Separators

[Arron]

I have a 2hp (2 bag) dust extractor and want to add a separator. What I want to know is what is the minimum size separator that will work. I know some of you are using wheelie bins but my space is limited and I was hoping to have something that sat above the motor - ie, doesnt have a footprint of its own.

I tried a 60 litre rubbish bin but it didnt work - the shavings were sucked out when the inlet was briefly constricted.

Any suggestions (yes, I did a search).

thanks
Arron

[Harry72]

On the outlet put a coarse filter, the finer stuff will go through to the dusty and the bigger stays.
Fly wire is coarse enough, just make up a small cylinder shaped cage from chicken wire that fits into the outlet then wrap the fly wire around it.

[Arron]

OK, not much response to the question of what is the minimum size separator for a 2hp dc. Perhaps people could just tell me what they are using as a separator - that might do. Anyone using anything smaller then a wheelie bin ????

ps. thanks for the reply Harry72, but I'm keen to try to get something going without a filter first - thinking I dont want something which can either block up or reduce air flow even just a little.

Arron

[bsrlee]

Hmm - I have just received my LV separator lid for my future dust system, so your problem interests me.

What sort of system are you using in your separator? Just a big drum with pipe in/pipe out or are you using some sort of semi-cyclone arrangement like the LV or some of the DIY lids that have been posted on the Forum? I seem to remember discussion about swirling & blockages.

You may want to review the LV instructions at:
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=3&p=30282&cat=1,42401&ap=1
just scroll down to the price line & click 'Instr' to pop up a printable copy of their instruction sheet.

[junkboy999]

Perhaps people could just tell me what they are using as a separator - that might do. Anyone using anything smaller then a wheelie bin ????



I just use a trash can I got at WallyWorld ( walmart ) and lid from Jet Tools for 19.00$.

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b330/PbTerry/Thumbnails/dc-can.jpg

The can will fill to 3/4 befor stuff gets in to the dust collection bag. Works greak. I'm lucky, I have plenty of space, mine fits under the stares using that unused space

[Wongo]

Aaron,

Any chance for a picture so we might be able to understand why it did work. A lot of us use 70L bin and it works very well.

This is mine http://www.woodworkforums.ubeaut.com.au/showthread.php?t=18664&page=1&pp=15

Cheers :)

[Arron]

I dont think I could take a worthwhile picture, but what I have tried is pretty simple anyway - a standard 60litre rubbish bin from Bunnings, a simple flat top from MDF cut to size and sealed with duct tape, and two fittings on top to accept the DC hoses. The holes are about 300mm apart and the fittings protrude about 30mm below the MDF top.

Anyway, it seems others are making separators of this size work which answers my question. I'll just have to go back and try again - at least this time knowing I have the right gear. I get very little shed time at the moment so perhaps I should have done more fiddling before posting the question.

Arron

[Waldo]

G'day Guys,

I'm wading in here out of interest as tomorrow I'll be hooking the plumbing up to my newly purchased 2hp C/T Dusty.

My question is, is a cyclone applicable to being hooked up to one machine at a time? My dusty will be linked to three maqchines with blast gates to select which machine I want the Dusty to suck from.

Thanks for any help. :D

[bsrlee]

1: Aaron - try putting a 90 degree elbow on the end of the intake pipe as it empties into the bin & angle it so that it points parrallel to the side of the bin. this will make a cyclonic swirl - not a true cyclone - and have the effect of throwing the heavier chunks to the outside where they will be slowed by friction & fall to the bottom - the air in the middle, being the slowest will have the least chunky bits & be sucked up the central outlet pipe. As the bin fills some of the medium stuff will still be suspended & get sucked up anyway, but that's when you should have emptied the bin - before it gets too heavy ;)

2:Waldo - the cyclone unit goes nearest the 'sucker' unit and the ducting goes from the cyclone & branches out to all the machinery. Don't forget to include some sort of pressure release mechanism in case you start it up without a gate open - a large cork inserted from inside the pipe, a spring loaded trapdoor etc - there are several ideas that can stop your pipe or cyclone from imploding & becoming flat :eek:

[Poloris]

2:Waldo - the cyclone unit goes nearest the 'sucker' unit and the ducting goes from the cyclone & branches out to all the machinery. Don't forget to include some sort of pressure release mechanism in case you start it up without a gate open - a large cork inserted from inside the pipe, a spring loaded trapdoor etc - there are several ideas that can stop your pipe or cyclone from imploding & becoming flat :eek:


Bsrlee can you please post a diagram or photo of a pressure mechanism if you have one.

[la Huerta]

just a note, people are trying to make smaller separators, but is the footprint of a larger and taller bin really much biger than a small bin, maybe just a couple of inches...

[Waldo]

G'day Brslee,

Like Poloris asked, can you maybe post a pic of your pressure valve/gate? Heard it's a good thing so PVC dosen't go from 4" to 1/32". :eek:

I will be running the FM-300 from C/T, will a cyclone reduce the suction? I won't be installing one straight off, but will sometime down the track.

[junkboy999]

Yes Arron

Thay work buy spinning the air as it comes in to the can. Mine has a sprial intake hook up thats spin the stuff to the out side of can and the out take is just in the middle.

[Arron]

OK, found the reason. It seems the 60 litre bin works fine as a separator when the air is flowing normally. The problem was caused because after using the DC as a DC I then (as I habitually do) put on a long pipe and used it as a vacuum cleaner to clean the floor. As the soft end of the pipe meets the ground it creates quite an effective seal - constricting the air flow to pretty much nothing. When this happens the DC sucks whatever is in the separator out - and as it was a big clean up it pretty much emptied the separator before I took the lid off to check.

I didnt realise this was happening because as it was only a prototype held together with duct tape I was unwilling to take it apart to check how effective it had been immediately before the vacuuming stage. No doubt it was full of lovely shavings and sawdust, which were then promptly sucked out.

thanks for the help
Arron

[bsrlee]

Diagram of the pressure relief thingy? I saw it a few years ago in one of the FWW Methods of Work columns - it was a ply box with a spring loaded flap - when the pressure got too low, the flap opened a bit & fixed the problem.

Some diagrams are in my round tuit box - I'll post them in a separate post so they won't keep re-generating this one.

[Skew ChiDAMN!!]

Like Poloris asked, can you maybe post a pic of your pressure valve/gate? Heard it's a good thing so PVC dosen't go from 4" to 1/32". :eek:
Easiest thing in the world to make. Make a box with ports on opposite sides. Cut a square hole in another side and mount a flap on the inside with a piano hinge on an edge next to one of the ports. There should be some overlap, about 1/2"+ and a bit of felt or rubber can ensure a tighter seal when closed.

The creative part is setting up a spring to hold the flap shut until a "critical pressure" is achieved. I've seen all sorts of things from adjustable springs to cupboard latches. I've even seen rubber-bands, which not only worked but worked well! :eek: Latch-type systems need to be manually closed if tripped. [shrug] It takes a while to get it working at the right pressure, but once done...

Oh, 'tis important to mount the box the right way 'round in the lines! The flap should not be blocking the DC intake when opened! DAMHIKT. :o


I will be running the FM-300 from C/T, will a cyclone reduce the suction? I won't be installing one straight off, but will sometime down the track.

A good cyclone won't affect the suction in any way unless it either leaks drastically or is so full it should've been emptied last year.

[Harry72]

Im a bit confused about this pressure relief valve, I didnt think it was for stopping your cyclone from colapsing or sucking out the contents of your separator... it was for if you used a airfoil type impellor(think old evap aircon cage fan)because at a certain point of pressure restriction the airfoil affect would stall and overload the drive motor.