Feast Watson Prooftint advice wanted

[Lappa]

We had noticed a gap between a door architrave and the door jamb for years. The architrave was also damaged at the bottom. Then, in a big storm, the Hall/Lounge room door slammed shut with such force, that it moved the door frame about 10 mm by pushing the wooden plugs that were between the bricks, through the plaster. When the architraves were taken off, sections of plaster just fell out.

399641 399642


I moved the door frame back and used long Ramset inserts to lock to the brickwork and plugged the holes on the cypress door jams.

Trying to find a wet plasterer was like trying to find hen's teeth but I found one and for the cost of my first born, the walls were repaired.

Problem No. 1. The wall on the lounge room side is wider than the door jamb and as always been so, hence the gap in the architrave. That wall wasn't damaged.
Its 8mm at the bottom sloping up to about 2 mm at the top. I planed some cypress floor board and glued and nailed it to the jamb and the old, damaged architrave now sits great against the wall and jamb.

Note the colour difference.

399644

I then had two new architraves (one for each side) machined up from WR Cedar - the old ones are Aust. cedar which they could not supply. Big colour difference.

399645 399646

The advice from a few people was to use Feast Watson Prooftint and Colour reducer to get a colour match for both the door jamb and the architraves. Door jamb comes close to Brown Japan and its not really going to be all that noticeable.

Test runs with mixes of Cedar and Walnut get the colours pretty close on small samples (see above Right picture for architrave) but the proof will be on the long runs. I intend to use the back of the architraves, in long sections, as the trial timber.

Has any one whose used Prooftint got any hints, suggestions, advice as the cost of machining the architraves wasn't cheap.

Cheers - Peter

[Xanthorrhoeas]

I have used mixes of the different prooftint colours over the years to match old timber, so what you are planning sounds good. Remember that the final colour of the stain is affected by the finish. When I have used it I have usually finished with shellac (Brown button, not orange flake) and, since the solvent for shellac is metho it also dissolves some of the stain - you need to take that into account. Antique architraves were usually shellac finished.

So, if you are using shellac remember to try some shellac on the trial areas on the back as well as just look at the stain. The same goes for other finishes.

Western Red Cedar is a conifer, Australian cedar is a flowering plant. Conifers contain resins and the resins can resist the stain. I have not stained WRC so I don't know if it has the problem, but using prooftint on Pinus radiata or Pinus elliotii (the common cheap pine timbers) can result in very blotchy results and in distinctly different colour on the early wood and latewood bands.

I know this a bit late but it is surprising that you couldn't get the Australian cedar to machine - there is still plenty around and reliable sellers on the forums (e.g. Greg Ward) usually have it in stock. If you get stuck the Asian cedars like Kalantas also look very close and will stain easily to look just like Australian cedar. Here in Brisbane there are stores like The Woodworkers (Moorooka) that stock a range of repro mouldings in Kalantis or similar timber. Ther ealso used to be (may still exist) Colonial Windows and Doors that also stocked a wide range.

i hope this helps

David

[Lappa]

Thanks David. I was under the misinformed opinion that Australian Timber was rare and expensive. Thanks for the list of alternatives. I have only dealt with local suppliers and rely on them for info.
Obviously I need to widen my horizons :D

[Xanthorrhoeas]

Yes, I had the same experience when I lived in Sydney many years ago. I had some shelves replaced in an antique cedar cupboard and they used WRC but told me it was "cedar". I think it was that scarring event that set me on the road to antique restoration and eventually woodworking (aah, ruin I hear you say). Commercial suppliers in mainland Australia seem to be pretty lazy and only stock the easy stuff. Of course, specialists like Anagote in Annandale have a wonderful range of Australian and exotic timbers, but I haven't been there for 35 years so I have no idea of their current prices.

I have a terrible memory for names but one of the Ward brothers also had a place on the North Shore out towards Waverley from memory (I've never been there just seen threads on the forums) and they sell some Australian timbers there too (or used to) at 'woodies prices' rather than the full retail.

[aldav]

Ironwood and Swadling's are next door to one another in Lilyfield Road at Rozelle. Huge range of new and recycled timbers in stock. You should go and have a look Lappa, I can spend hours in Ironwood! They're both on the web -
Ironwood Australia - Recycled Timber Specialists | (http://ironwood.com.au/)
Swadlings Timber and Hardware (http://www.swadlingstimberandhardware.com.au/index.html)

[Lappa]

To make matters worse, I just went to cut the architraves to length for a trial fit :((:((:((:((
They came in one long length and when I couldn't fit it in the car the guy said "I'll cut it in 1/2 for you. One is 10mm too short and the other of course too long (that's not a problem) AND they are 17mm thick not the 19mm my sample was. Also the thin edge is 8mm not 1/4" so no match for the existing:~.
So it looks like I be trying some of the leads you guys have given me.

[aldav]

I feel for you. Wouldn't it rot your socks. Sometimes you can't kick a goal regardless of how hard you try!

[Xanthorrhoeas]

Have a look at these people. they may have the architraves that you want. About us - Colonial Warehouse (http://www.colonialwarehouse.com.au/)

Or these; http://www.woodworkers.com.au/catalogues/restoration-catalogues

I know that they are in Brisbane, but maybe freight is not too bad. I would also be surprised if there were not equivalent suppliers in Sydney for restoration products.

[Lappa]

Thanks gents. I'll do some ring around next week. In the meantime I've been having a fiddle with what I have. I have sawn a 3mm x 8mm strip of cedar and placed it under the outside edge as a trial. Brings the flat section into line with the existing moulding but the spay section is still not right. Looking at a way to trim off a 0 to 2mm section to bring the spay section into line.

399675
That will keep me off the street for the next few nights:D

[clear out]

Got a hand plane?
I have some recycled bits of Oz Cedar in the rack here in Concord if you need a bit.
How long do you need?
H.

[Lappa]

I've got the planes so I'll have a go later this week. I've planed small items but planing the full length of the architrave and getting it even the full length will test my technique :D
Thanks for the kind offer of timber but I should be OK. If it all turns to s"?&, I've found a company that specialise in made to order mouldings and they can exactly match the existing profile - guaranteed:)

[Xanthorrhoeas]

That looks like a 1920's or later moulding? What age is the house? i was presupposing much earlier but perhaps that was just imagination on my part.

[Lappa]

House turned 100 last month - love it to bits :rolleyes:

[Christos]

House turned 100 last month - love it to bits :rolleyes:

Happy Birthday.

:birthday:

[Lappa]

Finished the task today - apart from a quick sand of the original architrave and a matt varnish all round.

Took everyones advice and planed the architrave with my 4 1/2 after marking the 8 mm edge down to 1/4". Used the 4 1/2 as the blade would cover the entire bevel. Pencil marked the top of the bevel to make sure I wasn't removing timber from the top edge.
400628


Ran some cedar through the saw table to get a 3 mm strip to add to the wide edge to take it to 20 mm from the existing 17 mm.

400629

Spent two days mixing Prooftint and trying out on cedar scraps. Finally got it down to 2 parts walnut, 6 parts cedar and thinned it 50/50 with reducer. Took two coats. Just attached it and I'm well pleased:D (Left hand is the replacement, top is the original).

400630

Thanks to all those that responded.

[Bob38S]

Now that I would call a win win.

What did you clear coat it with as Prooftint is not a finish on its own.

[Lappa]

Thanks Bob,
I will be using Feast Watson Clear Varnish in a Satin finish. Similar product has been used throughout the house on the wood work.

[Xanthorrhoeas]

Well done - it looks great.

David