New Project - Working Title "Mouse Wheel"

[xpro]

The idea for this automaton has been fermenting in the brain for some time. Until I acquired a mini lathe/mill, attempting it was looking like a distant prospect. Now, the steep learning curve of the machine presents interesting challenges, raising the possibility of doing it. It opens up the world of brass and plastics which present many possibilities previously unavailable. That, remains to be seen......
A man is trapped inside a mouse wheel, running towards distant rewards, shimmering, tempting, unattainable. A mouse,
bemused, looks on.
A crude sketch,

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Gus

[xpro]

The attached short video is a test prototype to see which leg is more realistic. The right leg, nearest to camera, is a fixed shape, the other has a moveable knee joint. I am not convinced that it is better than the fixed. And, I don't think that the knee movement is correct yet. I intend to build the character using brass which is harder to modify than a carved one. The constant moving of the parts will have a wear factor which may be short, so the movement must be accurate prior to brassworks.

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Meanwhile the wheel is under construction.
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The template, generated in Illustrator is glued to two pieces of ply,
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Drilled for rods, and cutout on scrollsaw
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Assembly follows.

Thanks for looking,
Gus

[Keith_1]

Good one Gus :2tsup:

Looking forward to seeing more of your excellent work

All the Best

Keith

[xpro]

The wheel is complete, and installed for testing.

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To imply that the character is trapped in a mechanical life, the wheel's rotating gears and the leg and arm movement cams and controls will be left exposed behind the wheel, the first parts of which are seen in this video.

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Thanks for looking,
Gus

[Keith_1]

Top work Gus

The video shows it off well :2tsup:

regards

Keith

[James_]

nice work.

Jim

[crowie]

Apologies Gus, I somehow missed this Work In Progress...
Your ingenuity and engineering along with the craftsmanship is brilliant sir...
I too appreciate the videos on the "How It Works", Thank You..
Cheers, Peter

[James_]

Gus,
I am curious, are you going to use a cam to oscillate the movement of "his" legs ? If you have a tab that pushes back then his leg could move forward before going down again.


Jim

[xpro]

Thanks very much Peter !
Gus

[xpro]

Gus,
I am curious, are you going to use a cam to oscillate the movement of "his" legs ? If you have a tab that pushes back then his leg could move forward before going down again.


Jim
Hi Jim,
The leg movement at the knees is what I think you are referring to. I am using a combination of internal and external cables and spring wire. As the leg rotates to the rear, the knee is bent by a cable attached to the torso. As it rotates to the front, a spring wire straightens the leg before the next cycle. The arm above is connected inside the torso to the leg by cable and a small return spring. The leg "front to back" movement will be via a piston governing reciprocal arms, driven by a pulley which also drives the wheel.
I hope that answers the question, and thanks for the interest,
Gus

[xpro]

The body will require better than timber moving elements, so it is made of brass, which will be clad with carved timber.
Telescoping tubes with the legs soldered to them go through the large tube to the rear where the mechanisms operating them will be located. The knees are hinges used by aero modellers to actuate wing flaps. Not sure they will stand the test of time however. At the top is for the arms, and the head.


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Installed temporarily in the cage,

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Looks a bit lost....

Next is the timber bodyworks and the actuating cables, springs bith internal and external. Stainless steel fishing cable, spring steel and springs will be the "veins" which hopefully will result in realistic movements.
Thanks for looking,
Gus

[Christos]

Pulling up a chair to watch this one.

[James_]

Hi Gus,
I know getting the movements to work in synchronicity will take some trial and error. This morning I was thinking of the movie Running Man only in this instance it's like the daily grind. The attached image shows one way the upper leg might be lifted and rotated. It's just the basic idea. I hope you don't mind. With some of what you're doing this might help you to keep the movements isolated to different parts of your man in the cage.


Jim

[James_]

Gus,
There is something you might consider, if my project works then it could power your mouse wheel.
The outside diameters should be close so Bessler's Wheel would be like a water wheel at a mill. And I do believe what I posted in my thread is simple enough to wprk.
Besides I know a lot of people are interested in seeing your mouse wheel work.

Jim

[James_]

Gus,
I know what I've suggested is unusual. And it might be that a basic demonstration of perpetual motion would be a let down because of how it's been hyped and considered impossible. Yet with something like what you're working on people might find the whole thing more interesting. With me I do plan on having a wood shop to work on different projects but need to get there first.
With the mechanics you're working with, I'm not sure how you'd feel about it but some of the people in here might be interested in helping with some of the research and development. I know with what I've worked on in the past that working out the mechanics and what I like is, we had one inventor who said 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration and you've had the inspiration and have started the perspiration.
I'll explain the math of the motor in my thread so you can consider it.


Jim

[xpro]

Thanks very much Jim, for your ideas. I am always looking at ways to make things move, so anything is of great interest. One aspect of all my automatons is that the viewer is involved, connected with it, because of direct involvement with the piece through the handle operation. So far, my experience shows that simplicity is the most difficult thing, overengineering is easer in some ways. With the Grandpa automaton, the fart engine is much more complex than it needs to be, highlighted by learnt lessons since that piece.
Today I am hoping to complete the leg/arm controls and post clear detail photographs of how it works. Nothing is set in stone with any aspect, my waste bin is full of rejects......
Regards, and thanks for the drawing !
Gus

[Keith_1]

Good stuff Gus.

If your waste bin is full of rejects - your final outcome will be truly magnificent:2tsup:

Look forward to your next post

Regards

Keith

[xpro]

The brass skeleton is now buried by the timber bits posing as a body. The cables and attachments are still prototype because everything will be disassembled for finishing and reassembled with new. That process destroys some working components, in some ways that creates a "new" and "finished" prototype.

This photo of the left leg rear shows how the knee bending is achieved by cables. It is how our muscles work. Fixed to a post below the knee, the other end is guided through the leg to the front through a brass tube. This end is fixed to the torso. When the leg rotates, tension is created, pulling the cable taught bends the knee. At the top of the leg, a cable which controls the arm movement can be seen. The arm return is by a small spring inside the torso. The right arm will be fixed, holding a briefcase.

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The piano wire straightens the knee once the tension is released. Above, the cable post for the knee bend cable can be seen. The right leg at this point is already on its way rearward.

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This video is of the control mechanism for the leg and arm movements. The white arms are controlled by a pulley driven pivot. Each leg rotates via a brass tube passing from here into the body. The left leg tube is inside the right leg tube, a fortunate aspect of the US manufactured brass tube, all sizes telescope beautifully.

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The end result.

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Inside the wheel, the character is going nowhere....

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Next comes the fun of creating the mouse and its movement mechanisms.

Thanks for looking,

Gus

[xpro]

Good stuff Gus.

If your waste bin is full of rejects - your final outcome will be truly magnificent:2tsup:

Look forward to your next post

Regards

Keith

Thank you Keith !
I am finding this brass gig is an expensive way to have fun....
Regards,
Gus

[Keith_1]

Gus

Cannot open your attachments - is anybody else having that problem ?

Regards

Keith

[xpro]

Gus

Cannot open your attachments - is anybody else having that problem ?

Regards

Keith

Thanks Keith, Apparently there is a broken link, I have advised the admin,
Regards,
Gus

[ubeaut]

I have Steven looking into this problem so not going to try to fix it right now as neither he or I have been able to duplicate it, so need one that's not fixed to check out.

Cheers - Neil :U

[xpro]

Perhaps we get lucky with the photos and videos .....

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Leg detail Rear

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Leg front detail

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Rear Controls

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Up and running

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And, getting nowhere.

Thanks for watching,
Gus

[Keith_1]

You are a genius Gus :brava

Regards

Keith

[xpro]

The mouse is carved and installed in its place. I would like to keep those details in the dark to maintain a surprise.The mouse movements are controlled by two cams, and associated cam followers. The camshaft with the main gears are also finalised, in this photo those are seen.

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The cams are in contact with the followers, the jarrah pieces below. The critical thing about the cams in the automata is the information they contain.
First the blank cam is marked up with timing marks, in this case, seven seconds of active operation. The rest is idle rotation.

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It is installed into the camshaft, attached by the followers to the element they control, and the desired movements marked on. This is a time consuming job, more often than not resulting in a new cam if the marking doesn't do what the intention was. For that reason, I usually make two identical cam blanks. If it works as intended, the blank is cut by copying the by then marked, remarked, revised, recut, added to, original.

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It is then cut on the scroll saw, reinstalled for testing. Luckily, in this case only two modifications needed to be done, it works as intended.

The next phase is to connect the mouse cage mechanism to the crankshaft via pulleys.

Thanks for looking,

Gus

[crowie]

The mouse is carved and installed in its place. I would like to keep those details in the dark to maintain a surprise.The mouse movements are controlled by two cams, and associated cam followers. The camshaft with the main gears are also finalised, in this photo those are seen.

411399

The cams are in contact with the followers, the jarrah pieces below. The critical thing about the cams in the automata is the information they contain.
First the blank cam is marked up with timing marks, in this case, seven seconds of active operation. The rest is idle rotation.

411400

It is installed into the camshaft, attached by the followers to the element they control, and the desired movements marked on. This is a time consuming job, more often than not resulting in a new cam if the marking doesn't do what the intention was. For that reason, I usually make two identical cam blanks. If it works as intended, the blank is cut by copying the by then marked, remarked, revised, recut, added to, original.

411401

It is then cut on the scroll saw, reinstalled for testing. Luckily, in this case only two modifications needed to be done, it works as intended.

The next phase is to connect the mouse cage mechanism to the crankshaft via pulleys.

Thanks for looking,

Gus

Sorry Gus, sad news, the photos again didn't work...cheers, peter

[xpro]

Hopefully, they will appear ! Thanks Peter for the warning !

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Can be read in conjunction with the previous post,

Gus

[Keith_1]

Great work as always Gus :2tsup:

As with Peter - I couldn't get attachments to open either:C

Keep up the top work mate

Regards

Keith

[xpro]

On its own, the original setup to move the legs worked fine. Once other cams and gears were added, the relatively minor problem with its operation became pronounced, leading to its membership of the rejects bin.
This photo is how it was, driven by a pulley to an arm which was the other end of the belt. At "top dead center", just as the two arms swung to the other side, there was a slight jerkiness, as if there is an obstruction, or a tension at that point.

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That translated via the belt to other components.
The rebuilt mechanism is actuated by a cam below, different geometry, the problem disappeared.
There is nothing surprising in this rebuild, it is a normal procedure with automatons, at least for me. I have used in this automaton, three gears which were built for earlier projects and rejected for some reason. All grist for the mill..

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Thanks for looking,

Gus

[Keith_1]

Looks nice and smooth Gus, TOP WORK:2tsup:

Regards

Keith

[crowie]

I must get my act together one day Gus, and drop over to see these magnificent machines you're making, Cheers, Peter

[xpro]

I must get my act together one day Gus, and drop over to see these magnificent machines you're making, Cheers, Peter

Thanks Peter, looking forward to that !
Regards,
Gus

[xpro]

The prototype is peppered with revisions. Holes, openings, cable routings, etc, a normal process of getting things working right, much fun was had in the process.

The occupant of the wheel now has a head, feet and hands,
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The Camshaft completed,

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Nearest the camera - Input gear, mouse head cam, mouse control cam, mouse "door" cam, leg/arm movement pin drive, leg/arm movement cam.

The mouse makes an appearance,
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The last thing to make is a method of revealing the mouse, which has eluded me now for days....
Once solved, the protoype is disassembled, finishes to everything, clothes for the runner - how does a non tailor make that ?

Thanks for watching,

Gus

[Keith_1]

It all looks fantastic Gus - but the mouse is SPECTACULAR - Top Stuff

Regards

Keith

[xpro]

It all looks fantastic Gus - but the mouse is SPECTACULAR - Top Stuff

Regards



Keith

Thanks very much Keith ! Thinking that the work should be renamed "The Tread Mill". More appropriate, what do you think ?

Regards.
Gus

[Keith_1]

Thanks very much Keith ! Thinking that the work should be renamed "The Tread Mill". More appropriate, what do you think ?

Regards.
Gus

Sounds good Gus :2tsup:

Regards

Keith

[crowie]

Sounds good Gus :2tsup:

Regards

Keith

Or The Tread Mill Wheel with the mouse showing the poor bloke how to do it.....:U......

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[xpro]

Here is a photo of all the components of this automata, minus a couple yet to come.

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Thanks for looking,

Gus

[crowie]

Can't wait to see the video of it all together and working Gus, Cheers, Peter

[Keith_1]

Here is a photo of all the components of this automata, minus a couple yet to come.

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Thanks for looking,

Gus

Lots of intricate work there Gus.

You are a talented man :2tsup:

Regards

Keith

[xpro]

Finishes application was clear gloss acrylic for all timber elements, now what is hopefully final assembly of the work begins.

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Main input gears

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Cam followers, runner gear support

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Camshaft

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Underside of the stage - mouse support and cable pulleys

The stage work is next, and additional background, props.
Thanks for looking,
Gus

[crowie]

:kewl:

WAY:specool:


:welldone:

The crowd is starting to roar with the excitement of the big revival......

[Keith_1]

Gus,

Your assembly and finish looks excellent - Top Stuff:2tsup:

Keith

[xpro]

Some photos of the completed work, which I have renamed "The Treadmill". The earlier post remains, though I wanted to delete it since it appeared as a new project, without success.
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Thanks for looking,
Gus

[Keith_1]

Top work Gus - it is excellent:hooray:

Well Done Mate:2tsup:

Regards

Keith

[crowie]

:welldone: :iagree: :kewl:

Looks great Gus, Another one I'll be looking forward to seeing person, Cheers, Peter

PS - Where's the video of this magnificent machine????

[xpro]

Hi Peter, thanks mate, the very wet and wild weather in Sydney today probably means I can get on with the video.
Cheers,
Gus

[crowie]

Yes Gus, Cold and wet here too.
Just relit the fire and the lounge room is back up to 17deg but the shed is about 8.

[Keith_1]

Hey guys

It's not too bad down here in Victoria. No rain - it's about 15 degrees:D

Regards

Keith

[xpro]

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Given the weather today which put a stop to much work in the workshop, I cobbled together this pretty crude video of the work.

Thanks for watching it despite the quality disclaimer !

Gus

[xpro]

Glues will never dry Keith .....

Cheers,
Gus

[Keith_1]

Excellent ingenious work Gus. Your camera skills are tops as well:2tsup:

Fantastic

Regards

Keith

[crowie]

That's excellent Gus, Love the fades and the different angles BUT that cheese on the rat trap looks like gold or is it a reflection of your skills, talents and ingenuity.. Top Job, Cheers, Peter

[xpro]

Thanks Peter,
They are meant to look like gold bars, the prize he seeks, never attains, doesn't realise it is a trap....
Thanks very much for your support and comments,
Gus

[xpro]

Thanks very much Keith for your comments ! Your tip re the super gold spray made the trap very effective mate.
Gus

[James_]

That is awesome ! Seeing what you can do is something I aspire to. Kind of why I'll need to stick with what I'm doing. I've got lots to learn :-)


Jim

[xpro]

James,
Thanks very much for your comment ! I have seen your caterpillar automaton, I don't think you have that much to learn.....
Regards,
Gus

[xpro]

I have posted an improved, longer video on Youtube, since its size is waay over the 7mb limit on the forum.
(not that sure it is much better than the previously posted)

Link,

<style type="text/css">p.p1 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0. font: 18.0px Helvetica; color: #167ac6}span.s1 {font-kerning: none}</style>https://youtu.be/ZS15bcjhB4A

Thanks for looking,
Gus

[James_]

Enjoyed your video. I hope what I'll be working on turns out 1/2 as nice.

Jim