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Waady
24th May 2017, 06:46 PM
Hello, I'm new to the forum and am looking for some advice re captive bar deep hollowing systems.

Several of the captive bar systems seem set up with the lathe turning in reverse (e.g. Vermec) which obviously requires that the chuck is locked with a safety ring. I know that lathes such as Vicmarc can lock the chuck for reverse operation, however I have a Laguna Revo 1836 and I don't think that there is an option (method) for reverse operation using a Vicmarc chuck.

Does anyone know of an option that allows reverse chuck locking on a Laguna?

Also, there are other systems that are designed to operate in forward motion (e.g. Carter). I like the look of the Carter system but it seems a bit expensive in comparison.

Does anyone have experience with the Carter system that they could share (likes/dislikes)?


thanks
Waady

Sturdee
24th May 2017, 07:15 PM
Several of the captive bar systems seem set up with the lathe turning in reverse (e.g. Vermec) which obviously requires that the chuck is locked with a safety ring.
Waady

I have the Vermec system and in use the lathe does not turn in reverse but in the normal direction. Instead you can cut on the opposite side of your hollowing. This is normally unsafe except on the Vermec hollowing rig which is solidly engineered to allow this. So any lathe can be used this way.

Brendan Stemp made a video of the hollowing tool (http://www.vermec.com/) which is worthwhile watching.

Peter.

Waady
25th May 2017, 08:07 AM
Thanks Sturdee

Your advice is very helpful. I had obviously misinterpreted the setup of it.

How do you find the Vermec in use?

Willy Nelson
25th May 2017, 12:31 PM
There are other videos on Youtube explaining the use of the Vermec deep hollower, but they are using it back to front. Enzo, from Vermec got this video made to clear up the confusion

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7B-68Wr9kRA

A couple of my friends have them, one demonstrates it use, when I get a few bucks aside, I shall purchase one, maybe
Cheers
Willy

Waady
25th May 2017, 01:39 PM
Thanks Willy, that's great. As you say, it clears up how to correctly mount the setup. The Vermec looks impressive in terms of both its simplicity and being solidly made. They are also local to me here in Brisbane so that's another bonus.

Sturdee
25th May 2017, 05:44 PM
How do you find the Vermec in use?

Very easy, I drill a 25mm hole to the depth I want on my lathe (which is a Hafco WL18 bolted on a bench against the wall) using a special long boring augur drill bit with a 2MT direct into the tailstock. Bought the drill bit direct from Brendan Stemp at the time.

This hole is enough to start hollowing. As it can be aggressive you have to be careful you don't hollow out too much.

Because of the way my lathe is so close to the wall I always use it by cutting on the uptake direction as I have no room for cutting the normal way and I can look easily into the opening whilst cutting.

The kit is very well made, solidly engineered and even with cutting on the uptake side I can guide the bar with one hand and use the other to hold a vac suction tube to suck away shavings. Couldn't do this with any other hollowing tool.:2tsup:

They are expensive but well worth the money and as they are local to you why don't you go and have a look at Vermec.

Peter.

Willy Nelson
25th May 2017, 11:28 PM
Thanks Willy, that's great. As you say, it clears up how to correctly mount the setup. The Vermec looks impressive in terms of both its simplicity and being solidly made. They are also local to me here in Brisbane so that's another bonus.

I have a background in Engineering, I tend to go overkill on most things. For example, Sex, Explosives and Horsepower, no such thing as overkill.

Hence why I like Vicmarc and Vermec, both could be considered over kill on engineering, others may consider them just very well built and robust.
Sincerely
Willy

Waady
26th May 2017, 12:40 AM
Thanks guys, I think you've convinced me re the Vermec. I'm going to the Working With Wood show here in Brissy tomorrow so hopefully there'll be a chance to check one out. If not I'll take a trip to Vermec sometime soon.

Thanks heaps for all your advice, it is greatly appreciated.

Waady

Nubsnstubs
26th May 2017, 01:21 AM
How many of you guy's here that posted using this system or are about to get one have reverse on your lathe? I'm just curious, but would like to get some answers. ..... Jerry (in Tucson)

Pat
26th May 2017, 06:37 AM
Another vote for the Vermec system. Easy to use one handed. Able to deal with a variety of timbers, think green Camphor thru to dry Grey or Yellow box burl.

Nub, no reverse here.

413152413153

Sturdee
26th May 2017, 09:36 AM
How many of you guy's here that posted using this system or are about to get one have reverse on your lathe? I'm just curious, but would like to get some answers. ..... Jerry (in Tucson)


No reverse on my lathe.

Willy Nelson
26th May 2017, 12:16 PM
How many of you guy's here that posted using this system or are about to get one have reverse on your lathe? I'm just curious, but would like to get some answers. ..... Jerry (in Tucson)

Hello Jerry
Apologies in advance if I have gotten this incorrect, but you don't need reverse to use the Vermec. The lathe spins the same direction (unless you are in the Northern hemisphere, then it is anti clockwise :wink:). All work is done on the upside, or the far side to you, vice the traditional downside we are all familiar with. IIRC, Japanese turners turn on the upside as well for normal turning
Sincerely
Willy

Nubsnstubs
26th May 2017, 01:00 PM
Thanks, guys. I asked because I broke my neck back in '09, and turning in forward rotation really puts a strain on my neck. Brendon mentions the neck issue in his video also. So, I have a lathe that has reverse, and it's the only way I hollow out my hollow forms. I also made up some right hand bends on swan neck tools I made for hollowing. Then, I got the bright idea to machine a flat on each side of the end that has the carbide insert.. Now what I have a a regular normal swan neck tool that can also be used for turning in reverse. I use these swan necks on an articulated setup I made. I also use a steady rest just in case my form wants to launch. With what I have and use, it's not necessary to have the bar captured.

I do like the idea of a captured system, but it's too late for me. For those people who don't have reverse, this is the ideal hollowing tool.

Willy, didn't you just get a new lathe? No reverse? And I do get the north and south rotations. Since I'm up in the north, I'm opposite of what you guys from unduh do down unduh. .. ..... Jerry (in Tucson)

Willy Nelson
26th May 2017, 06:23 PM
[QUOTE=Willy, didn't you just get a new lathe? No reverse? And I do get the north and south rotations. Since I'm up in the north, I'm opposite of what you guys from unduh do down unduh. .. ..... Jerry (in Tucson)[/QUOTE]

Sorry to hear about your back, I too, have issues with mine

Yes, the Vicmarc does have reverse, it's a Vicmarc, it has EVERYTHING
Cheers
Willy
Jarrahland

Waady
27th May 2017, 09:37 AM
My Laguna has reverse

Drillit
27th May 2017, 10:41 AM
Thanks Sturdee

Your advice is very helpful. I had obviously misinterpreted the setup of it.

How do you find the Vermec in use?
Remember that with Vermec when cutting on right hand side with lathe running normally (as
Sturdee says) that you have your cutter upside down and be careful how you bring that cutter into play.
See Vermec for further instructions. Also see YouTube with Guilio Marcolongo demonstrating this. Hope this helps, Drillit.

Kidbee
27th May 2017, 10:28 PM
I have a background in Engineering, I tend to go overkill on most things. For example, Sex, Explosives and Horsepower, no such thing as overkill.

Hence why I like Vicmarc and Vermec, both could be considered over kill on engineering, others may consider them just very well built and robust.
Sincerely
Willy

I don't know if you guys know this but the original owner of Vicmarc and the owner of Vermec are brothers.

george mavridis
27th May 2017, 10:35 PM
I don't know if you guys know this but the original owner of Vicmarc and the owner of Vermec are brothers.

I believe the original owner of Vicmarc still owns it but it's very much a family business these days.

Willy Nelson
28th May 2017, 04:01 PM
I don't know if you guys know this but the original owner of Vicmarc and the owner of Vermec are brothers.

Yes, I meet with Enzo every year in WA and I talk infrequently to Vic and his son Marco (I think I got that right)
Sincerely
Willy

Xanthorrhoeas
1st June 2017, 09:06 PM
So, from this discussion it sounds like the Vermec is the chosen deep hollowing tool, or at least the chosen captive bar deep hollowing tool.

Has anyone used the Rolly Munro hollower so highly recommended by one of our forums sponsors and major woodturning equipment suppliers here in Aus? Their comment being "In my opinion it is the Rolls Royce of hollowing tools and will outperform any other on the market."

I am also quite new to woodturning and haven't done any deep hollowing so far (learning to do the basics first) but am certainly interested for the future. Or is the Munro tool a completely different type of hollower?
Thanks
David

Pat
1st June 2017, 09:53 PM
David, two different animals.

I like the Vermec as it's easy to use, minimal learning curve and basically Pat (idiot) proof. I also have the woodcut range of hollowing tools and a few odds and sods.

Xanthorrhoeas
1st June 2017, 10:05 PM
David, two different animals.

Thanks Pat, do you mean that they do different tasks or just that there is no comparison in your opinion and the Vermec is easier?

Pat
2nd June 2017, 04:50 AM
David, all chisels do the same task, but imho the Vermec achieves the task the quickest way.

hughie
2nd June 2017, 05:45 AM
So, from this discussion it sounds like the Vermec is the chosen deep hollowing tool, or at least the chosen captive bar deep hollowing tool.

Has anyone used the Rolly Munro hollower so highly recommended by one of our forums sponsors and major woodturning equipment suppliers here in Aus? Their comment being "In my opinion it is the Rolls Royce of hollowing tools and will outperform any other on the market."

I am also quite new to woodturning and haven't done any deep hollowing so far (learning to do the basics first) but am certainly interested for the future. Or is the Munro tool a completely different type of hollower?David

The Munro hollower is very good and has great control. So much so now we have a few other toolmakers adding one very similar to thier tool range. The Munro hollower slices much like the Woodcut Pro-Frome as opposed to many others that scrape. I have used both extensively although I dont currently own a Munro and his latest one is supposed to be the best to date.

In my humble opinion when your looking for a hollower always consider ones that slice over one that scrapes. Why? you will always get a better finish with less tear out slicing. Scraping is fine but it better for a finish light cut as opposed to bulk removal. Although as your skill level rises you will improve your finish with any slicer type.