Roll Your Own BlockBoard with a Masonite Skin

[thumbsucker]

My local Bunnings is selling some Swedish Pine, its much better then the Australian grown stuff (Plan to buy a bunch of it).
Much denser growth rings, fewer knots, straighter, not so warped and better machined. It is however more resiny but smells lovely and pine foresty (sic).
I bought some today and want to make my own BlockBoard from it.
I cut the 90 x 45 x 2.4meter into 40 x 40 x 800 strips, then I ripped those into 19 x 40 x 800 strips and 6 squared all around.
I plan to let it sit for a few days to acclimate re-machine and spring loaded widening joint each lamination before finally glueing all the laminations together forming the core.
Now BlockBoard is traditionally veneered with 3ply or 5ply running perpendicular to the softwood core.
I however have some masonite and I thinking to skin the BlockBoard core with masonite using my vacuum bag.
Would masonite work or do I need the perpendicular grain direction of ply to counteract the movement of the core?

[elanjacobs]

No idea about what to skin it with, but if you're interested I can ask about using our press for laminating the sheets together. It's not hydraulic, but it's still good for a few tonnes. Bed size is 2200x900

[FenceFurniture]

Ply has no effective grain direction as each layer is perpendicular to the next, so as far as that part is concerned Masonite should be ok. Can't comment on any other aspect though.

[thumbsucker]

Cheers I will just use the masonite and my vacuum bag

[aldav]

What are you planning to use your blockboard for thumbsucker? I can certainly agree with you about Northern Hemisphere pines. Lovely tight grain and very attractive. Heavier loads that I get in from Taiwan always seem to be on a pallet made from it and I always save whatever I can. Have made quite a few different things for my grandson's out of it. Makes for extremely attractive through dovetails. :2tsup:

[thumbsucker]

This lot is for a drill press table lighter then ply or mdf and should be as stable I also plan to make two more saw horses and a workshop trolley I had the same thoughts that it was the kind of pine you can cut joinery in

[Simplicity]

Are we going to get pics


Please

Cheers Matt


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[aldav]

Here's a pic. of the only dressed stuff I've got at the moment. This box has only been rough sanded to 120 grit and doesn't have any finish on it yet, but you do get some idea of what the timber looks like. The dovetails are about 19mm wide. Sometimes there are bits of quarter sawn material, the face on it shows very tight growth rings. I'm assuming thumbsuckers stock is very similar. I have had much darker coloured stocks of similar timber from a crate, but that was over 30 years ago.

[ian]

This lot is for a drill press table lighter then ply or mdf and should be as stable I also plan to make two more saw horses and a workshop trolley I had the same thoughts that it was the kind of pine you can cut joinery in
Hi Thumbs
I think the purpose of the skin on blockboard relates to the finish you intend to apply -- I'm not sure that I would want to try veneering a masonite skinned blockboard panel.

However, for a drill press table, masonite should be fine, though you may wish to use a gap filling epoxy or polyurethane to stick the crinkly side of the masonite to the pine.

[rustynail]

The screen side of Masonite leaves a lot to be desired as a bonding surface. The manufacturer recommends sanding the screening back to a smooth surface before gluing (PITA.) Standard Masonite is not water proof and Tempered Masonite is made so by surfacing with oil prior to pressing. Depending on the manufacturer, this oil may be organic or otherwise. Before bonding to the surface , it would be advisable to determine the chemistry of the product. Personally, I would be using plywood or thick timber veneer.

[thumbsucker]

I have used Standard masonite successfully to surface whole bunch of jigs, using polyurethane I like masonite because its free from carcinogenic glues and its not as dusty as MDF to cut, and is much harder wearing then both MDF or ply. Also the dark colour patinas well. Its also cheap about $25 for a full sheet.

The only shame about Masonite is that its limited thicknesses I wish you could get the stuff in like 25mm.

Aldav thats the stuff, you also find it in IKEA furniture bed slats coming out of China. I think this is what old European cabinet makers talk about when they talk about Pine, its lovely stuff.

I hope Bunnings keeps stocking the stuff.

[joe greiner]

The screen side of Masonite leaves a lot to be desired as a bonding surface. The manufacturer recommends sanding the screening back to a smooth surface before gluing (PITA.) Standard Masonite is not water proof and Tempered Masonite is made so by surfacing with oil prior to pressing. Depending on the manufacturer, this oil may be organic or otherwise. Before bonding to the surface , it would be advisable to determine the chemistry of the product. Personally, I would be using plywood or thick timber veneer.

I agree about the PITA of sanding screen side masonite. The smooth-both-sides is no longer available here. For small applications, I found an excellent substitute in office clipboards - slightly bigger than legal page size, and quite a bit tougher too.

Cheers,
Joe

[rustynail]

I have used Standard masonite successfully to surface whole bunch of jigs, using polyurethane I like masonite because its free from carcinogenic glues and its not as dusty as MDF to cut, and is much harder wearing then both MDF or ply. Also the dark colour patinas well. Its also cheap about $25 for a full sheet.

The only shame about Masonite is that its limited thicknesses I wish you could get the stuff in like 25mm.

Aldav thats the stuff, you also find it in IKEA furniture bed slats coming out of China. I think this is what old European cabinet makers talk about when they talk about Pine, its lovely stuff.

I hope Bunnings keeps stocking the stuff.
Yes, I quite agree, masonite definitely has its uses. The screen back was a bit of a brain explosion though.

[auscab]

This lot is for a drill press table lighter then ply or mdf and should be as stable I also plan to make two more saw horses and a workshop trolley I had the same thoughts that it was the kind of pine you can cut joinery in

I think what your doing sounds great. Masonite over Pine . And its for workshop use so you get to watch what it does. The only thing that may happen is the pine moves like pine does , so if there are any knots they would cause the problems. Knots under veneer jobs show up because the board shifts or shrinks and the knot does as well but its grain direction is opposite to the rest so it pops up . The veneer goes up with it . Masonite would not show it up . It doesn't really show on furniture unless its shiny then it stands out . At worst it could cause de lamination around the knots.

I used Masonite both sides of sections of a workshop cabinet I made . It is a big four door cabinet and I wanted fast and light construction . What I did was draw it up and work out accurate component sizes , then I cut roughly 50 x 19 Radiata pine lengths. I then cut these to exact size to make side frames which were just wriggle nailed , (apple box construction things) together They came straight out of clamps after that and had Masonite glued both sides and were stacked and put in clamps. The side of the cabinet was roughly 2.4 high x 600 deep x 19 + 5 +5 = 29 . it also had pine cross pieces through it . I forget if there were more than one in the middle . I did sides and doors with two surfaces . possibly tops and bottoms the same . I forget . I have pictures if its of interest .

Edit . No Just checked. Doors were frame and two sided , sides were frame and single sided.

Rob

[thumbsucker]

auscab I made sure to pick the two best boards from the stack and they were 95% free from knots I managed to cut all my laminations to have zero knots.

[thumbsucker]

The core glued up

428449 428450

[woodPixel]

Here in Canberra the Fyshwick Bunnings sells Baltic Pine as the MGP10 6.0m lengths... not the shorter stuff. It is amazing and I grab it all the time.

Knot free, lots or rings and dead straight.

Their other stuff, however, is hideous.

Here is an 80x20mm sample I took for a client....

428452

[FenceFurniture]

Crikey - ¼ sawn too!
... and dead straight..
428452...because it's ¼ sawn.

[Lappa]

Just a question. What brand of clamp are they please?

[thumbsucker]

Just a question. What brand of clamp are they please?

They are 450mm Japanese Hatagane clamps, I buy the from a seller in Japan by the name of Teshiba.

‘å�H“¹‹ï�AƒVƒ‹ƒo�[ƒ�ƒbƒL-ƒnƒ^ƒKƒl450 (http://www2.odn.ne.jp/mandaraya/hata-1.htm)

They cost about $16 per clamp plus postage.

They come in a range of size.

I bought ten of them and plan to buy 10 more they are great for small clamping projects were big clamps can be cumbersome.

428470 428471

[Arron]

Has anyone seen any of this ‘swedish’ or Baltic pine in any of the Sydney or Central Coast Bunnings?

I’d like to get some.

I’ve only seen the common and dubious looking radiata locally.

Cheers
Arron

[woodPixel]

If the weather holds, I'll go out tomorrow for some and take a photo of the branding.

[woodPixel]

What is meant by a skin for a blockboard, and why would one use masonite in a potentially wet environment?

[thumbsucker]

Blackboard skin is the two outside surface that cover the softwood core.

I am not sure about you but I tend to not use much water at or on my drill press table.

[thumbsucker]

Needed another board of pine to widen the table. So took a trip to Bunnings and took some photos.

Here you can see the wrapping Vida Made In Sweden

428828

Unfortunately the open stacks are now down to the dregs, as you can see they are replete with knots however they are still straight and square.

428829 428830

This is a photo of the underside of the unopened stack you can clearly see the prime boards that will be snapped up.

428831

Managed to find one good board out of the dregs which will get me to where I need to be.

428832

[clear out]

I have a mate in Canberra who made an outdoor workspace by laminating huge curved frames from this stuff.
He haunts Bunny’s and goes thru it regularly for the good stuff.
Google baultic pine and what they do in Europe with it is amazing.
Im sure they had some at the Ashfield bunnys here in Sydney.
H.

[thumbsucker]

Nearly finished. Vacuum bagged the two masonite skins, cut the edges flush on the table saw, used the table saw to cut the groove for the t-track and used a router planed to smooth out the bottom. Chamfered the edges on the spindle moulder. Made the t-track such a tight fit I had to hammer them in, no screws or glue. Applied a coat of tung.

I still need to make a sub fence that will be in two parts that can split in the middle and I need to create a space for the removable insert.
I also need to figure out how to secure the table to the cast iron. Thinking toggled clamps.

The aluminium hardware is from Lee Valley.

Question - if you look in the photo you can see I filed a chamfer into the ends of the t-track to match the wood. Would the spindle moulder be able to cut through aluminium if you took a light cut with a slow RPM?

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[aldav]

Question - if you look in the photo you can see I filed a chamfer into the ends of the t-track to match the wood. Would the spindle moulder be able to cut through aluminium if you took a light cut with a slow RPM?


Yes. A small job like this wouldn't present any problems, you wouldn't even need any wax to act as a lubricant. My rule of thumb is if you can't feel a significant heat build up in the aluminium you're right to go. If a cutter seems to be stalling in the cut stop straight away, you've probably got a build up of melted aluminium on the cutter, flick it off. Amazing the difference a wipe of wax on the cutter and the line of cut on the stock will make. :2tsup:

I'd still be putting some screws in that T-track. :D I'm about to build a drill press table myself, shame you didn't make two. :rolleyes:

Variation in the colours in the photo's is notable. Is the base of your DP blue or green?

[thumbsucker]

Variation in the colours in the photo's is notable. Is the base of your DP blue or green?

The colour is called Wizard, its blueish.

Thanks for the wax tip will give it a go.

[Bohdan]

Question - if you look in the photo you can see I filed a chamfer into the ends of the t-track to match the wood. Would the spindle moulder be able to cut through aluminium if you took a light cut with a slow RPM?


Spindle moulder or router would have no problems. Aluminium is actually easier to machine than MDF. You don't need to slow the cutter but it helps if you lube the ali to stop it sticking to the cutter. I use a proper ali lube but kero, WD40 or even a light oil will do.

[FenceFurniture]

Variation in the colours in the photo's is notable. Is the base of your DP blue or green?Where the pic looks blue in places is because it's predominantly artificial lighting that the camera is compensating for by adding blue - the blue part is the exterior light creeping in (it doesn't need the extra blue, but it gets it anyway)..

Judging by the colour of the concrete floor, I estimate that the most accurate rendition of the blue paint is the front of the base in the second pic (certainly not the left side of it). The colour in the first pic is not accurate, as can be seen by the concrete, which looks warm.

[ian]

Where the pic looks blue in places is because it's predominantly artificial lighting that the camera is compensating for by adding blue - the blue part is the exterior light creeping in (it doesn't need the extra blue, but it gets it anyway)..

Judging by the colour of the concrete floor, I estimate that the most accurate rendition of the blue paint is the front of the base in the second pic (certainly not the left side of it). The colour in the first pic is not accurate, as can be seen by the concrete, which looks warm.If I told you that Thumbsucker uses LED lighting* -- would that make a difference to your assessment of the colour?



*TS had a thread last year about his lights.

[FenceFurniture]

If I told you that Thumbsucker uses LED lighting* -- would that make a difference to your assessment of the colour?
*TS had a thread last year about his lights.Nope - it's all about the colour temperature of the artificial lights (whatever the source), compared to what is coming in the door. LEDs can put out any °K that they are programmed/manufactured to. His LEDs look to be about 3200°K (a little warm) which is spot on in my opinion. The non- direct sunlight coming through the door would be up around 6500°K (from memory) and so is very blue. No camera can correct for both - post-production required.

Furthermore, a still image captures all these nuances for analysis. When we are actually there our eyes can dynamically adjust remarkably quickly - think of the contrast in a full sun pic and how we actually see it. We can see the shadow detail live, but in the properly exposed pic it's just dense and dark (which is why we use fill-flash as compensation for the smaller dynamic range of any capturing medium).

[thumbsucker]

Finished

Routed out the removable insert, fitted a piece of scrap VicAsh.

Made a friction fit wedge mechanism that holds the top square to the cast iron table The cross beam wedges unto the leading taper of the cast iron, simple and works remarkably well. It all can me removed easily if needed.

Fitted the split Rock Maple fence.

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