 50 years is now utterly priceless....if only a few ingenious fellows had decided to keep a field or two going before they were all wiped out?....

The less there is of anything the more value, Jarrah used to be railsleepers, and , let's face it, goes poo-brown in time so is hardly the perfect timber, but is now a premium hardwood.

I would encourage anyone with land to devote a few acres to growing the beautiful, the unusual, the amazing.....after all, during a drought the trees will survive!

[John.G]

It's a tricky shorterm investment, excellent multigenerational investment, i agree most people don't have the time to reap the benefits, but i guess what i'm saying is it's a shame those in a position to make investments beyond 100-200 years don't do so.... the Packers used to care about Media and News, now they only care about bleeding people dry in huge palaces of pokies.

Those prepared to make a longterm investment in trees will make an absolute fortune in the future. The original 'Mahogany' that, after it's discovery lasted less than 50 years is now utterly priceless....if only a few ingenious fellows had decided to keep a field or two going before they were all wiped out?....

The less there is of anything the more value, Jarrah used to be railsleepers, and , let's face it, goes poo-brown in time so is hardly the perfect timber, but is now a premium hardwood.

I would encourage anyone with land to devote a few acres to growing the beautiful, the unusual, the amazing.....after all, during a drought the trees will survive!


Well actually yeah sorta not quite...

Most hardwoods are best harvested in terms of the size/growth vs overmaturity/decay bell curve at a (very species dependant but rule of thumb) under 100 years of age, and mostly at around 60 years old or so in Australian Species. Tress grow fast when young, then put on girth, but as they girth they also begin to get heart decay.

The thickness of a board has nothing to do with age, thats mostly a processing decision alone - No shortage of trees out there at 60 odd years old that will yield decent square sections. The issue with a shortage on the market is more to do with the cost of kiln drying the material rather then the availability of it. For my DH kilns it takes around 90 days air drying then about 6 days in the kln to get timber from dead greeen to KD. For 100mm sections in the same species in the same kiln we're talking 18 months of air drying followed by around 30 days in the kiln, or perhaps 90 days air drying then 120 days in the kiln... either the way the time between when I buy the log and when I get a return is vastly different, and the electrickery bill to run a kiln aint pretty on them long runs. I probably do more large section KD then most mills and I can tell ya... I dont get the price premium in that stuff to warrant it, the incidence of drying degrade is also exponential to thickness, by rights I should be getting close on 300% more for 100mm sections against 25mm sections.

And in this industry the "less is worth more" pardigim shifts. The reason is that it takes market volume to drive a trend, and trends are what drives sales, and sales are what keeps us in business. A cubic meter of Queensland Maple is worth less today then it was in 1990 when it was readily available, and the above is why. People buy xyz because they've seen it/ heard of it/ their friend has it/ its in better homes and gardens... what they've seen/heard of/ read about is influenced by what the wholesaler pushes to the architects and that is dictated by availability of regular supply to the wholesaler, at the price point most favourable to the wholesalers profit margins.
Yanno how American white oak has been popular the last few years?.... watch that come to a screaming halt with the normalisation of exchange rates between here and the USA. For a while there the exchange rate made it really lucrative as an import.

Then you have to factor in the dumb green factor... only a fool would plant a native species for a plantation, if its an exotic then its far less likely to be protected by act of vote grabbing mismanagement. There are rumblings in some quarters of the green movement to get all native species protected similar to fauna protections currently in place. Really habitat friendly that, but hey its easier to feel good then act smart, and politicians can rationalise anything if theres a few votes in it.

There are exceptions to be sure big leaf mahogany, true purpleheart, the ebonies, teak, to name a few. But for the most part investing into plantations is a long term game for moderate returns, and anyone with the brains to make the $ to do that kind of investment has the brains to find safer and higher returns for far less headache.

[StevoWoodi]

I am afraid this info will not be much use to you for your current project but may help some time further down the track. I have found that tree loppers are surprisingly helpful.

A friend of mine let me know that a work colleague was having a big spotted gum removed and I went around when this was taking place. I thought that I would be treated as a bit of a nuisance by the loppers but it was exactly the opposite. Once I introduced myself they confirmed my preferred diameter and not only cut it to the correct length for my trailer but also used their skid steer loader to put it in the trailer for me. I think they were genuinely happy to see the timber being used for something other than mulch.

I spoke to one of your fellow Sturt students at the Sydney WWW show a couple of weeks ago. Sounds like a great programme.

Wishing you all the best in your endeavours,

Steve

[XanderLin]

Hey Steve,

I've been taught to chase not only tress that look unwell...but also anyone into wood who looks a little unwell....:D

Problem is drying out the wood of course, but hopefully I'll have somewhere to keep it one day..

Thanks for checking out the Sturt Stand, drop in anytime,

[XanderLin]

Thanks for the info, some great perspective into the industry...

It's a shame though...your point of view. Sad, and I'd rather lend a positive alternative than give in to cynicism...and before anyone calls me a naive kid I turn 38 this Sunday haha!!

[Chrism3]

Have you tried here:
Home (http://www.ajaa.com.au/)

[Phily]

Xanderlin, I'm local and a past Sturt student. Happy to pass on some (green) Blackwood and camphor laurel. PM me if interested. Cheers Phil