Goat Island Skiff

[Watermaat]

Man, he makes a beautiful sail. He knows more than me, so I trust his reasoning on the roach. But I also agree with Mik's that it is not totally necessary and a simpler, less expensive sail can be made with a straight leech. Traditional sails even have a hollow leech, without battens.

Cheers,
Clint

Hi Clint,
I completely agree with you and MIK about that simple and less expensive sail.
It's just my personal thing to have ordered this one and I really need to find out if it has been worth. Joost has a standard set-up with Duckworks sail and that has proven to work pretty well. Having seen that and listening to his experience I just try to get some improvement. A bit more profile in light winds and a bit more power tacking against waves. Next year we can compare and it will be fun to see any difference....if there is any :C

[woodeneye]

Hi Colin, as Watermaat has said, Meranti varies considerably, from extemely light to really dense and heavy. We built Dabchicks down to minimum weight using meranti that my dad hand picked, so as long as you can do that, meranti is a good choice as it's nice and stable. The light weight stuff is also light in colour.

Jelutong also used to be in plentiful supply in South Africa, and this is also light in weight if you can get it.

Is Bruynzeels still there? If so they used to sell the best Okoume ply.

Hi Colin
Contact Bruynzeel Plywood Pty. Ltd., Stellenbosch to find distributors in your area. They made the ply for the famous Stormvogel.

[Watermaat]

Hi Colin
Contact Bruynzeel Plywood Pty. Ltd., Stellenbosch to find distributors in your area. They made the ply for the famous Stormvogel.

Yes, Bruynzeel is the very best..........but at a price! Even locally in the Netherlands where they are originated, their ply is very expensive. GIS is certainly worth good quality ply, but I think any "warranty" outdoor ocoume ply could do the job ( if epoxied and maintained well )....at least if you are not planning to cross all oceans for many years as Stormvogel did :U.

[paulie]

I saw a completed GIS in person today, my first. Has me fired up to finish mine.

Some weeks ago, my son came home from school -- an aquaculture-focused vocational school where he gets to spend way too much time on the water, not that I'm jealous or anything -- saying, "Dad! There's a boat at school just like yours!" I figured that "just like" meant "about the right length and shape". I mean, what are the odds of there being another GIS right here in town? But he insisted it was exactly the same. Unfortunately, when we went back to look, it was gone.

I went to pick him up today and he said the boat was back. Moreover, he had discovered that the builder was one of his teachers and brought me over for a chat and a look at the boat. It was a real GIS alright. We chatted about building it and how it sailed and etc. until my son was heartily sorry he had brought us together. Ned, the builder, said he would let me take some pictures and post them here.

I'm still amazed that there is another GIS so close to me. But maybe I shouldn't be. It is an awfully pretty boat. Someone who helps teach boat building and repair at a boat-centered school is going to be drawn to that.

[Colin62]

Hi Colin
Contact Bruynzeel Plywood Pty. Ltd., Stellenbosch to find distributors in your area. They made the ply for the famous Stormvogel.

Thanks for the info (and to the others too). I did some research and Bruynzeel's been through some changes...

Bruynzeels was bought out by Mondi, and subsequently bought from Mondi by the employees and is now run as Cape Sawmills. They still seem to do some plywood, but from what I can see, it seems to be made locally from local timber (pine). I've dropped them an email to see if they can supply the wood.

Here is a link:- http://www.capesaw.co.za/whoarewe/index.htm (http://www.capesaw.co.za/whoarewe/index.htm)

I do have a supplier (Mik's local agents) but I need something to compare their prices against... I also need my annual bonus to get going properly :-)

Just out of interest, CKD Boats prices are as follows:-

6mm WBP R264 (US$35)
6mm Ockume (Chinese) R489 (US$65)
6mm Ockume (French) R652 (US$87)

And they can cnc cut the kit for roughly R350 a sheet, which is tempting, but somehow feels like cheating

Colin

[paulie]

....

Just out of interest, CKD Boats prices are as follows:-

6mm WBP R264 (US$35)
6mm Ockume (Chinese) R489 (US$65)
6mm Ockume (French) R652 (US$87)


Here in the States, I paid US$95/sheet for a mix of French and Greek 6mm Oukume ply, so your price looks good to me.

My dealer, whom I trust, said to stay away from Chinese or Israeli ply due to quality issues.

BTW, I ended up using Sapele for the really hard bits (gunwale caps, skids) and I'm glad I did. Tough but easy to work with hand tools, does not split, looks beautiful. It is plentiful around here because it is popular for outdoor deck flooring. Should be even more plentiful where you are because it is almost local.

[Colin62]

Here in the States, I paid US$95/sheet for a mix of French and Greek 6mm Oukume ply, so your price looks good to me.

My dealer, whom I trust, said to stay away from Chinese or Israeli ply due to quality issues.

BTW, I ended up using Sapele for the really hard bits (gunwale caps, skids) and I'm glad I did. Tough but easy to work with hand tools, does not split, looks beautiful. It is plentiful around here because it is popular for outdoor deck flooring. Should be even more plentiful where you are because it is almost local.

I'm glad to learn that the price is in the same ballpark, and for the peace of mind, I'd far rather just get the French ply - the extra financial outlay is fairly trivial compared to the time and effort I'll be putting into the project.

[woodeneye]

I'm glad to learn that the price is in the same ballpark, and for the peace of mind, I'd far rather just get the French ply - the extra financial outlay is fairly trivial compared to the time and effort I'll be putting into the project.

I agree Colin. Your French Okoume ply is cheaper than ours, and this is probably due to the extra transport costs to Australia. As you say, The extra cost as a percentage of your build costs is well worth it.

I have also decided on the French made Joubert ply, which also comes with a guarantee.

[CCBB]

Hi Clint,
I completely agree with you and MIK about that simple and less expensive sail.
It's just my personal thing to have ordered this one and I really need to find out if it has been worth. Joost has a standard set-up with Duckworks sail and that has proven to work pretty well. Having seen that and listening to his experience I just try to get some improvement. A bit more profile in light winds and a bit more power tacking against waves. Next year we can compare and it will be fun to see any difference....if there is any :C

Definitely, I am interested in this sail. Please let us know how it works. Would be neat to borrow another Goat rig and try both "side-by-side".

Clint

[Watermaat]

Definitely, I am interested in this sail. Please let us know how it works. Would be neat to borrow another Goat rig and try both "side-by-side".

Clint

Joost lives close to me and we share e few sailing spots next year......so there will be lots of side-by-side tests, be shure :U

[Boatmik]

Here in the States, I paid US$95/sheet for a mix of French and Greek 6mm Oukume ply, so your price looks good to me.

My dealer, whom I trust, said to stay away from Chinese or Israeli ply due to quality issues.

BTW, I ended up using Sapele for the really hard bits (gunwale caps, skids) and I'm glad I did. Tough but easy to work with hand tools, does not split, looks beautiful. It is plentiful around here because it is popular for outdoor deck flooring. Should be even more plentiful where you are because it is almost local.

Howdie Paulie,

I am in Mystic tonight and going to Mystic Seaport tomorrow.

As far as choosing the ply - we have been stuck with only Chinese gaboon/okoume for a good few years now. The better suppliers try to make it work, but the OZ public have been getting what they asked for with the prices (and quality) going down and down. The good suppliers have been stuck with the bad stuff too but have filtered out the really bad stuff to ensure a supply of sorts.

Finally some European Okoume is making it to OZ too!

MIK

[woodeneye]

Finally some European Okoume is making it to OZ too!

MIK

Yes Mick, you're spot on.

You know, a recent trip to Tasmania taught me a valuable lesson. I needed a car at the airport, but was told there were none available, all taken, I was too late. I muttered that it was too bad as I needed one for 2 weeks. Well, suddenly they had one for me and I didn't even have to go to the carpark to find it. It was parked right outside the terminal by the delivery guy!

Suppliers can get the good EU Okoume if they really want to look after us. It's we the consumers who drive the market and we should not accept the unbranded rubbish. If the stock doesn't move they won't be getting any more of it in, simple as that. Yes, you may have to put your order in well ahead of time and it may cost more, but don't let anyone tell you the decent stuff isn't available. Just find the business that goes the extra mile for its customers.

[Colin62]

My GIS plans have had a small setback - the wife has found a Mirror hull in an indeterminate condition. It "needs work" so I shall assume that the work is going to be done by me.

We'll be off to Durban to have a look at it tomorrow afternoon. Once that is sorted out (hopefully some minor repairs and not a whole re-sand and re-paint job) I'll be able to get my GIS going. My plan is to put my annual bonus to good use and get started with that, so there's still a bit of time available to repair a Mirror and hone some of my skills.

Changing the subject slightly, does anyone know how many GISs there are out there?

[paulie]

I am in Mystic tonight and going to Mystic Seaport tomorrow.

I wish I'd checked in last night! I'm only an hour away and could have run up to meet you face to face. Too late now for me to change plans. Drat! I suppose it will be a long while before you are back in the neighborhood.

I love the Seaport. I hope you enjoy the visit. Sorry about the crappy weather.

PM me if you will be in the area another day. I'd love to meet up. And if you are heading south down the coast, you'll go right through town. Maybe you could see Ned Flanagan's completed GIS.

[CCBB]

Paulie, Ned Flanagan....is he involved in the Sound School...in New Haven. Someone tried to hook us up at one point because of our mutual interests.

If that is the same Ned and he built a GIS, we have even more in common!

Clint

[paulie]

Paulie, Ned Flanagan....is he involved in the Sound School...in New Haven.

Yup, that's the guy. I don't know him well, but my son, a student at Sound School, does. He finished his GIS this past summer.

You might also want to connect with Mike Dunn at the Eli Whitney Museum, also here in New Haven. Mike runs classes each summer where kids build small wooden boats of various kinds. My son built a 16' canoe there when he was only 13.

My dream is to get the Sound School and Eli Whitney behind some parent-child type classes. There are weekend boatbuilding classes in Mystic and Norwalk, but neither is convenient for a less-privileged family in New Haven, nor does either one target poorer families specifically. I'd love to fill the gap with something local. Ned and Mike have the chops; Sound School has the space; all we need is money.

[Boatmik]

Paulie, Ned Flanagan....is he involved in the Sound School...in New Haven. Someone tried to hook us up at one point because of our mutual interests.

If that is the same Ned and he built a GIS, we have even more in common!

Clint

And that is the exact problem with counting the Goat Island Skiffs. I did receive one or two emails saying that he was building - nice to have another one there!

[CCBB]

Glad I brought this back up, I need to call Ned.

Question: The plan shows a fair bit -- over an inch? -- of play between the width of daggerboard and width of inside trunk. I feel like that is too much. Is there some reasoning here or can we do something with maybe 1/2" play in the width. Thickness of board it 22mm, so maybe 25mm for trunk too allow for varnish and some play?

Cheers,
Clint

[woodeneye]

Glad I brought this back up, I need to call Ned.

Question: The plan shows a fair bit -- over an inch? -- of play between the width of daggerboard and width of inside trunk. I feel like that is too much. Is there some reasoning here or can we do something with maybe 1/2" play in the width. Thickness of board it 22mm, so maybe 25mm for trunk too allow for varnish and some play?

Cheers,
Clint

Hi Clint. I don't think that's right. Page 24 of the instructions mentions a gap of just 3-4mm extra to the width of your daggerboard, depending on whether you have the ply or staved version.

When the time comes for making my casing, I was just going to measure my finished board (including glass and paint) and add 3mm to make the spacers.

[BobWes]

When the time comes for making my casing, I was just going to measure my finished board (including glass and paint) and add 3mm to make the spacers.

I want to make that measurement, but I'm not sure how to do it. What technique did you use?

[woodeneye]

I want to make that measurement, but I'm not sure how to do it. What technique did you use?

I'll just apply one of my quick clamps loosely over the widest part and measure the distance between the jaws.

[BobWes]

M... I may be misinterpreting things.

I understood the info on page 24 to mean how thick the board is (approximately 22mm) and the spacers should be about 3mm thicker than that (approximately 25mm)

I thought Clint was asking about the width of the cneterboard and the fore-aft dimension (the width of the slot) matching the centerboard) of the case. My centerboard is 347mm wide, the slot in the case, as drawn on the Centrecase crawing, is more like 370mm.

What I was asking about is measuring the thickness of the centreboard. I don't have any quick clamps and the jaws on my bar clamps are not deep enough to get to the thickest part of the centerboard. Given the amount of play in the way the clamp operates, I'm not sure I'd trust that to measure within a mm or two.

I could probably measure the thickest spot at the of the board. I'll have to think about that...

[woodeneye]

M... I may be misinterpreting things.

I understood the info on page 24 to mean how thick the board is (approximately 22mm) and the spacers should be about 3mm thicker than that (approximately 25mm)

I thought Clint was asking about the width of the cneterboard and the fore-aft dimension (the width of the slot) matching the centerboard) of the case. My centerboard is 347mm wide, the slot in the case, as drawn on the Centrecase crawing, is more like 370mm.

What I was asking about is measuring the thickness of the centreboard. I don't have any quick clamps and the jaws on my bar clamps are not deep enough to get to the thickest part of the centerboard. Given the amount of play in the way the clamp operates, I'm not sure I'd trust that to measure within a mm or two.

I could probably measure the thickest spot at the of the board. I'll have to think about that...

You had me doubting me as well Bob, until I reread Clint's post:U

In respect of the fore and aft width of the casing though, it is good to have plenty of spare space so you can move the board fore and aft to help balance weather helm.

[woodeneye]

What I was asking about is measuring the thickness of the centreboard. I don't have any quick clamps and the jaws on my bar clamps are not deep enough to get to the thickest part of the centerboard. Given the amount of play in the way the clamp operates, I'm not sure I'd trust that to measure within a mm or two.

I could probably measure the thickest spot at the of the board. I'll have to think about that...

Hi Bob
Do you have an internal sliding door? Make sure the door is vertical. Slip the foil between the door and the jamb so that it stands vertically. Close the door and measure the widest gap recorded.

Might work to within a mm which is close enough. :;

[BobWes]

Bruce,

That is a very good and clever method for measuring the thickness of the centreboard.

Thanks.

[Far North lad]

G'day all,

Reading this thread from the start (it took a couple of days) was the final tick in the box when deciding to take the plunge and build a GIS. Having a helpful and freindly bunch of expert small boat builders out there like yourselves is very reasurring to a novice builder like myself.

I've just received the e-plans and am getting all the ducks line up (materials, epoxies, tools etc) before getting into the nitty gritty of building the GIS. :U

Does anyone out there know of any other NZ Goat Island Skiff builders/owners? There seems to be blokes from just about every other country that has decent sailing water building and sailing these very pretty boats.

while i'm here i thought i might throw out a quick question regards epoxy. I notice in the plans that Bote Cote epoxy is recommended if you don't want to have to deal with the waxy finish once the epoxy is cured. i've previously used two types of epoxy 1 - International HT9000 and 2 - Ados. of the two i found that the Ados didn't come up with a waxy finish once it was cured and was far easier to use where as HT9000 did cure with a wax finish. While International HT9000 is a reputable brand name in NZ i don't know if the Ados composite 4:1 resin (made by CRC) is or isn't when it comes to boat building. it's only about $90 for 5 litres so it's at least economical.

i'll keep the forum posted on how the build gets along, and no doubt i'll have other knowledge gaps that could endanger the quality of my build so will keep checking in from time to time.

cheers

Morrie

[woodeneye]

G'day all,

Reading this thread from the start (it took a couple of days) was the final tick in the box when deciding to take the plunge and build a GIS. Having a helpful and freindly bunch of expert small boat builders out there like yourselves is very reasurring to a novice builder like myself.

I've just received the e-plans and am getting all the ducks line up (materials, epoxies, tools etc) before getting into the nitty gritty of building the GIS. :U

Does anyone out there know of any other NZ Goat Island Skiff builders/owners? There seems to be blokes from just about every other country that has decent sailing water building and sailing these very pretty boats.

while i'm here i thought i might throw out a quick question regards epoxy. I notice in the plans that Bote Cote epoxy is recommended if you don't want to have to deal with the waxy finish once the epoxy is cured. i've previously used two types of epoxy 1 - International HT9000 and 2 - Ados. of the two i found that the Ados didn't come up with a waxy finish once it was cured and was far easier to use where as HT9000 did cure with a wax finish. While International HT9000 is a reputable brand name in NZ i don't know if the Ados composite 4:1 resin (made by CRC) is or isn't when it comes to boat building. it's only about $90 for 5 litres so it's at least economical.

i'll keep the forum posted on how the build gets along, and no doubt i'll have other knowledge gaps that could endanger the quality of my build so will keep checking in from time to time.

cheers

Morrie

Welcome Morrie:2tsup:

Michael Storer will know for sure, but I think you could be the first EnZedder to build a Goat. I have a brother in New Plymouth (races Paper Tigers) who is interested and would like to build one at some point.

Let us know what timbers you have chosen!

[Boatmik]

Howdy Morrie,

One of the real uses of this forum is to locate sources of materials in each country with advantages and and disadvantages. Your post about epoxy will be useful to someone along the line regardless of whether it is a Goat or not.

If you are interested and it feels right to you we can create a thread for you to write about the boat like some of the others are doing. No obligation.

Anything previously written can be copied over - so no probs if you want to write here then change your mind later.

There have been a couple of plans sold to New Zealand in recent years. However the plans purchasers have dropped off the radar as sometimes happens.

Best wishes
Michael

[Far North lad]

g'day Bruce,

thanks for the welcome. I am interested in using some of our native timbers as we've some good hardwoods. i'm tracking down and getting in contact with people in the NZ small boat building community to see if we do have anything strong, light and pretty enough to put into a skiff. Obviously NZ Kauri is pretty good, but i suspect it may be too heavy, not to mention very expensive these days as it's on the protected native timber list.

I've a bit of time to figure this out before i start the build. I've got to get rid of the John Spencer Cherub (a restoration projet) and the Farr 3.7 (completed restoration project) out of the garage to make space for the GIS. the woes of an enthusiest eh!

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

Softwoods, softwood and softwoods. Not really many places where hardwoods make a lot of sense. They are useful for the trailing edge blocks for the centreboard and rudder.

And that is about it. Softwoods are easier to glue and do the temporary screwing. Also keep the weight down.

Some Kauri would look very nice on a PDR :)

MIK

[Far North lad]

Hi Mik,

thanks for the steer on using softwoods, while i was mainly thinking of the gunwhales and the foils for the native hardwood i guess i had inadvertently started to think of it in relation to some of the other parts of the build aswell.

I'll let you know if i hear of any kauri exports to Aussie, you're right it would look very nice on a PDR.:;

regards

morrie

[Boatmik]

The hardwood would make the foils really hard work. Just a little bit on the trailing edges is fine, but through the body creates lots of shaping and weight problems.

MIK

[CCBB]

Choosing a softwood with nice consistent grain in cedar, pine, spruce, will make shaping less frustrating when, inevitably, one or two or more staves are glued with grain running the opposite way. I'd use a softwood for this characteristic alone, spruce and pine being the most planing friendly in my parts.

--Clint

[CCBB]

Did most folks glue up the bottom well before hand or did you wait until bottom was fit on boat and cut to the chine. I ask because if I glue the butt straps per MIK's instructions, with a gap on either side of centerline + 10mm, then the gap between butt strap and chine log seems like it may be bigger than indicated...what did folks get?

Clint

[BobWes]

I cut the bottom panels per the plans (outlined as dimensioned plus 20mm) and then did the butt straps per the plans. The butt straps wound up nearly flush with the chines.

[MiddleAgesMan]

I temporarily installed the bottom as separate pieces, cut per the plans and instructions. I then turned the hull over, slipped a wide board under the joint and propped up the ends so the joint was taking the weight in the middle. I then cut the butt straps (per the plans IIRC)l, laid in the thin resin and thickened mix and glued the straps in place using weights to assure a good joint. I then turned the hull upside down, released one end (removed the screws) and about a foot extra, then epoxied the two halves one at a time.

[paulie]

I glued the butt joins on both the bottom and the side panels ages before putting it all together. Cut everything per plans. Clearance between butt straps and chine logs is about 5ml on both bottom and sides; between butt straps and c'board case almost nil.

[woodeneye]

As Mick states in the plans, the length of the bottom butt straps depends on the width of your c/case. I was only just pondering this myself on the weekend, and now happened on this thread.

I think it might be a good idea to construct the centrecasing before joining the bottom as you'll get a better fit of the butt strap. Trimming the butt strap after it's glued in would be a real haemorrhoid. :doh: If it's a tad smaller though, I doubt that it's a big deal.

Fitting the bottom in two halves and fitting the butt straps afterward is a possibility, but I think this method is best left to experienced builders because the join is not on a bulkhead or frame. Mick's way of joining the two halves first will guarantee a nice fair bottom without kinks, and we know for sure this works 100% of the time.

It's easy enough to work out the width of your centrecase, ie.


twice the width of your c/case ply, plus
the width of your centrecase spacer (width of centre board + 2mm), plus
twice the width of your c/case cleat material


:;

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

The size of the centreboard case including the logs at the bottom is easy to calculate. The reason for there being not just one measurement is the series of options that were there originally.

You could use a Laser Centreboard, the timber strip board at 22mm thick before glass or the board made of three layers of ply. Also I have to allow for some variability in the centreboard case logs/cleats that hold it to the floor.

I think it is the only place you have a inside spacing on the boat.

However it is pretty easy to work out the size and add a little extra space for errors.

Almost everyone goes for the 22mm strip centreboard these days - a wise move as it is so robust and adds quite a bit to the efficiency.

So that means the case spacers have to the 25mm in the plan.
Add for the two ply case faces
Add for the two cleats
Add 5 to 10mm extra per side for some wiggle room.

Best wishes
Michael

[paulie]

I'm finally getting around to making my oars. Straight stock has been hard to come by around here and expensive when I can get it. There's a local mill which reclaims lumber out of barns and factories and re-saws it for flooring, etc. Lots of old-growth pine and fir timbers, some between 200 and 300 years old now, that they'll cut to any size I want. I assume that it is far too hard now to be of any use for bending, but would it make good oars? Or will it just dull my plane blade and tire me out?

[CCBB]

Paulie, pine would be fine...you can make the neck of the oar a little finer even if you go with pine. If you use old fir, you can bring the neck of the loom to a lesser diameter than on the plans. I think they are drawn at 1 1/2" D at the transition from loom to blade? You could go an 1/8" less with fir. Keep the looms large above the oarlock to help balance the oar.

[paulie]

Thanks! That sounds good. I'd love to use as much reclaimed lumber as I can. I've just heard people warn that it gets a little hard after being dry since 1750. But a couple of pieces for oars isn't much of a risk. I'll adjust the plans as you suggest and we'll see how it goes.

I have to admit that the warehouse at that mill is an amazing place. Species and dimensions you just can't find anymore. I could spend the day just wandering around.

[CCBB]

That sounds interesting. We have a place nearby that I think reclaims wood...I should check it out. Would be a neat way to build a traditional dory.

Clint

[john goodman]

There is a line drawing over on the Seawings website that shows what may be a GIS with outriggers (amas). Has it ever been done?

Goat Island Skiff (http://www.seawingboats.co.uk/Goat%20Island%20Skiff.htm)

[woodeneye]

There is a line drawing over on the Seawings website that shows what may be a GIS with outriggers (amas). Has it ever been done?

Goat Island Skiff (http://www.seawingboats.co.uk/Goat%20Island%20Skiff.htm)

It definitely isn't a GIS. The hull shape and bow are wrong. The image may be in the wrong place?

[Boatmik]

Yes it is. It is from my info about the drop in outrigger to show how it could just be OK for a narrow or small rowing dinghy.

MIK

[Jislizard]

A quick question for people who have bought the plans.

I am getting them but want to know whether to get the electronic version or pay for the hard copy.

If there are lots of colour photographs, or colour in general then I will buy them. If there are no photos and lots of line drawings I will go with the download.

Do you need to have the book open in front of you or laid out on the ground while you work or do you just read it online and then print out the page you need for that bit of the build?

If I buy the hard copy and cover it in epoxy can I get a back up? Does the hard copy come with a downloadable version?

Ideally I would like a downloadable copy now and a hard copy when it comes to the build, I could just point the monitor into the carport I suppose.

Thanks

Mark

[PAR]

I don't want to speak for Mik, but generally, you would be wise to make a "shop" copy of the plans. Typically this would include the construction drawings, sail and rigging plan, etc. Stuff like the materials list or epoxy use tips and tricks wouldn't need copying, as they would be "absorbed" in your growing information base about the build and referred to from time to time, but not necessarily at your side during the build, like the construction drawings are. A lot of people get the key drawings (construction, rigging, etc.) laminated in plastic sheeting. This can save some headache if you spill your coffee on one.

Of course these shop copies are to be used only in your work space and not distributed in any fashion.

[john goodman]

I ordered the pdf version of the plans, because I have the ability to print large format drawings here at the office. I have only printed (1) 8-1/2x11 set so far and I keep it in a 3 ring binder. There are only a few color pictures and would work in black and white too.

I call it my Instruction Binder. It stays with me out in the shop and I reference it all the time. I have put color coded tabs on the sheets I need to reference. There are some steps that require flipping back and forth between the instructions and the detail drawings.

I take it to the lumber yards too and use it as a shopping list and a point of discussion when it comes to wood types that are locally available.

I also am keeping a 2nd binder with tabs concerning topics and pictures, I call it Building Tips. I have found that as I read something in the forum of interest, I print it out then and there and add it to this 2nd binder. I have topic tabs for Building Tips, Rudder Hardware, Sails, Finishing and Construction Pictures. The pictures are of others GIS's at different stages of construction. This helps me visualize the instructions.

I also keep a few pictures of completed boats as inspiration. I have one here at the office and 1 in the shop.

Since I am building my GIS with my kids the pictures give them a great visual reference.

Don’t forget to build a scale model of the GIS before the real thing. It helped us a great deal in understanding the instructions and getting use to the Queen’s English, since we speak a different language over here in Texas.

Look for Texas GIS in the forum.

Welcome aboard!

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

John mentions "large format" which can make some of the drawing pages easier to read. But printed at US Letter or A4 they work fine too.

You don't need to print the whole plan necessarily - it is quite a bit of printer ink - but most of it will be some sort of reference during the build.

Perhaps the heart and soul of the thing is the appendices which introduce many methods and cautions.

Particularly for those who haven't worked with epoxy efficiently before. The appendices can potentially save huge amounts of epoxy, not to mention labour and heartache.

Best wishes
MIK

[Jislizard]

Cheers, I was mostly concerned with lots of colour photos that wouldn't come out in black and white. I have an A3 printer which I can use for the large diagrams and a laminator for the pages that are likely to see a lot of use or get soaked in epoxy/coffee.

I can get the printing done cheaply in black and white which will give me something to read in bed and something to annotate as I go along with the build.

Ebooks can be fantastic, especially when you add additional content like videos, audio files, hyperlinks etc, and as they are not for printing you can add hundreds of large full colour pictures of the design process, more of an e-encyclopaedia ! I don't think that will be necessary though as I have already seen sets of build pictures for 3 GISs already!

Cheers for the advice.

MArk

[Boatmik]

I have tried to set up the colour pictures so they come out OK in black and white, fiddling with the contrast etc.

Should work ok on most modern printers. I do have in mind that ppl will keep a copy of the PDF accessible on the computer so that the colour pics can be checked on the few occasions that something is a bit ambiguous.

MIK

[Boatmik]

For those with facebook ... a very nice set of videos from Mark Harvey in the UK.

Login | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/home.php#%21/profile.php?id=608029667)

He is flying the nice McNamara sail and the boat is being sailed by Chico Noelli - who is a Finn sailor.

You can see in the both the vids and the still pics the boat is in perfect trim. A bit more downhaul methinks, but that is the only flaw.

I don't know if the pics will work from facebook

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs809.snc4/68942_451520974667_608029667_5154455_7018967_n.jpg


http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs041.snc4/34396_451564974667_608029667_5155332_2936721_n.jpg
MIK

[woodeneye]

Tut tut, those woosie Poms with the padding on the gunwales... Must admit the thought has past my mind :D

Something else that I've contemplated is the rope traveller over the transom. This looks to be working quite well on Harvey's boat. I'd really like an adjustable traveller one day as my brother jury rigged one on mine and it made an enormous difference to our pointing ability. However, we decided that there were too many ropes around the tiller to make it safe, but relocating the traveller to the transom opens up possibilities. I might give that a try...

[Boatmik]

They just like their comfort.

"Built for comfort, not for speed" - doesn't need to be a compromise

[Boatmik]

Clinton Chase had his second yearly talk at his boatbuilding workshop in Portland, Maine last weekend.

Afterwards they went sailing - with a couple of dories and the Goat Island Skiff.

Now the Dories do have quite a bit of weight aboard and canoe sterned boats are often very good at maintaining good average speeds.

But the Goat does move on out. It is one of the boats with the white sail a bit further out - it is Christophe's boat that normally lives in New Hampshire.

You can see a gust approaching (dark shadow on the water) and before the gust hits the Goat is moving well ... and after ... it just moves on out.

YouTube - Fall sailing in Maine

Michael

[woodeneye]

Some time ago there was a guy building a GIS from the back of a van overlooking a great stretch of water. I can't find the thread. Anyone remember it?

Just wondering if he ever got it finished?

[callsign222]

This guy:

Planing Around (http://planingaround.blogspot.com/)

Haven't heard a thing, too bad, it looked like a beautiful project.

http://www.woodworkforums.com/f169/hello-new-gis-build-simon-st-pete-fl-92912/index11.html#post1121248

[SimonLew]

You guys must have some kind of amazing Goatdar for detecting building activity. Sorry for falling off the edge of the earth, or at least forum. Lots of crappy (mom passed away) and great (sister had a second baby) personal stuff plus tons of work travel got in the way of building all summer so the build got shelved. However it's looking like things are settling down a bit so this past weekend I organized the parts and restarted. Stay tuned I'm reviving the thread and build!

[woodeneye]

Welcome back Simon. Great to hear things are getting back on track and you're taking advantage of some remaining warmer weather.

[Boatmik]

Hi Simon, nice to have you round again.

Some good boatbuilding weather coming up, and we've all been doing a lot of learning about goats in the meantime too.

MIK

[BigGerman]

I know the plans call for 6mm ply, but I can get 5.2 mm oak plywood locally. Will it be thick enough for the GIS?

There are no 6mm marine plywood distributors near my little town. I'd have to order it and drive about 90 miles to ATL to pick it up. $64 a sheet, ouch!

Big German
Temple, GA USA

[callsign222]

Hi and welcome!

That is actually a good price for 6mm Okoume, here in New Hampshire it is about $115 a sheet, in neighboring Maine around $95. I bought mine in the summer of 09 for $59, so you're basically looking at prices that are almost two years behind schedule. If I was living there, I'd jump on it even though I'm not building a boat right now!

Can the ply be shipped? Several yards around here will ship for a nominal fee. There are also online providers you could peruse.

Make sure it's not cheap Chinese fake stuff though.

The plywood is but a small percentage of the cost of building the boat. Using the material called for in the plans will not only benefit your boat, but it will be an investment in its longevity. Why get a plywood that risks rot and/or delamination in a few years that will threaten the entire sum of money that you sunk into the project?

To be totally completely honest, if you want to find cheaper alternatives to the cedar framing, (like Doug Fir, or maybe Pine-- check with Mik on that one) that would be better than skimping on the plywood and you'd probably almost make up the difference since cedar is so darn pricey. Since everything is encapsulating with epoxy, the framing will be fine. You can't get in between layers of ply though.

You spent premium money on a set of plans that will deliver a capable, fast, lightweight boat that will last a long time if correctly built. You might as well make it worth your while!

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

I am not sure what sort of oak it is, but most are very heavy and some are very difficult to glue.

main problem is that the gaboon gives a boat that is not too hard for two adults to move around on shore.

an oak one might be up to 50 or 60% heavier.

best wishes
MIK

[SimonLew]

Be careful with cheap ply. I had an awful experience when I started building my GIS. I thought I got a great deal on some Okoume at about $60 per 4x8. It turned out to be China crap that had footballs in the outer veneers. The grain looked ugly, kind of like the cheap Louan at Home Depot. If you don't care about appearance or are planning to paint the boat inside and out then the cheap Okoume is probably OK. I ended up buying the French Joubert brand which is the real deal. It was $83 per sheet and is flawless. Well worth the extra $23 per sheet or $138 total for 6 sheets.

[john goodman]

GIR was weighed today. All up weight which includes everything to go sailing, all lines, pulleys, sails, battens, oars, rudder, daggerboard, tiller, and mizzen rig.

Yawl Rigged: 262lbs (119.09k)
Lug Rigged: 253.6lbs (115.27k)

Mizzen: mast, boomkin, sprit & lines: 8.4lbs (3.82k)
Oars: 9.4lbs (4.27k) 4.7lbs each. Is that a heavy oar?

So if I took the oars and mizzen rig off the boat I can get down to: 244.2lbs (111k)

Not bad for a 15'-6" boat!!!!!!:2tsup:

[woodeneye]

I've been meaning to ask this question for ages. What causes the hull to hum just before it planes? It's a definite harmonic rather than a vibration. Does anyone else have this?

I was wondering if it has anything to to with the squared off trailing edges on the foils?

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

It is likely to be the foils. You can often make it disappear by angling the trailing edge slightly - maybe 30 degrees rather than perpendicular to the centreline. It means the vortices coming of the trailing edge are likely to be out of harmony.

It could also be amplified by some other part of the boat having the same harmonic like the soundbox of a guitar.

MIK

[woodeneye]

Thanks MIK. The funny thing was that it wasn't evident today. I'll try moving the CB next time, although I don't have much room to play with as the case is pretty tight around the board.

[Old Yeller]

Hi woodeneye. Your reply suggests that maybe you misunderstook MIK. I think he was suggesting physically altering the trailing edges of your foils, rather than changing the orientation of your foils to the water.

It's often recommended to leave a square edge a couple millimeters wide on the aft edge of foils, rather than a sharp knife edge. I think what MIK is suggesting is rather than having that trailing edge face precisely square to the fore-and-aft axis of the foil, angle it to one side something like 30 degrees. So instead of a knife, it's somewhat like a very blunt edged chisel.

Just a guess. Right MIK?
Grant

[woodeneye]

Oh OK, yes I did get the proverbial cat by the tail didn't I? :doh:

[Boatmik]

Hi woodeneye. Your reply suggests that maybe you misunderstook MIK. I think he was suggesting physically altering the trailing edges of your foils, rather than changing the orientation of your foils to the water.

It's often recommended to leave a square edge a couple millimeters wide on the aft edge of foils, rather than a sharp knife edge. I think what MIK is suggesting is rather than having that trailing edge face precisely square to the fore-and-aft axis of the foil, angle it to one side something like 30 degrees. So instead of a knife, it's somewhat like a very blunt edged chisel.

Just a guess. Right MIK?
Grant

Spot on Grant,

The template and the foil thickness interact to give a slightly wider trailing edge on the centreboard - after all it is a cruising boat, not a delicate racer! The rudder trailing edge is unlikely to hit anything (it is a bit hard to back up at high speed) so it is close to widths you mention.

But like a chisel that is unbelievably blunt! Like 20 or 30 degrees off having a perfectly square trailing edge.

MIK

[woodeneye]

OK, another item added to the winter maintenance list.:wink:

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

The slanted trailing edge is a quick fix - just to put the harmonics out of phase.

I have noticed in the past that a non humming board can be turned into a humming board with a leading edge imperfection from bumping the board, so I would look at that too

MIK

[Boatmik]

Just to lighten up ... a video or two ... they have appeared one place or another in the forum already, but I was just reviewing to see if there were any more videos to add to
YouTube - boatmik's Channel (http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=boatmik#grid/favorites)

... and I saw this again. The camera boat is moving in the same direction hehe

YouTube - 100_0033.MOV

MIK

[Old Yeller]

While sailing with my Dad as a kid, when the centerboard would start to hum he used to say it meant we had everything working exactly right. An entirely self taught sailor, he might have actually believed it.

Whenever I've experienced that since, it always makes me smile. So unless it was a boat that would be racing, I might just hope that the board would keep humming. Thanks Dad!

Cheers, Grant

[Boatmik]

That's great, Grant! Made me laugh!

I remember being really excited that my first boat hummed!

[woodeneye]

My GIS would be good in a tune-up race :;

[BobWes]

What? The humming board slows the boat? Really? Enough to make a difference to anyone? Help me understand that.

[Boatmik]

Howdy BobWes,

Basically it is from the conservation of energy. Any extra swirls in the water from either a humming board or a boat that throws too much spray at speed or sitting too far back and dragging the transom to cause swirls behind the boat are evidence of energy that could be used for making the boat move forward. Flapping sails, bouncing around from pitching, having the rudder at too much angle to keep the boat going straight are others (though a 2 or three degrees of tiller angle to counter weather helm is not harmful and might help.

So that is the general idea.

There are a chain of specific effects if a foil hums. It is changing the angle of attack continuously - making it hard to get a smooth flow over the centreboard or rudder, the front profile of the board is increased, reducing performance downwind (the biggest determinant of downwind drag for foils is their frontal area and vibrating means the water sees the foil as wider than it is), also will increase the size of the eddies off the back. And reduce the chance of some smooth laminar flow in the front end of the board.

None of these are really quantified anywhere that I know of, but we know that they are bleeding energy away that could be used for driving the boat along. A part of it is psychological - if your boat is less than equal to the boats you are racing against (from your point of view - this is a very important aspect - see my article about sail racing mindset (http://www.storerboatplans.com/Faq/dinghyracing.html)). If there is some obvious defect and the other boats are ahead it becomes easy to blame the defect (rather than oneself!) even though it might only have a very minor effect.

I was once steering a rather quick 38 footer in a club race and there was a really bad spinnaker snarl up which meant we couldn't rehoist the jib when we headed upwind. The owner and everyone dropped the bundle and the boat went down to a couple of knots almost broadside to the wind. I just reset the traveller and mainsail as if it was a big Laser (or GIS) and we didn't lose a lot (we were doing 5.8 knots upwind against our normal target of 6.8 in that wind) against the other boats while the foredeck crew sorted out the prob.

So never ignore the importance of psychology!

Best wishes
MIK

[BobWes]

Thanks, Mik,

I understand what you are saying but I question whether anyone can really feel/tell any difference in boat speed with "humming" foils and without. Could be psychological - and I understand that.

How does one know whether the energy "wasted" on humming foils is being properly used when the foils are not humming? I mean, there are SO many variables (Bruce reports that the humming is not constant).

Seems the idea of developing one's skills is more important - or at least more effective - than intermittent idiosyncrasies of the boat (not that one wants intermittent idiosyncrasies in a boat). Which is what your article suggests.

[woodeneye]

Hi Bob, I'm really passed the point of worrying too much about my foils humming. I was more intrigued by its occurrence more than anything. :) That's right, it's not constant, so there are lots of things that must contribute. Perhaps it's just an extra cm of foil in the water, or a bit less vang, or something weird like that that causes the onset of the vibration. Anyway, I'm too old to spin out on stuff like that, but like you, I'm intrigued by it. :o

However, I'll likely go looking to fix it by the time the GIS "Worlds" comes around, hehe :U

Thanks MIK, that was an excellent run down on the things that can affect a boat's performance, and I'm really glad that you didn't leave out the skipper's head. My problem is that after 30+ years of no sailing, I'm relearning stuff that was in my head once upon a time, but it has decamped from the memory banks over the years. Every time I go out for a sail these days, I have an "Oh yeah, how come I forgot about THAT" moment!

[Boatmik]

Thanks, Mik,

I understand what you are saying but I question whether anyone can really feel/tell any difference in boat speed with "humming" foils and without. Could be psychological - and I understand that.

How does one know whether the energy "wasted" on humming foils is being properly used when the foils are not humming? I mean, there are SO many variables (Bruce reports that the humming is not constant).

Seems the idea of developing one's skills is more important - or at least more effective - than intermittent idiosyncrasies of the boat (not that one wants intermittent idiosyncrasies in a boat). Which is what your article suggests.

As a student of Yukkuri dozo this is consistent BobWes.

You are right - it is not quantified, but as a lazy sailor who likes to do well there are certain things that bug me. I know I can do a paint job for the bottom that will be good enough not to hold back my racing aspirations - so you won't find me cutting and polishing. But if a foil is humming a lot of the time it will bug me so I will fix it. Otherwise it will distract me at the wrong time, so I am thinking about the humming rather that sailing the boat well.

Even though not quantified I think it has a reasonably large effect in racing terms. It is probably less important than missing a couple of windshifts on the windward leg. So if someone doesn't know how to detect or react to windshifts, then that is more important than fixing the hum (unless it is a really bad chronic one.

But if you don't usually miss windshifts then fixing the hum might be sensible.

If it hums on a screaming downwind broad reach then it probably doesn't make a lot of difference either - because the boat already has more power than it can deal with, but if consistently humming on a particular point of sail most times I would have to do something about it.

Often with a well made foil it is something minor - like a leading edge blemish anyhoo.

Best wishes
MIK

[keyhavenpotter]

When making the foils for my Lymington Scow, the black one in the photo, I popped back to John Claridge to see if my foil shape was ok. He explained how important a thin aft edge was for the foil to prevent "humming". When the aft edge is too thick the water chooses to leave the foil from one side edge and then the other, causing the vibration.

Humming is ok, but a vibrating centreboard drives me crazy. I had this probelm on a Wanderer dinghy. Just when the boat picked up speed the vibration would start.

Back edge of foils under 3mm is my rule.

Brian

[Boatmik]

Howdy,

I've done a fair bit of mucking around with foils. A very wide trailing edge can create the humming that John talks about. However making lots of foils for different boats over the years I think that general symmetry and accuracy are more important.

But if they are pretty right then the trailing edge becomes the most dominant next factor.

For a racing boat I would agree completely with the under 3mm idea - probably shoot for a couple of mm - depending on the size for the foil - thicker foils for bigger boats - like a trailer sailor would be up around 4 to 6mm.

Basically have to think how thick the trailing edge has to be to avoid excessive maintenance. So I balance that with general efficiency.

The most single important things are to get the shape really perfect, using templates and the surface finish. Some boats here have done consistent research on foil shape (Frank Bethwaite's influence) and one counterintuitive result is that some theoretically incorrect shapes have done quite well in regattas. An example of this is using laminar flow sections instead of the NACA00xx series (turbulent flow) in foils that were both too short in chord and boats too slow upwind to get to the Reynold's numbers where the laminar flow sections would have any advantage.

However at that time these "incorrect" sections (but by no means bad sections) were made very accurately with very good finish. So my view is somewhat "real world" rather than theoretical. That a very accurate foilshape and surface finish is more important than the actual section providing you don't do anything silly.

That's why I use the "less efficient than NACA00xx" section. It loses efficiency because it is a little too thin - but it optimised to work close to its potential efficiency level. But it gains because it is so easy for an amateur to make with the template that the finish level will be better than a lot of manufactured foils - it doesn't roll around while being made and also the template use is much more intuitive.

The end result is that the "less perfect foil" is built to such a high standard compared to the ones usual in plans that the boat's performance jumps a great deal. The OzRacer/OzPDRacer is evidence of that - showing that foils and sails are much more important than hull shape - providing you don't do anything really silly with the hull.

Best wishes
MIK

[woodeneye]

Hi Mik

When I was solving the problem of my rudder kicking up I was beginning to think that maybe my rudder foil was a bit thick and was caused by drag, but you suggest here that your sections are if anything still a little thin!

A few weeks ago I was also comparing my blade with the Laser’s and those of other more modern boats such as the Tasar, which seem to be much thinner than mine for about the same chord length. Their blades are manufactured from glass or carbon and are produced in moulds, so they are also very strong given their thin sections. I’ve also read that thinner blades are more prone to stalling. I’ve never once experienced stalling with my blade, so it does work very well at very low speeds. Overall, it’s about getting the balance right for the use of the boat, and considering the materials they’re made from as well.

The foils on these high performance boats (and I’m including cats) are something else! They are so thin and have very small chord lengths as well. Naturally, the smaller they are the more astronomical the cost of them!

Problems with rudders seem to have plagued me all my sailing days. In my Dabchick days, I was always bending my rudder blades (in those days the class rules specified 1/8” alu plate) I also broke or bent pintle fittings regularly and eventually my dad had one of his apprentices make one from a monster ss door hinge. That one never broke!

But the biggest trouble I got into was in the Sprog class and me not checking the rules. I made a solid rudder blade from a lightweight Obeche timber plank, very similar to your section Mik, except I had the thickest part closer to the leading edge and it was 1”thick. Dad was an engineer, and he sketched a shape on some paper and I just planed it to that shape, approximately as best I could.

The first time I used it was at the Sprog Nationals in 1972 at Lourenco Marques (now Maputo). Launching the boat and sticking the wooden rudder on got me some weird looks, but it didn’t dawn on me that it was illegal. Then the rules said the blade had to be steel or aluminium plate and conform to a set template shape, and as well it had to lift up and down. Mine broke all those rules! However, we had a tune-up race on the first day. We were sailing off shore and we got the best of starts crossing the whole fleet on port tack (stupid really) and proceeded to pull away really easily. It was quite light wind of only about 8 knots. We won that race by more than a leg, so it was easily more than a km. All hell broke loose when the other boats arrived back and I had the class rules explained to me in no uncertain terms! So we had to put our old alu plate rudder back on for the rest of the regatta races. We still won, but it was close racing and the result went right down to the last race. Unfortunately for us, not enough boats turned up for it to qualify as a Nationals. We had something like 60 and there needed to be 75 boats, so it was disappointing. (Imagine that nowadays!) However, as a result of that regatta, we did get consensus from the Sprog members to change the rules and allow wooden foil sections on the rudders. But that regatta was my first experience of a foil shape and it did show me what a huge difference foils can make.

[bitingmidge]

Gidday all!

All things must come to an end it seems, and so it has come to pass that our circumstances are such that we must part with the GIS that started this thread!

For more information check this link. (http://www.woodworkforums.com/f225/goat-island-skiff-1-a-131597/#post1279077)

I think it's fair to say that this is a genuine reluctant sale, but the boat is in fine condition, ready to give many more years of enjoyment to another growing family!

Cheers,

P

[Boatmik]

B Hell Peter, Photos Photos!!!

The boat is in fine structural condition. All ropes and the sail are fine. It need a good rub back, a few small areas of epoxy retouch and a revarnish.

But you could go sailing tomorrow instead. But it will need work over winter.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/153/379090983_9beba07825_z.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/144/379091135_dac1a798cd.jpg

More pics than you can poke a stick at

here GIS Moderate Wind - a set on Flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/boatmik/sets/72157594516743453/)

and here GIS Moderate Wind - a set on Flickr (http://www.flickr.com/photos/boatmik/sets/72157594516743453/)

WAAAAAAH - he's selling my baby!

MIK

[bitingmidge]

Ahh thanks Mik, the photos are on the "for sale" thread, with the honest description of the state of the dear thing.

As Mik says perhaps one or two square inches on the boat could do with a coat of epoxy, otherwise it's remarkably lovely!

cheers,

P
:D

[arbordg]

Gidday all!

All things must come to an end it seems, and so it has come to pass that our circumstances are such that we must part with the GIS that started this thread!

For more information check this link. (http://www.woodworkforums.com/f225/goat-island-skiff-1-a-131597/#post1279077)

I think it's fair to say that this is a genuine reluctant sale, but the boat is in fine condition, ready to give many more years of enjoyment to another growing family!

Cheers,

P

Peter - tell me this is just a cruel hoax inspired by too many lime-infused adult beverages! You, sir, are an institution. The plankholder, as it were. And you promised your girls you wouldn't. You promised!

Oh, wait... does the boat come with that cute little wallaby in the frilly white hat that is skippering the boat in those fotos?

Seriously... I feel a disturbance in the Force!!

[bitingmidge]

Umm thanks David, you may have noticed the Force has been a little disturbed round here lately although I'm not sure it's all down to me!

It's a bit like Batman selling his Batsuit I guess, but when a government decides it wants one's boatshed more than oneself does, there's little one can do but dispose of its contents in a dignified and orderly manner!

Of course when one's boatshed is situated beneath one's living room, there are other consequences as well. I console myself with the thought that in a year or two, when we get the new house sorted, and have time to take a deep breath, there'll be another boat to replace the irreplaceable!

Cheers,

P :o

[IanHowick]

Hi Mik, how long till the 20th anniversary of the Goat Island Skiff Design? Biting Midge's GIS was built in 1994 from memory, but the design was out before then?

Ian

[arbordg]

Umm thanks David, you may have noticed the Force has been a little disturbed round here lately although I'm not sure it's all down to me!

It's a bit like Batman selling his Batsuit I guess, but when a government decides it wants one's boatshed more than oneself does, there's little one can do but dispose of its contents in a dignified and orderly manner!

Of course when one's boatshed is situated beneath one's living room, there are other consequences as well. I console myself with the thought that in a year or two, when we get the new house sorted, and have time to take a deep breath, there'll be another boat to replace the irreplaceable!

Cheers,

P :o

Peter,

A fella's gotta do what a fella's gotta do, I guess. I still find it disturbing. But, then, I'm a romantic and a sentimentalist. Couldn't you find her a nice home till the new place is ready? I know! You can drop it off here. I'll put it on a trailer, and you can stop by anytime you want and take her out! Conatrary to what Mik may have suggested, or other appearances... we're NOT prejudiced against tall people... or even architects :p There. See? All sorted. :rolleyes:

Bumptiously Yours,
David

[Boatmik]

You are really pushing the memory there! Peter or someone might have the original article in Amateur Boatbuilder magazine about exactly when it came out.

Looking at my file versions that have been shifted from computer to computer over the years and remembering that some of the early ones were victims of a diskcrash ...

The earliest text file is a wordperfect 6.0 file from 6 March 1995

And the earliest CAD file is a Generic Cadd file 13 June 1994. There is a Hullform file from the day before, but it is a taller version of the hull (more freeboard) and I can't remember whether that was me stooging around with another idea or from realising I could get more freeboard within the ply sizes.

But the first anyone knew about the boat was the article in Amateur Boatbuilder. Peter bought the first plan and launched his boat second.

MIK

Interestingly all the CAD files were called "BALLSxxx.GCD" as I thought the boat was going to be called the "Balls Head Skiff" because that is where I sat to watch the harbour when looking at the computer got too hard. But then I realised a much nicer name was right in front of me.

MIK

[bitingmidge]

Well a quick look through my impeccable files took me to a letter which began as follows:-


20th May 1994

Michael Storer Design,
7/25 Crows Nest Rd,
Waverton 2060.

Dear Sir,

SUBJECT: "Goat Island Skiff" Plans

Please find attached my cheque in the sum of $70.00 being payment for plans for your "Goat Island Skiff" design as described in Australian Amateur Boatbuilder, Winter 1994.



Bearing in mind that "Winter" here starts in June, you'd have to say I was pretty quick off the mark. So quick that the plans hadn't actually been drawn (see Mik's comment above). He assured me he wouldn't cash the cheque until he despatched them, and he didn't!

Mik wrote on the 1st June confirming further delay (no email back then you see), and the final details arrived around the 12th October. I'd built the model in the meantime while waiting. In those days I could build quicker than Mik could design! :D

The "red" boat was being built just ahead of mine as the plans developed by a chap on the Gold Coast, so I had a full sized model to work with as well.

Launch was on Australia Day (26th January) 1995.

Oh, and she's STILL FOR SALE!

This is someone's chance to be a part of maritime history... hurry sale ends soon! (It would be a pity to have to burn her!) :oo:

Cheers,

P

[Boatmik]

Ah .. I remember ... that was part of the learning curve of trying not to announce things before the plans were finished!

Problem is of course that all these things are so much fun to discuss!

MIK

[JJMc]

After some searching, I've found an indication that the GIS centreboard is 1.4 meters long. Anyone know the length below hull, or better yet, below waterline? In other words, maximum draft? We have some shallow lakes.
Thanks, Jerry

[davlafont]

JJMc: I have no actual answer, but I'm not afraid to answer a question with a question: would your lake(s) allow you to sail with the center board partially raised? Both the centerboard and the rudder can be adjusted with elastic shock cord (the rudder is actually designed with a shock cord retention system). If you can ONLY sail with two inches of foils, then you might be out of luck when the wind actually blows. But if you have varying depths and only need a shallow draught for certain conditions, you might find the GIS design to be just what you need.

[MiddleAgesMan]

Based solely on my very poor recollection I'd guess the draft with the board all the way down is about 30-32 inches. I never measured it, though. It might be a little less.

[JJMc]

Thanks guys. Looks like I'll be good, there are some 19' cabin boats on the lake-- with centerboards, so I'll just have to learn the shallow spots.
Jerry